NOW SORTED -Have a hankering for a good budget acoustic - suggestions?

Voxman

I'm really more of an electric player but I have a hankering for an acoustic. I have an old Yamaha FG140 that my daughter now has, and a Washburn EA30 Festival electro-acoustic that has a thinner body and so isn't that great pure acoustically.

If I had £300-400 to spend on a second-hand acoustic would that be enough to find a good, resonant acoustic with a good action and decently made? Electrics I know a reasonable bit about, but I'm less knowledgeable on acoustics.  What would you acoustic guru's recommend for finger picking stuff.  I'm not a great acoustic player but I'd like to get back into it - it would be for this type of playing:







 

markj

I would probably go along the Eastman route.

Voxman

markj said:

I would probably go along the Eastman route.

Thanks @markj - Any specific models you could specifically suggest?

BigPaulie

At £400 you're in the right ballpark for a used Yamaha LL6.
These are really nice guitars and the newer ones have A.R.E tops which is Yamaha's version of torrefication.
They cover just about any type of music from flatpicking to strumming to finger style.
And once they've undergone the initial depreciation from new seem to hold their value.

Voxman

BigPaulie said:

At £400 you're in the right ballpark for a used Yamaha LL6.
These are really nice guitars and the newer ones have A.R.E tops which is Yamaha's version of torrefication.
They cover just about any type of music from flatpicking to strumming to finger style.
And once they've undergone the initial depreciation from new seem to hold their value.

Many thanks for that - just watched a video & it sounds and looks really good with the extra of being able to plug it in too. The ARE treatment sounds really interesting and the 5 ply neck seems to be very stable.    

Voxman

The LL16M has maple back & sides which might be better & still achievable for £400 used?

BillDL

The problem with switching from electric to acoustic is that the action of most acoustics is going to be higher than you are used to, especially if the guitar is set up for fingerpicking that plucks the strings and tends to make them vibrate in a much more vertical way than picking across the strings with a plectrum (there, I used that old fashioned word).  In addition, acoustic strings are invariably thicker than electric strings.  I would say that a low action should not necessarily be one of your primary considerations when looking for an acoustic.  An acceptable action most certainly, but as most electric players have discovered while trying to shave down an acoustic saddle to get a more slinky action, they will very often end up with fret buzz before they get to where they would ideally like it to be.  When you look at the holy grail "Martin Specs", the action might feel unacceptably high for somebody transitioning from electric to acoustic.

Decide on your preferred body size and shape.

• Jumbo - Very large body with booming sound, but too unweildly for many players.
• Dreadnought - The size and shape we are most familiar with.  Nice and loud for strumming and picking and easier to hold than a jumbo, but some people still find the body quite large to handle.
• Grand Auditorium - Almost as large as a dreadnought, but with a narrower waist.  Still fairly loud.  Ideal compromise for strumming and picking when combined with comfort.
• "Concert" Size - sometimes called "Orchestra" style or "OM" from Martin's way of cataloguing its models.  Slightly smaller bodied than the "Auditorium" type but has more pronounced upper and lower bouts with a pinched-in waist.  This size and style suits just about anybody.  It is much easier to hold than a dreadnought.  It may not be as loud or boomy as a dreadnought, but it seems to have a bit more finesse when fingerpicked.
• From there on down in body size you have "000", then "00", and then the very narrow and small bodied "Parlour" style, as well as the reduced scale "Baby" models as played by ed Sheeran.

Once you have decided on a shape and style you can look at the woods used.  You get a much purer tone from a guitar that has a solid wood top than a laminated one, although there are many exceptions to this "rule".  Spruce, cedar, maple and mahogany all have quite different sounds when used for a guitar top.  Cedar tends to be used more on classical guitars and higher end "fingerpicking" guitars in the "Concert" or "OM" style than on other styles and shapes.

Although some resonance is created by the sides and back of the guitar, having solid wood for these is less important than having a solid wood top and it keeps the price down.  Laminated back and sides are also tougher and less prone to cracks if knocked against something.  Again, mahogany, rosewood, walnut, and other woods used for the bodies and sides do sound different, with none necessarily being better than the other.

Unfortunately choosing a 2nd-hand acoustic to match your £300 to £400 budget isn't nearly as easy as making suggestions for a new guitar.  If you are willing to accept a lot of dings and scratches you can obviously get a much better quality guitar than if you prefer to buy a guitar in good cosmetic condition.  Some of the Tanglewood guitars from the top of their price listings when new can be bought for around your budget and I would urge you to consider that brand while looking, because they are very nice guitars.

Voxman

Many thanks @BillDL - lots of good info there. To clarify, and with all appreciation of your kind & detailed response, I'm not a complete acoustic novice in that I do understand the different body shapes and the pros/cons of laminate sides, and the Yamaha LL6 is the right shape I'm after, which is similar to my Yamaha FG140. I have a good friend of mine that is an acoustic folk player and some years back we used to play together, and he has 2 Martin's that I've played a fair bit.  

I'm simply just well out of touch with the makes and quality currently available.  And, arguably even more important than for electrics, with an acoustic I'm going to have to play it & hear it first so probably won't look to buy used on EBay etc.    

I have played acoustic for many years and played in a number of folk clubs but haven't really done much acoustically over the last 7-8 years or so (hopefully my clips here weren't too shabby) so I fully appreciate the action will be higher than on an electric. I also use slightly heavier 'bronze' strings on my acoustics (typically Martin lights 10-47) as compared to 9-42's on my electrics, so of course the action has to be higher to resonate properly, but I still need it low enough for eg jazzy/bluesy stuff too with a pick.  Must admit I'm not a fan of Tanglewood - I've played a few and never really got on with them.  Having said that, the newer ones might be much improved so I will keep an open mind here. 

RevMatt

Faith would be worth a look in that price range, they punch above their weight, and there's the Patrick Eggle link ..

Andy79

How about this, good price too

https://www.thefretboard.co.uk/discussion/215727/yamaha-ll6-electro-acoustic-now-reduced-350#latest

Voxman

Andy79 said:

How about this, good price too

https://www.thefretboard.co.uk/discussion/215727/yamaha-ll6-electro-acoustic-now-reduced-350#latest

Thanks @Andy79 but over 100 miles away from me so sadly not practical. 

BigPaulie

Voxman said:

The LL16M has maple back & sides which might be better & still achievable for £400 used?

If you can find any iteration of the ll16 for £400 you should jump at it.

proggy

Sigma make very good solid top guitars in your price range. If you're looking for a nice guitar for finger style playing, check out their OM size models, they have a slightly wider string spacing for picking, and the smaller bodies make them really comfortable to hold.

Tannin

A hundred miles not practical? What a strange thing to say! Oh well, we all have our little ways.

What else can we do in the £400 price range? Second-hand is the way to go, but it is hard to find stuff local to you (and while I reckon you are nuts not to drive 100 miles to pick up a great guitar for a good price, travelling any sort of distance just to try a few random things out - things you may or may not like - is a different matter). 

So that leaves new, and new in that price bracket means made somewhere cheap, typically China. The question thus becomes "Which company does a decent job of making cheap stuff in China?", and the obvious answer is "Yamaha". But you might also look at Sigma, Eastman, and one or two others. I notice a lot of variation between individual guitars in this bracket, even more so than there is in (say) the £1500 range models. I think you just have to play them until you find one you like.

RevMatt

Tannin said:

A hundred miles not practical? What a strange thing to say! 

In theory a 4 hour round trip to see a guitar sounds fun, and there was a time when I would have relished the roadtrip. But I totally get where Voxman is coming from - with a busy and stressful day job and family commitments once the paid work is done 100 miles for a guitar isn't an easy thing to manage.

Voxman

RevMatt said:

Tannin said:

A hundred miles not practical? What a strange thing to say! 

In theory a 4 hour round trip to see a guitar sounds fun, and there was a time when I would have relished the roadtrip. But I totally get where Voxman is coming from - with a busy and stressful day job and family commitments once the paid work is done 100 miles for a guitar isn't an easy thing to manage.

This!

Andy79

Take the 140 back from your daughter… A shitty move but it’s a great guitar. I bought a ‘69 FG300 for £400. Over the moon ever since 

Voxman

Andy79 said: 

Take the 140 back from your daughter… A shitty move but it’s a great guitar. I bought a ‘69 FG300 for £400. Over the moon ever since 

A sound idea sir!    To be honest I don't think she plays it much and a while back she did ask if I wanted it back. But whilst it's a reasonable guitar and about 20 yrs ago I replaced the 3 in line cheap tuners with Schallers, it's action is a tad high and tonally it's a bit bottom end heavy and lacks some top end sparkle. In truth, I'd like something thats more resonant and feels a bit more special that will encourage me to play it. 

The more I watch vids and read about the Yamaha LL6, the more I think it could be exactly what I'm looking for, especially as it can be plugged in too. 

Mellish

Here's a few to look at: Fender FA-125CE, Yamaha FSX800C, Seagull S6, Martin LXK2, Fender Squier Dreadnought  

guitarjack66

Tannin said:

A hundred miles not practical? What a strange thing to say! Oh well, we all have our little ways.

What else can we do in the £400 price range? Second-hand is the way to go, but it is hard to find stuff local to you (and while I reckon you are nuts not to drive 100 miles to pick up a great guitar for a good price, travelling any sort of distance just to try a few random things out - things you may or may not like - is a different matter). 

So that leaves new, and new in that price bracket means made somewhere cheap, typically China. The question thus becomes "Which company does a decent job of making cheap stuff in China?", and the obvious answer is "Yamaha". But you might also look at Sigma, Eastman, and one or two others. I notice a lot of variation between individual guitars in this bracket, even more so than there is in (say) the £1500 range models. I think you just have to play them until you find one you like.

I know you are based in Australia my friend and 100 miles is basically your next door neighbour over there but travelling 100 miles on UK roads or by public transport is a military operation. Terrible roads and traffic hold ups make even the smallest journey a complete ball ache. I dread to think what its like in London and its surrounds as its bad enough here 'ooop north.'

markj

Voxman said:

markj said:

I would probably go along the Eastman route.

Thanks @markj - Any specific models you could specifically suggest?

I had a E1SS that was superb. It featured all solid wood construction using airondack spruce top and mahogany back and sides . It was similarish to a J45. Look at Richards Guitars website he usually has a good choice at various prices.