Midi Keyboard to PC & Cubase Problem

Chris.B

I would really appreciate any suggestions with the following issue.

Cubase Elements 11, Dell laptop (I7 &16GB Ram)  MIDI connection to an ancient Yamaha PSR-500 keyboard.

The interface is a cheap and nasty Ebay special:

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/26501157720

Cubase can "see" the Yamaha and using something like Halion Sonic SE plug-in I can play some notes using the Yamaha. The problem is that very quickly some notes stop playing, only one note of a chord plays or some keys stop responding completely etc. 

The on-screen keyboard display in Halion Sonic SE, shows that some keys appear to be stuck down.  

When a key is pressed on a "faulty" note, the midi data indicator in Cubase does not light up.

I know it is impossible to give a proper diagnosis from the above, but could the cheap and nasty interface be the cause of the issue?

Any suggestions of potential causes or diagnostic processes would be much appreciated. As you can tell from the above, I know nothing about midi - this is my first attempt to use it. 

Thanks,

Chris
 

TheBigDipper

The link to eBay isn't showing an item any more, so I can't see what your audio interface is..

I'm sure you know this, but to just in case:

A MIDI keyboard is a device for generating MIDI commands and sending them to a software product (running inside some form of hardware) so a sound can be produced. In your case, you press a key on the keyboard and Cubase will record the MIDI command being sent from the keyboard. When you play the MIDI track back using Cubase, the plugin you're using will run the software that makes the sounds. You can also use Cubase to monitor what the plugin in doing (and hear the music) as you record it. 

BTW, does the keyboard support MIDI over USB or is it old enough that it's just a 5-pin DIN socket for the MIDI Out and you are connecting the MIDI cable to your (whatever it is!) audio interface and that is sending it to your PC via USB? If it supports MIDI over USB then you should be able to bypass the audio interface and plug straight in.

But, it looks like your plugin is seeing the keyboard, as some keys work and other do not. I'm going to suggest that the keyboard is likely to be the cause of problem. If you set up a Cubase session to record a MIDI track you should be able to test out every key on the keyboard and see Cubase record them in the MIDI region you're creating. I don't know Cubase, but I'm assuming that it has a MIDI editor so you can inspect the results and see what you got, 

Swapping it our for a cheap 25key MIDI keyboard would also test that theory. Or if you could download a free MIDI trace app so you'd be able to see what MIDI commands are being sent by the keyboard - but you should be able to do it just with Cubase, I suspect. 

I'm a Mac guy, so I can't suggest anything by name, sorry. But I'm suspecting the keyboard needs a service or repair. 

Chris.B

@TheBigDipper may thanks for taking the time to write a helpful reply.

Cubase and the plug-in are functioning and I can change the sound from a piano to organ etc. within the plug -n, hence suspecting that the problem lies with the interface or keyboard.

The Yamaha keyboard has 2 pin DIN connectors and the interface is just a cable with a small box where the conversion to USB takes place - what can I expect for £10.

I will do some more experimenting with recording a midi track without a plug in and see what that reveals.

Thanks again for your help.

goldtop

Does it work OK if you just unplug the cable from the keyboard's MIDI In socket?

If so, set your keyboard so that 'Local Control' is off. If your keyboard doesn't have the option of switching off Local Control, then the alternative solution is to set Cubase to NOT act as a MIDI Thru (where it immediately sends data received from the keyboard back out to the keyboard). 

Chris.B

@goldtop I've not tried disconnecting the MIDI in to the keyboard. If I can get a break between the domestic stuff over the next couple of days I will try your suggestions, although I don't think the Yamaha offers any MIDI parameter changes - it's plug it in and that's your lot, but I will try to find a manual for it.  

Thank you for taking the time to make some helpful suggestions - much appreciated. 

If nothing else, it's interesting to dip my toe into the MIDI waters!

I will try yours and The Big Dipper's ideas and will report back ASAP. 

goldtop

Good luck. It can be that you have a MIDI loop, which is creating overlapping note-on and note-off messages and that is what is making the keyboard trip up.

Chris.B

Unfortunately it removing the MIDI in to the keyboard didn't give me the quick fix that I hope.  I've tried a couple of different VSTs and they all have the same effect. 

My next step will be to take the laptop and interface to my Dad's place. He has more modern keyboards that will allow me to prove whether it is the old Yamaha or the cheap interface.

Thanks @goldtop and @TheBigDipper for the helpful suggestions.  

The project started as having a keyboard set up for my Dad to play with and explore VSTs whilst he stayed with us for a couple of days over Christmas.  We didn't get it working properly but I have found it an interesting project and one way or another I will get  it working.

Chris.B

It has taken a while but I finally have a resolution. 

MIDI-OX showed erratic and streaming responses to a keypress on the Yamaha keyboard .

I tried the interface on another keyboard, the symptoms were similar. so ruled old the old Yamaha, leaving me to decide whether it was the interface, my laptop or something I was doing wrong in Cubase. 

Trying another PC with a different DAW (a free version of Pro Tools) still didn't work, different symptoms but clearly something wrong. 

The next step was to try a Helix as the interface, that was very odd, it still didn't work and seemed to make the Helix a little slow to respond, despite trying every permutation of MIDI options in the global settings.  

By this time I was fed up with it and put the project to one side, fast forward a few months and decided to bite the bullet and buy a "normal" interface.  

Plugged in an M- Audio 192-6 and everything just worked.  The old Yamaha happily plays VST effects in Cubase.

The moral of the story is don't buy a very cheap audio interface.  I've no idea why the Helix would not work, it should be fine, lots of people online saying it worked ok, but also quite a few people saying they have problems when using it as a MIDI keyboard interface.

The M-Audio is a relatively cheap interface at about £102 to £110, but it seems to be well made, feels like good quality controls etc. There is no noticeable latency when playing my guitar through it - my ancient PC would be the bottleneck if there was any noticeable latency.