Capos and Barre Chords

spev11

Sorry if this is a daft question, I'd say I'm a confused beginner/average guitarist (some stuff I find easy , other stuff not so) I rarely use a capo ( i've only ever used it to not have to barre) but I'm learning a song that uses entirely Barre Chords but all the online music I find for it calls for a Capo at the 2nd fret. Surely if I'm playing Barre chords it negates the Capo ? (it sounds like it to me but I know my tinitus riddled ears are probably not helping)
  

Stuckfast

If literally all the chords are barre chords then yes, the capo is irrelevant. But it's nice to be able to throw in an open chord every so often just to give your left hand a rest...

spev11

I’m glad It wanst me, thought I was going bonkers
ta

JerkMoans

Unless it's something about the capo changing the tone or some equal lunacy.  I'm sure there's a few Big Star songs that require on to tune the guitar down a few steps, and then capo it, which always seemed slightly Hornchurch to me...

BillDL

The benefit you have with a capo and "open chords", rather than tying up all your fingers with barre chords, is that you have more freedom to play some wee frilly bits or moving bass lines with your spare fingers.  Many years ago I cut out some bits of the rubber on two old capos so the strings weren't being fretted by the capo at those points, and was able to create open tunings without actually retuning the guitar.  I can't for the life of me remember where I made the cuts on each of the capos or what the resultant tunings were, but I would guess that there will now be some commercial products that allow you to do much the same.

viz

Brilliant idea!

Danny1969

I hate capo's ... detest them. If I have to do a song thats capo'ed I normally work out a way of doing it without using one. I get it makes some things easier but you lose all your normal harmonic positions which annoys me. I have a good bar-ing technique and can play things like Hotel California on a 12 string and What difference does it make without a capo. 

drofluf

BillDL said:

The benefit you have with a capo and "open chords", rather than tying up all your fingers with barre chords, is that you have more freedom to play some wee frilly bits or moving bass lines with your spare fingers.  Many years ago I cut out some bits of the rubber on two old capos so the strings weren't being fretted by the capo at those points, and was able to create open tunings without actually retuning the guitar.  I can't for the life of me remember where I made the cuts on each of the capos or what the resultant tunings were, but I would guess that there will now be some commercial products that allow you to do much the same.

@BillDL what you're thinking of is a "Partial Capo" like this https://www.amazon.co.uk/Shubb-C7B-Partial-Guitar-Capo/dp/B000BWBY2U/ref=asc_df_B000BWBY2U/?tag=googshopuk-21&linkCode=df0&hvadid=310913384056&hvpos=&hvnetw=g&hvrand=8208511563001376435&hvpone=&hvptwo=&hvqmt=&hvdev=c&hvdvcmdl=&hvlocint=&hvlocphy=1006976&hvtargid=pla-440744829734&psc=1&th=1&psc=1

Alternatively you can just use a mandolin capo

BillDL

@drofluf ;;; Yes, I've seen those partial capos before, but that's not quite what i was trying to describe.  If you will excuse the quick and crude image "editing" with total lack of perspective (mspaint.exe), I actually sliced out gaps in the rubber.  I can't recall what string spaces I sliced out the gaps for, or as I mentioned I cannot recall what tunings I was trying to get or managed to get, so the image is just to illustrate the concept.  Incidentally, the cheap and light d'Addario/Planet waves NS Capo Light is my choice of capo.  They are cheap enough to have lying around and in a few acoustic gig bags I use, so I am never without one just in case.  I probably use them more for checking neck relief than for playing though.

CaseOfAce

OP - What's the song you are working on? Without knowing that can't give an answer here.

Personally I think capos are a necessary evil.
There's some songs that absolutely require a capo - try playing Midnight Rambler without capo-ing at the 7th fret like Keith.
There are other songs where I capo cos that's the way I learnt the chords to suit the vocalist and too lazy to learn it otherwise.

the biggest problem with using capos is remembering where to place it for the song - it's very easy to get it wrong (2nd or 3rd fret? erm..) - and if you do get it wrong it's a train wreck.

Saw John Denver on the telly the other month and he was shifting a capo back and forth on his 12 string all night long and I thought how does he remember all that..?!

Stuckfast

@BillDL there's a thing called the Spider Capo that is like an adjustable version of what you're describing. It has separate 'fingers' for each string which can either be up or down. It does work but it's quite fiddly.

As someone who's mainly an acoustic player these days I probably use a capo 70 percent of the time. Partly it's about putting the song in the right key for the voice, but it also changes the sound of the guitar in a way that I often like.

BillDL

Thanks @Stuckfast ; That's the same concept, only more versatile than having to have several butchered capos for different tunings.  I've never seen that before, probably because it never really took off other than as a novelty stocking-filler.  As Guitar Player Magazine remarked, it is a "Monstrous" thing though

EricTheWeary

Yes, if there are no open strings then a capo is pointless.

The only person who comes to mind who I like who is a regular capo user is Jimmy Vaughan. Something he started to do later in his career to move open string licks into different keys, so very much not a cheat as some people see them. 

BillDL

Albert Collins is another guitarist that consistently used a capo on his Telecaster.

BenSirAmos

In a sense, the capo is irrelevant and I wouldn't use it for a song that only used barre chords.

However, using a capo does have the effect of lowering the strings (i.e. lowering the action) so that the barre chords are not such a strain on the hand. I did this for a while with 'Moondance' when I first switched over from mainly electric to mainly acoustic - the barre chords are not very difficult but I was getting cramp in my hand from all that chord work around the fifth fret and I'd stick on a capo randomly around the third fret to ease the cramping. 

Roland

If you are playing a finger picked piece, and need to change key for the singer without changing the inversion, then a capo aloes you to still play the twiddly bits with spare fingers. 

@spev11 ;The problem with many internet transcriptions is that they’re written by people who only know a few campfire chords (open chord shapes). To play along with the record they achieve the song’s original key by using a capo. 

ElectricXII

Danny1969 said:

I hate capo's ... detest them. If I have to do a song thats capo'ed I normally work out a way of doing it without using one. I get it makes some things easier but you lose all your normal harmonic positions which annoys me. I have a good bar-ing technique and can play things like Hotel California on a 12 string and What difference does it make without a capo. 

I depped for a band on Saturday night, and had to play Honky Tonk Women in A, so I used a capo at the second fret. My God did I make a hellish mess of it!

guitarjack66

I capo all the time on acoustics as my hybrid playing position makes the first couple of frets difficult to stretch to on a regularly scaled guitar. Mr Glen Campbell was a fan so who am I to argue?

spev11

Sorry in work and not had a chance to reply, Graham Coxon Bittersweet Bundle of Misery , its fairly straightforward so I can't see the need for the capo , wanted confirmation really.
I get using a capo to shift open chords to allow the little added bits for more interest, which is when I do use it a little bit. 
 Just seemed a bit counter productive on something like that.
But ta for all the replies, as always its a great help.

EricTheWeary

There are some live versions on YouTube and he does seem to consistently use a capo at the 2nd fret for that song. First online tab I found does use those open strings as well. 

ESBlonde

Capo and barre chords are both very valid, as the player the choice is yours. Some view a capo as a cheat, others change key to suit the vocalist on the hoof. When you are experienced you can do either but acoustic guitars with heavy strings and higher actions might dictate use of a capo.