PA, Mixer The Whole Lot.

TeleMaster

We need a new PA, Mixer etc.

The person who owned it isn't in the band now and we need to buy the whole set up. I don't know a huge amount about them really so if anyone has any suggestions I'd be most grateful. 

The last one we had was a RCF Digital M18 which was great (when it worked), with a couple of RCF speakers. The issue I had with these items were that the wireless router was useless and we had to buy a seperate router and it was just a nightmare at times when it went wrong.

I'm looking for an analogue mixer with some decent speakers. Ideally it has lots of inputs, options to send to monitors and simple to use, but quality vocal effects. If there is an option for on board guitar processing to use in an absolute emergency that would be an added bonus.

Money is not an obstacle (within reason) but for a complete set up approx £1200 would be what we're looking at. 

Thanks a lot. 

Whistler

I have heard a number of times from people that have digital rack mixers that need a tablet to mix that the onboard router is not reliable. All of them have had to buy an external router.

Stratavarious

We use a Soundcraft UI24r.. browser based control and you can connect a laptop directly using RJ45 cable to eliminate drop out risk.. or just a mouse and cheap screen will work too .. has options then for mixing from front and individual monitor mixes. We have had the dropped connection issue at a few gigs though but the network cable and screen/mouse options sort that.

It also has Digitech amp sims built in too..  just using the cab sim can tidy up an amp DI nicely and will take pedals for an amp emergency at a gig.

Best digital wireless mixer in that price range IMHO.

For old school desk,,,, I do really like my Soundcraft 22MTK which has plenty of channels, several Auxes, good fx and will also work as a 22 way audio interface to multitrack gigs to any connected laptop.

RCF speakers are good.  Altos have proven reliable and very clear and loud too.  Bit cheaper… might let you get a nice sub.

Another good value mixer is the Yamaha MG series.  MG16XU maybe?  Bombproof build, good fx.  

These are all ones I’ve gigged extensively and done small festival sound with.

TeleMaster

Whistler said:

I have heard a number of times from people that have digital rack mixers that need a tablet to mix that the onboard router is not reliable. All of them have had to buy an external router.

It is was a disaster. We had to use a cheap backup that the bassist had for emergencies with like 2 mic inputs or something. On one gig someone in the audience had the app on their phone and was just able to log in to the app and mess around so we just had to buy an external router. Just more stuff that can go wrong.

Stratavarious said:

We use a Soundcraft UI24r.. browser based control and you can connect a laptop directly using RJ45 cable to eliminate drop out risk.. or just a mouse and cheap screen will work too .. has options then for mixing from front and individual monitor mixes. We have had the dropped connection issue at a few gigs though but the network cable and screen/mouse options sort that.

It also has Digitech amp sims built in too..  just using the cab sim can tidy up an amp DI nicely and will take pedals for an amp emergency at a gig.

Best digital wireless mixer in that price range IMHO.

For old school desk,,,, I do really like my Soundcraft 22MTK which has plenty of channels, several Auxes, good fx and will also work as a 22 way audio interface to multitrack gigs to any connected laptop.

RCF speakers are good.  Altos have proven reliable and very clear and loud too.  Bit cheaper… might let you get a nice sub.

Another good value mixer is the Yamaha MG series.  MG16XU maybe?  Bombproof build, good fx.  

These are all ones I’ve gigged extensively and done small festival sound with.

The Soundcraft sounds like a decent option if it is actually reliable but the rack mounting is a bit of a no go I think.

I'll check out the MG stuff, thanks  

Stratavarious

TeleMaster said:

Whistler said:

I have heard a number of times from people that have digital rack mixers that need a tablet to mix that the onboard router is not reliable. All of them have had to buy an external router.

It is was a disaster. We had to use a cheap backup that the bassist had for emergencies with like 2 mic inputs or something. On one gig someone in the audience had the app on their phone and was just able to log in to the app and mess around so we just had to buy an external router. Just more stuff that can go wrong.

Stratavarious said:

We use a Soundcraft UI24r.. browser based control and you can connect a laptop directly using RJ45 cable to eliminate drop out risk.. or just a mouse and cheap screen will work too .. has options then for mixing from front and individual monitor mixes. We have had the dropped connection issue at a few gigs though but the network cable and screen/mouse options sort that.

It also has Digitech amp sims built in too..  just using the cab sim can tidy up an amp DI nicely and will take pedals for an amp emergency at a gig.

Best digital wireless mixer in that price range IMHO.

For old school desk,,,, I do really like my Soundcraft 22MTK which has plenty of channels, several Auxes, good fx and will also work as a 22 way audio interface to multitrack gigs to any connected laptop.

RCF speakers are good.  Altos have proven reliable and very clear and loud too.  Bit cheaper… might let you get a nice sub.

Another good value mixer is the Yamaha MG series.  MG16XU maybe?  Bombproof build, good fx.  

These are all ones I’ve gigged extensively and done small festival sound with.

The Soundcraft sounds like a decent option if it is actually reliable but the rack mounting is a bit of a no go I think.

I'll check out the MG stuff, thanks  

You can get a 4u plastic rack case for it… hold extension cable, tablet/phone charger

It is also a handy format as you can use it as a stage box mid stage for everyone to plug into which makes setup quite neat and quick.

The_Bri_Minister

TeleMaster said:

We need a new PA, Mixer etc.

The person who owned it isn't in the band now and we need to buy the whole set up. I don't know a huge amount about them really so if anyone has any suggestions I'd be most grateful. 

The last one we had was a RCF Digital M18 which was great (when it worked), with a couple of RCF speakers. The issue I had with these items were that the wireless router was useless and we had to buy a seperate router and it was just a nightmare at times when it went wrong.

I'm looking for an analogue mixer with some decent speakers. Ideally it has lots of inputs, options to send to monitors and simple to use, but quality vocal effects. If there is an option for on board guitar processing to use in an absolute emergency that would be an added bonus.

Money is not an obstacle (within reason) but for a complete set up approx £1200 would be what we're looking at. 

Thanks a lot. 

Hope you don't mind the shameless plug, but I've got an RCF E16 under the bed in the spare room which needs to go - it was going to end up in the classifieds/eBay at some point when I get round to it. PM if it's of interest......

Fez

+1 For soundcraft, we have a couple of Alto speakers which are pretty good Yamaha speakers are also good.

TeleMaster

@Stratavarious @Fez ;

Thanks. They do a 12 input version which has ethernet and guitar effects, as well as vocal effects. All we need is some reverb and compression. Could be ideal?

https://www.thomann.de/gb/soundcraft_ui12.htm

Danny1969

Those Ui mixers aren't really Soundcraft designs .. they are rebadged SM-Pro desks. All under the Harmon brand now.  
I have the Ui24r, it's good value but these desks can be flakey. The chip that creates the opamp rails failed on mine during a gig at Factory in Worthing. It had played up a few times but failed completely that night. I replaced the chip but am thinking about replacing the overcomplicated supply arrangement with linear regulators. The factory design is frugal but too complex really. 
Details of replacing the chip are in the Community repair thread on here. 

My pick for rock solid band mixers is A&H QU series ... had a QU16 since 2013 and it's never missed a beat. I've also installed them in clubs and worked with other bands with QU's ... really great mixers. QU-SB if you don't need a surface, QU16 if you prefer one. 

Speaker wise a solid power amp and 2 passive speakers can be less hassle, louder and cheaper than active speakers. Some of the modern class D active stuff is pretty short lived. 7 to 10 years so be careful of buying 2nd hand. There's been a few times I've repaired one speaker for a customer and told them the other one will go shortly and been told they are going to be sold now both are working

mrkb

Allen & Heath have just brought out lower price range that’s their usual great quality, the CQ series with a touch screen interface, so easy to use without a tablet.

Stratavarious

Those new CQ units do look good, esp. the CQ18t with its local screen.  Affordable.

My only concern is apps rather than browser interface. Apps need updating and may force compatible hardware.  

maltingsaudio

Stratavarious said:

Those new CQ units do look good, esp. the CQ18t with its local screen.  Affordable.

My only concern is apps rather than browser interface. Apps need updating and may force compatible hardware.  

Allen and Heath tend to favour Apple for their control apps because it is one operating system as opposed to various flavours of android ect. I expect mix station will write a patch soon for them. 

I had a look at the CQ desks at PLASA this year, obviously what’s under the hood is great , and they are a great product for bands without an engineer who will spend time getting to know the interface. It isn’t one I could immediately walk up and use without spending time beforehand figuring it out. I suppose like all Digital desks without faders. Don’t expect it to be as good and flexible as flagship desks there is a reason it’s £15 k cheaper! ( read the AH QuSQ CQ page to understand that comment!)

maltingsaudio

With regards to the original post, you say your in London, I would have a google of the rental houses local to you and see what’s in their secondhand pile. There will be lots of options 

Stratavarious

TeleMaster said:

@Stratavarious @Fez ;

Thanks. They do a 12 input version which has ethernet and guitar effects, as well as vocal effects. All we need is some reverb and compression. Could be ideal?

https://www.thomann.de/gb/soundcraft_ui12.htm

The UI24r is a substantially better design. Lots of issues with the older/smaller models.