Songs where you've never bothered to learn the signature guitar parts...

CaseOfAce

Mention of Black Velvet on the "guitarist playing bass" discussion reminds me that I have never learnt note for note the guitar parts of this song when playing it live (i.e. particularly during the middle 8 before the solo).

It doesn't help that I do it in the original key of Eb on a standard tuned guitar (though I assume the guitarist thundered away in E pentatonic on a semi tone down tuned guitar) - since I have no desire to lug around an extra guitar or add a pitch shifter to my board just for this one song. Doing it in E is too high for the female singer.

Nobody's ever remarked on the lack of the parts so it seems like it's one of those songs you can get away with slumming it - whereas a song like Sweet Child O' Mine DOES need to be learnt mostly note for note.

Anyone else take short cuts on songs they do where they can get away with it.

maltingsaudio

Reminds me of the solo toTwo Princes by the Spin Doctors. When it first came out ,pre internet so no tabs easily available, I was trying to learn it note for note by rewinding the tape over and over again . (Anyone remember the struggle?). Anyway about 3 days later played what I had to a mate, who said that’s fine, as long as you get the signature bends/ licks out so they can be heard, how you get to them doesn’t matter. 

axisus

Not that I play live anyway ,,,,,,,, but I never learn anything as played. Way too much time and effort. I'm definitely more of a wing it person. If I had the ability to learn quickly I would try more but I don't. I should add that I have never learned that many songs anyway!

CountryDave

Most of the time, near enough is good enough.
If there are signature licks within the solo, try and hit them to give a flavour of the original to anyone who may notice.  If it's an iconic solo where Joe Public at the Dog N Duck could whistle it, try and get as close as you can.

stickyfiddle

I like to get pretty close but I don’t worry about being literally note for note except on really important bits. Some from tonight’s setlist: 

Proud Mary - I’m mostly playing horn parts. Quiet opening is played like Keef would 

Gimme Some Lovin - again picking out the main riff and a couple of exact Cropper lines but otherwise not worrying

Friends theme - as close to the original as I can get because everyone knows it backwards 

Beat It - riff is exact. Verses are just chords. Solo I’ve got about 80% exactly the same but playing it without a trem I’m very new to tapping so not doing all of it. But the overall shape of the solo and the big bends are all there

ESBlonde

Back in the day when we learned songs taped off the charts Sunday night, rehearsed the band Monday night and gigged them Friday and Saturday night, you had to learn quick. It’s a habit I’ve maintained and whilst not always note perfect, my lead parts are readily recognised by punters as the song they know. If the singer sang a different melody, would that be acceptable?

That said there are/were some parts that required learning a whole new technique like Le Freak, Jump etc. and were either a different longer term challenge or avoided. 

I’ve sometimes revisited songs I quickly learned back in the day after having long since dropped them. Usually For a stage show or panto. This provides the opportunity to relearn fully with the benefit of more experience and technique as well as time. It can be enlightening.

Cols

I wonder what classical musicians would make of the the notion “as long as you get the recognisable hooks in there, don’t worry too much about what’s on the sheet”?

sev112

Well all the classical pieces are interpreted by the orchestra and conductor -- and that's why people have different versions of the apparently same thing 

maltingsaudio

Cols said:

I wonder what classical musicians would make of the the notion “as long as you get the recognisable hooks in there, don’t worry too much about what’s on the sheet”?

Always thought of classical players, or people who can read and play by sight, in the same vein as touch typists. I suppose it depends if they've turned their auto correct on!

HAL9000

Cols said:

I wonder what classical musicians would make of the the notion “as long as you get the recognisable hooks in there, don’t worry too much about what’s on the sheet”?

Winging it is more rock and roll though isn’t it?

Snags

Cols said:

I wonder what classical musicians would make of the the notion “as long as you get the recognisable hooks in there, don’t worry too much about what’s on the sheet”?

Based on my friend who plays violin in a good local orchestra, they'd be all for it if they're at the same level as your average pub band. And there are more of them to fill in the notes the others miss

Cols

sev112 said:

Well all the classical pieces are interpreted by the orchestra and conductor -- and that's why people have different versions of the apparently same thing 

I’m pretty sure they don’t.  Can you imagine what a 90 piece orchestra would sound like with everyone doing their own interpretation?

CountryDave

Cols said:

sev112 said:

Well all the classical pieces are interpreted by the orchestra and conductor -- and that's why people have different versions of the apparently same thing 

I’m pretty sure they don’t.  Can you imagine what a 90 piece orchestra would sound like with everyone doing their own interpretation?

Modern jazz

Danny1969

I generally try to get all the riffs and solo's pretty spot on if I can for songs that go into the bands setlist. There are times though where I'm asked to dep and play a load of songs I'm not that familiar with and unlikely to play again. On these occasions I just wing it mostly. 
I did a dep gig a few weeks back and had charted the changes in my head and listened to the solos but when we talked keys before going on  everything was down a tone or some a tone and half so it would have been pointless spending too long nailing the exact voicing and detail  of every song beforehand. 

maltingsaudio

Danny1969 said:

I did a dep gig a few weeks back and had charted the changes in my head and listened to the solos but when we talked keys before going on  everything was down a tone or some a tone and half so it would have been pointless spending too long nailing the exact voicing and detail  of every song beforehand. 

Slightly OT but this is where the Roland VG8 scored, you could instantly de tune the guitar in software so you could play all the right notes in all the right order but in a different key. Joni Mitchell was a big user of them

dcg

I think there's something about learning the part as written/performed - and once learnt, then interpret it.  I used to approximate parts because I felt that was good enough, but speaking personally, have gradually realised I need to know the music 100% to then reproduce it my way.  This sounds a bit starchy I appreciate, and I do think that as players we should all reach our goals by whatever means suit us...

ESBlonde

HAL9000 said:

Cols said:

I wonder what classical musicians would make of the the notion “as long as you get the recognisable hooks in there, don’t worry too much about what’s on the sheet”?

Winging it is more rock and roll though isn’t it?

Not according to Chuck Berry who threw Keith Richards off stage for having an opinion.

Dontgiveupyourdayjob

maltingsaudio said:

Reminds me of the solo toTwo Princes by the Spin Doctors. When it first came out ,pre internet so no tabs easily available, I was trying to learn it note for note by rewinding the tape over and over again . (Anyone remember the struggle?). Anyway about 3 days later played what I had to a mate, who said that’s fine, as long as you get the signature bends/ licks out so they can be heard, how you get to them doesn’t matter. 

Ah yeah, I remember the struggle well! Brilliant solo though, and great song (and the rest of the album was pretty good too IMO!)

Biggest challenge in both bands I've been in that have had that in the set is the fiendish drum intro - neither drummer could ever get the timing right so we just ended up ditching it and just started all in after a 4-count!