Harley Benton P Bass Kit

Fantomas01

Hi Everyone

I've been told that Santa will be dropping off the above guitar kit on Christmas morning !!  I have been going on about doing a kit build forever so really keen to get started and I've had some ideas......but very little practical experience so was hoping to get some help as a complete beginner.

Initially I wanted to recreate something similar to the Squier Contemporary P Bass, spraying the body white and headstock black, but with no experience, no suitable outdoor space/workshop, I figured this might be too difficult.

So I thought about staining, using some water based stain....not sure on colour yet.  I've since read that the HB kits are finished with sealer that will need to be sanded off before staining.  I don't mind taking my time with this build and doing the necessary sanding, but I'm not sure on a suitable process

My thoughts are to

1. Sand the body with 120 grit, get rid of dust, then sand with 220 grit, then 320 grit.
2. Damp the body to check for remaining sealer.
3. Apply the stain
4. Sand back the raised grain with 320 and apply another coat of stain.

A couple of questions I have are

1. How many times would I need to sand back the raised grain ?  Will it eventually stop rising up out of the surface ?
2. What would be a good way to seal the stain, ideally with a more glossy finish ?  

Any pointers would be great.  This is a learning project so mistakes are likely but I like to get a plan together first before jumping in.

Thanks
Matthew

Funkfingers

Why not simply apply a wipe-on finish onto the existing clear sealing coats? This way, you could always change the colour in future.

Chances are that the kit body will not have especially attractive grain. The joins between the individual sections of wood might be better concealed beneath an opaque finish:

drofluf

I’ve only built one kit but my advice would be keep it simple and take your time. 

As @Funkfingers says the wood you get may be better suited for an opaque finish. My kit was a maple veneer on a mahogany body and my attempt to stain gave me mixed results. 

Check everything fits before you glue. I didn’t and was left with a neck so high that it was unplayable but you may not have such a problem if yours is a bolt on neck. 

Fantomas01

Funkfingers said:

Why not simply apply a wipe-on finish onto the existing clear sealing coats? This way, you could always change the colour in future.

Chances are that the kit body will not have especially attractive grain. The joins between the individual sections of wood might be better concealed beneath an opaque finish:

Thanks, that sounds like a good idea.....do you happen to have any wipe on finish suggestions ?  Is this the kind of thing you mean https://www.crimsonguitars.com/products/water-based-wipe-on-guitar-finishing-lacquer

Thanks again

BillDL

As far as grits of sandpaper is concerned, a lot depends on the type of wood and how porous it is.  You may not have to sand up to 320 grit on some woods, but I suppose it is best to prepare for that possibility.  When you wet wood to raise the grain and then sand it, the grain is only raised once if you are just fine sanding off the fibrous roughness.  If you sand deeper and then apply a water-based stain it can raise the grain of the newly exposed wood.  Spirit (alcohol) based stain / dye and older solvent based stinky stain / dye don't raise the wood grain.

It's pretty difficult to know when you've sanded off any previously applied transparent sanding sealer or first thinned protective lacquer coat, and unless you do the stain isn't going to sink into the wood consistently.  For a first time without outdoor space to spray, I would suggest a wipe-on clear finish lacquer / varnish.

Snap

I did this once and used Danish oil - worked really well

Andyjr1515

So I thought about staining, using some water based stain....not sure on colour yet.  I've since read that the HB kits are finished with sealer that will need to be sanded off before staining.  I don't mind taking my time with this build and doing the necessary sanding, but I'm not sure on a suitable process

My thoughts are to

1. Sand the body with 120 grit, get rid of dust, then sand with 220 grit, then 320 grit.
2. Damp the body to check for remaining sealer.
3. Apply the stain
4. Sand back the raised grain with 320 and apply another coat of stain.

A couple of questions I have are

1. How many times would I need to sand back the raised grain ?  Will it eventually stop rising up out of the surface ?
2. What would be a good way to seal the stain, ideally with a more glossy finish ?  

Well, personally I think this is a reasonable approach. 

Over the years I've tried all sorts but, in the end, I come back to where I started - if it's a non-timber colour I'm after - I use permanent inks.  The Calligraphy inks that decent makers such as Winsor and Newton supply aren't going to fade and they have a decent range of colours.  A £6 small bottle will be plenty for a bass body.  They can be diluted with water, they can be mixed and they won't reject any clear finish I've ever tried...

The method I use is pretty much as you describe.  Yes - start with 120 grit and a decent all round sanding to remove any sealant of manufacturing oil residue.  And yes - wiping with a damp cloth will reveal any areas where you need to sand a bit more.  If the wood absorbs the water, then it will absorb the stain too.  I often stop at 220 grit and only generally do one wet/dry and sand back for dealing with the raised grain.  

For a gloss finish, I tend to use old-fashioned Ronseal Hardglaze polyurethane varnish, thinned with white spirits by around 20% and applied either by an artists watercolour fan brush or wiped on.

For a matt or satin finish I tend to use Osmo Polyx, wiped on. 

Folks will flag that some inks will fade over time.  Yes...some inks do fade - but in my experience not the permanent / calligraphy ones.  My partner-in-openmic-crime's SG-ish, that I built for him well over 10 years ago and which has stood on its stand next to a picture window all that time, still looks the same colour-wise now as it did when I made it:

  

Fantomas01

Andyjr1515 said:

So I thought about staining, using some water based stain....not sure on colour yet.  I've since read that the HB kits are finished with sealer that will need to be sanded off before staining.  I don't mind taking my time with this build and doing the necessary sanding, but I'm not sure on a suitable process

My thoughts are to

1. Sand the body with 120 grit, get rid of dust, then sand with 220 grit, then 320 grit.
2. Damp the body to check for remaining sealer.
3. Apply the stain
4. Sand back the raised grain with 320 and apply another coat of stain.

A couple of questions I have are

1. How many times would I need to sand back the raised grain ?  Will it eventually stop rising up out of the surface ?
2. What would be a good way to seal the stain, ideally with a more glossy finish ?  

Well, personally I think this is a reasonable approach. 

Over the years I've tried all sorts but, in the end, I come back to where I started - if it's a non-timber colour I'm after - I use permanent inks.  The Calligraphy inks that decent makers such as Winsor and Newton supply aren't going to fade and they have a decent range of colours.  A £6 small bottle will be plenty for a bass body.  They can be diluted with water, they can be mixed and they won't reject any clear finish I've ever tried...

The method I use is pretty much as you describe.  Yes - start with 120 grit and a decent all round sanding to remove any sealant of manufacturing oil residue.  And yes - wiping with a damp cloth will reveal any areas where you need to sand a bit more.  If the wood absorbs the water, then it will absorb the stain too.  I often stop at 220 grit and only generally do one wet/dry and sand back for dealing with the raised grain.  

For a gloss finish, I tend to use old-fashioned Ronseal Hardglaze polyurethane varnish, thinned with white spirits by around 20% and applied either by an artists watercolour fan brush or wiped on.

For a matt or satin finish I tend to use Osmo Polyx, wiped on. 

Folks will flag that some inks will fade over time.  Yes...some inks do fade - but in my experience not the permanent / calligraphy ones.  My partner-in-openmic-crime's SG-ish, that I built for him well over 10 years ago and which has stood on its stand next to a picture window all that time, still looks the same colour-wise now as it did when I made it:

  

Hi

Thanks for that detailed reply.  I went with Angelus leather dyes in the end, initally black which I sanded back and then added some blue so I've got a kind of Midnight Blue burst effect that I'm quite pleased with.  Some spots where there are some mistakes but I'm happy enough with it for a first attempt.

I'm now looking at finishing it, I think I will go with the Satin finish, so will look at getting some Osmo as I've seen a few people recommending that.

Thanks again for the help

Matthew

Andyjr1515

Sounds great.  Be sure to post some pics when it's done