Grey/faded areas on side of old Yamaha acoustic

Basher

My poor old, late-70s/early-80s Yamaha L-25A dreadnought-esque (it weighs about the same as a WW1 battleship too) acoustic rarely gets played these days, which is sad.

Also sad is the appearance of some grey patches on the guitar's upper side. No idea when they started appearing and they are very difficult to get pictures of, due to the gloss finish.

Any ideas what's going on here and why? I first thought it was the wood discolouring. The wood is something called Jacaranda and is a kind of rosewood or rosewood-like timber. Not sure if Jacaranda is prone to such fading? The guitar is stored in the case and is never left in the sun, although it might have been exposed to UV when I first bought it around 1985. 

Looking again, I'm worried that it could be something to do with the finish. There's no disturbance or unevenness to the gloss surface but it looks similar to how it might if the lacquer was lifting in some way.

It might just be that this is what happens when such instruments are around 40 years old. I started going grey about then too!

Here's the best picture I can get. Not great but shows the biggest patch (some smaller ones to the left). This is not a reflection - the patch is definitely discoloured.

Musical_Mystery_Tour

Since it is at the edge, I'm inclined to think it is the wood shrinking a bit, separating from the varnish, making it bounce light a bit differently, plus air then being able to get to the wood would allow a reaction of some kind to occur as it can then dry out a bit more. Doesn't look terrible; personally, I'd regard it as the character of the guitar coming out as it ages.

Tannin

LOL for your post re going grey at 40.

I can't help much with the grey patches. It is very clearly wood getting exposed to the air without protection, but as to why I am out of clues. 

I can help with the "jacaranda", two different ways. Actual jacaranda  is a spectacular flowering tree widely planted in many parts of the world. So far as I know, it's not used to make musical instruments. (It may not get big enough to be usable. As a rule, though the flowers are amazing, it's only a small tree.)

But "jacaranda" was, for some weird reason, used as a pseudonym for Brazilian Rosewood by Japanese guitar makers in the 70s and 80s. Probably also for other rosewoods. Now that side doesn't immediately strike me as Brazilian Rosewood and I'd like to see the back of the guitar before forming an opinion as to what it is. But I'm no expert. The other thing to consider is that it might be laminated, in which case it doesn't matter what the timbers are. 

Basher

Tannin said:

But "jacaranda" was, for some weird reason, used as a pseudonym for Brazilian Rosewood by Japanese guitar makers in the 70s and 80s. Probably also for other rosewoods. Now that side doesn't immediately strike me as Brazilian Rosewood and I'd like to see the back of the guitar before forming an opinion as to what it is. But I'm no expert. The other thing to consider is that it might be laminated, in which case it doesn't matter what the timbers are. 

I've always thought Brazilian rosewood was very figured. This is very plain. 

I've been told it was a high level model at the time and made in some facility in Taiwan with the top luthiers. No idea if this is true but Yamaha did support this in an email I got from them while trying to establish the age of the thing.

Here's the back: 

Tannin

^ Not out of the question. The colour isn't very like Indian Rosewood. (Very pretty guitar!)

I have played just one Taiwanese-made Yamaha. It was glorious! I reckon the Taiwanese workers were hell-bent on showing the Japanese that they were the real deal. The one I played was not expensive (AUD $1200, $1500? I forget now but not much) and superb in every respect ... except the nut width which was maybe 42mm. (I didn't measure it, but it was way too small for  my Western-sized hands.) Reluctantly I let it go, but it was a magnificent instrument, and on sale for half what the same guitar would have commanded had it been made in Australia or Japan or the USA.

Kurtis

I had a yamaha acoustic that, over several years, started to reveal a "splodge" that had obviously been painted over. 

Basher

Thanks for the knowledge/thoughts on this. 

@Tannin yes, the Taiwan-built guitars are nice. I just Googled the following:

In 1978 Yamaha introduced a second line of L-series guitars for the export markets. These were all handmade in Taiwan and also regarded as guitars made with fantastic craftmanship. It was the first handbuilt Yamaha series from Taiwan and some presume Taiwan wanted to show Yamaha that they could build high end handmade guitars as good as in Japan. Notwithstanding tha Japanese L-series the Taiwan L-series were all full solid guitars.

Production of L-series guitars in Taiwan stopped in 1984, so a year earlier as in Japan.
The series consisted of a L-5A, L-10A, L-15A, L-20A, L-25A and a L-25AT.

There was a kind of a shift in model number. The L-5A had mahogany back and sides. None of the earlier L-series had. The L-10A is similar to the L-8 2nd generation. The L-15A has similarities with the 1st generation L-8 and the 2nd generation L-10. The L-25A has much in common with the L-15, especially the beautifull 3pc Jacaranda back:

Handy as, if true, it confirms that it must have been built between '78 and '84. Given that I think I bought it in '85 it ties in.

Source link has some pictures: https://yamahaguitars.nl/facts-figures/the-l-series/

Mine's been bashed about a bit over the years but still sounds wonderful. Nut width is 44mm or thereabouts so a nice size and a perfect all-rounder for both picking and strumming IMO. Quite a chunky profile though. It'd probably need something like .013s to really drive it but I'm not manly enough for that!   

BillDL

Take a very close look at the joint between the binding and the sides with a magnifying glass.  It looks to me as though there may have been some shrinking of the binding or body that's left a hairline crack and caused slight lacquer separation.  I had this on an 80s Yamaha, albeit a much cheaper Taiwanese model.  I discovered that there was a very tiny bit of "give" in the lacquer when I gently pressed on it.  Being a cheap guitar I was willing to experiment with the risk of messing it up, but I was able to run some thin superglue into the crack and it filled the void.  I wouldn't recomment this with your lovely guitar though.

@Tannin The first time I saw Jacaranda being mentioned in guitar spec surprised me too, because I also grew up surrounded by the bluey-purple profusion of flowers and the carpet of flowers that fell on the roads and pavements in  September / October.  I knew what the wood looked like from seeing trees downed by lightning and sawn into pieces and that it wouldn't yield boards wide enough for luthiery nor be particularly suitable, as it's not nearly hard enough.  I think makers used the name just to be roughly indicative of either Brazilian Rosewood or any of its close substitutes wherever they chose to use either, but didn't want to have to change the written specifications repeatedly.  As kids we used to dare each other to pull open the castanet-like pods that had already shed their tiny seeds, because spiders often occupied the pods.  Africans also made an aphrodisiac from dried Jacaranda (J. mimosifolia) tree roots or bark, but I cannot vouch for its efficiency.

Tannin

Yes indeed @BillDL. Not so common in the southern states of Victoria and Tasmania where I grew up got older, but planted all over the place further north. This is Grafton in northern New South Wales but you can see similar scenes in many towns.

The other one they plant a lot up that way is Southern Silky Oak (Grevillea robusta) which is native to NSW but planted in many places around the world. The two often flower at the same time - masses of purple and masses of gold, it's quite a sight. (As a matter of detail, Silky Oak makes an excellent back and sides timber, and is also used for tops sometimes. Some makers incorrectly call it "silver oak" or even "Indian silver oak".)

  

I dunno, I reckon those ^ trees are getting on towards a size where you could get guitar-sized boards out of them. As you say though, I doubt that the wood is much use for instruments, otherwise someone would have tried it by now.

sir_strumalot

Looks like something has affected the woodstain, and you are seeing the natural colour of the wood in those patches - perhaps there was some contamination on the wood when the guitar was finished and that has reacted with the stain?

bluecat

Yes I agree with what others have said , that the lacquer is very slightly staring to lift. Maybe if you use a watchmakers or photographers Lupe you may be able to see this. All in all though for a forty plus year old guitar it is still a good looker.
A top class luthier would probably be able to refinish it for you as it is obviously a keeper.