Revealing unforgiving amps (technique wise)

thecolourbox

It is certainly more of a problem to me as a bad technique player, but due to the style if music I want to be playing, this is usually to my advantage. I got this amp because I thought it would give me a good crunchy overdrive but it seems too subtle an amp to do that with.

Sadly I sold my compressor pedal it heroise that might have solved it.

Even more sadly the amp that seemed to suit my playing was a Blackstar ht amp, however the sound didn't agree with me. It's a bit like how I feel about wearing the colour green. I'm to,d it suits my complexion, but it doesn't suit my style, if that makes sense

ICBM

thecolourbox said:

It is certainly more of a problem to me as a bad technique player, but due to the style if music I want to be playing, this is usually to my advantage. I got this amp because I thought it would give me a good crunchy overdrive but it seems too subtle an amp to do that with.

Sadly I sold my compressor pedal it heroise that might have solved it.

Even more sadly the amp that seemed to suit my playing was a Blackstar ht amp, however the sound didn't agree with me. It's a bit like how I feel about wearing the colour green. I'm to,d it suits my complexion, but it doesn't suit my style, if that makes sense

Get a distortion pedal.

I'm a bad technique player too, which is why I like distortion pedals, and big heavy-sounding amps… they seem to respond more to my ragged playing.

I don't like Blackstars either, I don't so much find them forgiving as frustrating… 'on paper' they should suit me very well because they have that darker Mesa-type voicing, but they're just undynamic and lifeless somehow - even the handwired ones. I hate compressors too, for the same reason - they drive me nuts by taking away that hand-to-volume or hand-to-distortion control that I take for granted. (Yes, I know that's what compressors are for!)

thecolourbox

I actually do really like the Blackstar sound, for what it is, they sound pretty solid and good. But it didn't suit what I'm trying to get playing, being White Stripes style garagey Rock. Sounded a bit too polished, and for whatever reason whenever I touch a Blackstar (I have an I'd core at my girlfriends) I launch into Led Zep

JohnPerry

I need my amps to both forgive and forget

Fortheloveofguitar

Cornford MK50 is a very unforgiving amp.

The Hellcat is more forgiving though due to the slightly compressed nature of the amp.

Voxman

JohnPerry;392369" said:

I need my amps to both forgive and forget

Me too....the way I play I need all the forgiveness I can get!
>:D<

But seriously guys I'm not exactly sure what you all mean by an unforgiving amp. What I mean is I've played many many different amps that of course all have their own character tone and feel but I don't think I've ever felt an amp was fighting me or making it hard for me to play or showing up my playing deficits more with one amp than another. Definitely had that with guitars, just not amps....am I misunderstanding the thread or am I just tone deaf and/or easy to please?

Roland

Surely an unforgiving amp is one which is very responsive in some way. If you want it that way then good, if not then it can expose some aspect of poor playing. There are a number of ways that an amp can be responsive: eg low compression, quick break up, bright EQ that emphasises pick and string noise

thecolourbox

Yes, Roland, that's exactly what I mean with this

Voxman

Ok so if I'm understanding correctly you guys merely mean an amp that has an exagerated sensitivity or chacteristic - but surely thats the whole point that distinguishes one amp from another and what makes one amp desireable for a certain style of playing whilst another amp suits a different style of playing. But thats like comparing a marshall jcm800 to a fender twin reverb, a bassman to a soldano or a strat to a lespaul.

Just in the same way you adjust from one guitars neck, tone and feel to another surely its the same with amps and just about familiarity, understanding its eq etc and finding the sweet-spots.

Fuzzdog

I took me many years to realise that I actually like a really unforgiving rig.  Most amps which people rave about leave me a bit cold, as they feel spongy and weird to play through.  That lovely tube amp compression which most people seem to love drives me absolutely nuts.

I have a fondness for big solid state amps (or high power tube amps set low) for this reason, I think - they're so unflattering, but this also means they respond incredibly well to what I'm doing with dynamics in a way a lot of 'classic' amps rarely do.  I've quite often had other people play through my rigs and ask me how the hell I even manage to play through them. )

CHrisP86

+1 on the Cornford MK50.  Unforgiving in the sense that every nuance in your playing is picked up and amplified (good and bad), nowhere to hide.  It does keep you on your toes and force you to improve your technique.

ICBM

Fuzzdog said:

I took me many years to realise that I actually like a really unforgiving rig.  Most amps which people rave about leave me a bit cold, as they feel spongy and weird to play through.  That lovely tube amp compression which most people seem to love drives me absolutely nuts.

I have a fondness for big solid state amps (or high power tube amps set low) for this reason, I think - they're so unflattering, but this also means they respond incredibly well to what I'm doing with dynamics in a way a lot of 'classic' amps rarely do.

Me too, but not because they're unflattering! To me, they're easy to play. I'm also a pretty rough-and ready player, but the one thing I do well is dynamic control with my hands - I like a direct instinctive correlation between picking (or more accurately hitting ) strength and volume, or distortion amount depending on the type of sound. Anything that breaks that or involves a learning curve of how hard to pick in order to change the sound frustrates me. Which is why I hate compressors.

Even then, there are amps I've played which are too unforgiving - the Renown is the first that sprang to mind, but there are probably others. It's just got such a hard sound, instantaneous harsh breakup and such a colossal amount of power that you really have to be very careful, and it feels like you're tiptoeing around your playing. Big valve amps tend not to be like this as much, they're looser and more natural-sounding… although it's interesting that there are some I don't like because they're too tight - including the VHTs and Diezels that @Drew_fx loves.

(Drew - that may explain why you don't notice this characteristic . But if you ever get the chance, try something like one of those old Peaveys, Roland JC or a Yamaha B100 etc at high volume and you might find out! Or buy it .)

Drew_TNBD

I used to own a Yamaha B100 actually! Quite nice solid-state amps, I used mine for bass.

I think there are amps that feel squashy... like playing through a sponge; the 5150's and the original JVM come to mind - too much gain, too loose and flubby... I tend to avoid those amps. I suspect the dual recto's of this world would not be for me!

You're right, I do like tight amps. What I look for in an amp is an obscene amount of gain, but when you play a palm-muted drop-D chord, the whole thing tightens up as if it had less gain in the first place. I like a palmmuteypalmmuteypalmmuteyRAWRpalmmuteypalmmuteypalmmutey

... kind of dynamic. Hard to explain really.

It has taken me some time to realize that actually, I don't go in for much of a "metal" guitar tone. My tone is more of a hard-rock thing, and I use a fair amount of feedback.

57Deluxe

My Tweed Deluxe - will give you tinitus as soon as look at you... with a Gibson that is...

jonnyburgo

ICBM said:

Peavey Renown.

Probably the most unforgiving amp I've ever played through. 210 watts of incredibly penetrating clean power and the hardest overdrive tone known to man. Over-pick a note and you will cut a swathe through the audience as wide as the amp right to the back of the room...

I do think it's slightly funny when people go on about 'prefering unforgiving amps'. No you don't . You just prefer slightly less forgiving amps .

I used to gig with one in 1991, a bazillion watts of CLANG!!!!!!!!

p90fool

The sonic assault has even shrunk your hat.