Dotted eigth Note on Boss DD8 - Am I missing something?

fatcornishlad

Hi All,

I've lost hours on this one ... We do one U2 cover in our set list and need a dotted eigth delay. I have a Boss DD8 which states that it does do this. Manual isnt great so have been on YT videos and I'm pretty sure I've followed the instructions to a tee and I'm still only getting a single delay with no dotted eigth. e.g.  

Possibly I'm missing somethign with tap tempos?

Before I admit defeat and replace it with a Joshua Tree delay, has anyone worked out how to do it ? Or am I wasting my time because mid set, its unlikely I'm going to faff around with unplugging input A, plugging a jack into input B, dancing on tap tempos etc ? 

Thx Steve

digitalkettle

Yep, you do have to faff about to change the tap mode.

I don't bother with that: leave it set to quarter notes and learn to tap a dotted eighth (I find it easier with an external switch like this one: https://brightonion.co.uk/products/micro-boss-tap-tempo-switch ).

fatcornishlad

digitalkettle said:

Yep, you do have to faff about to change the tap mode.

I don't bother with that: leave it set to quarter notes and learn to tap a dotted eighth (I find it easier with an external switch like this one: https://brightonion.co.uk/products/micro-boss-tap-tempo-switch ).

Thanks bud. So you can tap tempo over the top of a set time (quarter note) delay ? Is that in any mode ? 

Jonathangus

https://www.manualslib.com/manual/1764760/Boss-Dd-8.html?page=10#manual

So if I'm reading that correctly, doing the whole Input B > Press > Input A thing turns the mode knob into a tap division knob, so you have  to select 'Warm', and then save.  Presumably, once it's saved, the the tap works as a dotted eighth on whichever mode you then choose.

But yeah, what a palaver.  No way anyone's going to do that in a live scenario.

digitalkettle

fatcornishlad said:

digitalkettle said:

Yep, you do have to faff about to change the tap mode.

I don't bother with that: leave it set to quarter notes and learn to tap a dotted eighth (I find it easier with an external switch like this one: https://brightonion.co.uk/products/micro-boss-tap-tempo-switch ).

Thanks bud. So you can tap tempo over the top of a set time (quarter note) delay ? Is that in any mode ? 

The 'quarter note' mode is just how the pedal interprets your foot tapping the pedal...and it all boils down to a millisecond value.

So you leave the pedal on quarter notes...you tap something rhythmic other than quarters...in this case a dotted eighth. I suppose you're 'fooling' the pedal into thinking it's doing quarters at a different tempo.

Dotted rhythms are slightly more confusing than wholes/halfs/quarters etc. If you wanted a half-bar delay, you'd tap on every other quarter...if you wanted a full eighth note delay, you'd tap twice for every quarter, i.e. on the beat and on the '&'. Same principle for dotted eighth. Taken to extremes, two rapid taps gets you into slapback territory...that's probably around 125ms which is a 16th at 120bpm.

It's easy to do than to describe:

• I'll do this on-the-fly but it's easier when you're not playing anything tricky
• Start feeling the 16th note pulse...you're going to need three of them: dotted eighth = three sixteenths
• Tap on the beat then again on your third sixteenth note
• If things are moving rapidly, think of it like preempting the next quarter note
• Usually only need to two taps...but you can do more if you get used to feeling that 3-against-4 rhythm

Hope that makes sense.

n.b. this is why I like a dedicated tap button

nonesuch

fatcornishlad said:

I'm pretty sure I've followed the instructions to a tee and I'm still only getting a single delay with no dotted eigth. e.g.  

That sounds like it has worked doesn't it? When you start playing you're getting dotted 8ths for the tempo you've tapped in?

Unless I've misunderstood. But yes I agree it's a faff to set it up, but if that's the only time you need it in the set, then it should work okay.

(Edit: I have misunderstood a bit because I thought for some reason the video was the OP demonstrating it.)

digitalkettle

nonesuch said:

fatcornishlad said:

I'm pretty sure I've followed the instructions to a tee and I'm still only getting a single delay with no dotted eigth. e.g.  

That sounds like it has worked doesn't it? When you start playing you're getting dotted 8ths for the tempo you've tapped in?

Unless I've misunderstood. But yes I agree it's a faff to set it up, but if that's the only time you need it in the set, then it should work okay.

Not great if you only want it for one song in a set!

nonesuch

digitalkettle said:Not great if you only want it for one song in a set!

If you need to use 'standard' tap tempo in the other songs, I would just make a note of the position of the time knob and set it to that for the U2 song.

But isn't the OP saying that he can't get dotted 8ths to work at all?

(Edit: I have misunderstood a bit because I thought for some reason the video was the OP demonstrating it.)

digitalkettle

nonesuch said:

digitalkettle said:Not great if you only want it for one song in a set!

If you need to use 'standard' tap tempo in the other songs, I would just make a note of the position of the time knob and set it to that for the U2 song.

But isn't the OP saying that he can't get dotted 8ths to work at all?

(Edit: I have misunderstood a bit because I thought for some reason the video was the OP demonstrating it.)

That's an excellent lo-fi solution...albeit not drummer-proof

I went straight to suggesting a workaround: even if the OP was changing the tap mode successfully, it's a ball-ache on-the-fly.

nonesuch

digitalkettle said:

That's an excellent lo-fi solution...albeit not drummer-proof

Haha yes, you have to rely on the drummer to actually listen to the guitar :-)

And yes I agree with @digitalkettle that an external tap tempo switch would be very useful.

Mind you, the Edge never had tap tempo for his Deluxe Memory Man when he created all those brilliant delays in the early days of U2. (Obviously I like to have the tap tempo option these days!)

digitalkettle

nonesuch said:

Mind you, the Edge never had tap tempo for his Deluxe Memory Man when he created all those brilliant delays in the early days of U2. (Obviously I like to have the tap tempo option these days!)

The mind boggles...never get bored of hearing that stuff.

26.2

When I’ve used dotted eighths on a non-tap delay, I’ve just had a bit of masking tape on the pedal with the knob position marked for dotted eighths at the required tempo. You do need a trustworthy drummer but there is some margin for error, say 5 bpm either way. 

The other thing to remember is to turn up the effect level so the repeats are nice and loud. That way you get the ‘bounce’ that you need.

I’ve got a Timeline now, so it’s easy to set a precise bpm. I still tend to set it manually rather than having a preset with dotted eighths, or by tapping on the fly. Old habits die hard I guess. 

fatcornishlad

Ok ace thanks. Will give it another go. Appreciated.

victorludorum

Will the audience ever notice?

NelsonP

victorludorum said:

Will the audience ever notice?

This sort of thinking leads to things like, "we don't need to learn the song note for note, it's better to play our own interpretation", and "no need to sound check, I know my amp settings" and other such signposts on the mediocrity highway.

But you are right, they probably won't notice. It's one of the many benefits of beer :-)

english_bob

victorludorum said:

Will the audience ever notice?

If you're setting up the kind of delays needed for U2 songs and you're not in time, yes. 

Don't get me wrong, I'm generally quite sympathetic to the "audience won't notice" argument, but you have to mix your delay pretty high to get the U2 "cascade" thing, and a loud delay repeat out of time with what your playing will sound like an absolute car crash.

Stratavarious

DD7 makes this much easier, basically the delay ranges are tap tempo divisions.  I have a DD200 now too and it can do it all much much better.. dual delay, dotted and 4 easy access memory slots.  I use an external tap tempo I can mash live with both.

Sounds like the DD8 compromised things a bit