Self-charging hybrid, plug-in hybrid, mild hybrid?

HAL9000

We’re thinking about changing the car soon. Last time we bought a car the options were pretty much petrol or diesel. Now there seem to be a multitude of options and plenty of info online on how they all work. However there seems to be very little info on which one to actually choose.

We live in a rural location and cover about 10k miles per year. Most journeys are probably less than 50 miles, but there’s also a weekly trip of around 100 miles, plus the occasional 400 mile round trip to relatives.

Another consideration is that some manufacturers anticipate selling cars with solid-state batteries within the next few years. Potentially this could be the long-promised game changer but could also make it difficult to sell the current generation of hybrids and EVs on the used market.

So which would you choose? And why?

crunchman

Petrol

Hybrids might make sense in a city, where there is a lot of stop-start driving, and the regen braking will get you some energy back.

If you are 10 miles out of town, you are just lugging the extra weight of the batteries and electric motors for very little benefit.

Sporky

A self-charting hybrid will generally be more efficient than a same-performance petrol, because (as crunchman says), it'll recover energy when you slow and use that to help you speed up again. If your journeys are smooth and have little acceleration and braking then there's less benefit.

A plug-in might be a good plan if a good proportion of your journeys won't exceed its range - and you can charge it at home or work where the power is cheap. I may well be out of date, but it used to be that at least some of the plug-is didn't have regenerative breaking, so once you'd used the battery up it was dead weight. I'm not sure that's generally true any more though. 

So it's about the "character" of your journeys as much as it is about the distance. 

Neilybob

My Toyota (21 plate) RAV4 petrol/hybrid maybe the best car I've ever driven! Great popping into London or bombing it up the M1 to Edinburgh. 

No worries or concerns about having to stop and charge up or worry about the performance of the batteries. 

pt22

We just faced the same decision, but was buying used (w/o financing) so I’m not sure what your plan is. For us, a used petrol car was still the best value, considering price and how long we wanted to keep the car. 

We drive only one or two hundred miles a month max, so we did not want full electric or PHEV. We do plan on one or two trips to Europe per year, so while electric will get easier we will wanted the ease of petrol. At home charging would then be just enough of a faff (no drive) that we didn’t want to deal with it. So that left mild hybrid or petrol (diesel was off the table) and that left the significant difference in up-front cost that pushed us towards petrol. We also figured this would be our last manual gearbox, so that was the final tip of the scale. 

We ended up with a late model, low mileage Kuga petrol vs a hybrid CRV or RAV4, for about 5 grand less for equivalent mileage and year. We hope to keep it for at least 5 years, and I’m open to keeping it longer if it’s still not causing maintenance issues. 

There are a lot of variables to consider before you even get to the drivetrain but I’m sure you’ve made them we just don’t know, so more info would be helpful. How long do you plan to keep it? Purchase or lease? New or used? Etc…

EricTheWeary

Hybrids developed a bit of a poor reputation but the best partial hybrids (like the Toyota Yaris and Honda Jazz) are some of the most fuel efficient new cars you can buy now. 
Unfortunately we have a new car market dominated by SUV style vehicles which are large, heavy and inefficient whatever you stick under the hood. Oh and lots of people can't park them properly (UK parking spaces just weren't designed with these in mind). 
Unless your long journeys are time sensitive then the range anxiety issue for EVs shouldn't be a real problem and as long as you can do home charging. 
I have looked to change cars multiple times but drawn back. If you gave me £25k to go to a dealership today probably I'd buy a Toyota hybrid, although if you said buy an interesting/sexy car they wouldn't make the list. 

Danny1969

I quite like the idea of the Darcia Spring which is released this year in the UK

Sub 18K to buy 

Weights less than a ton so it's 26kWh hour battery gives around 120 miles of range ...  by my maths that means around 4.5 hours on a 30 amp radial to charge up at home 

I know the build quality will be poor and the fit and finish compared to Skoda, Ford etc but I don't care. As long as it goes and stops and I never have to get covered in oil fixing it I will be happy. 

EricTheWeary

Danny1969 said:

I quite like the idea of the Darcia Spring which is released this year in the UK

Sub 18K to buy 

Weights less than a ton so it's 26kWh hour battery gives around 120 miles of range ...  by my maths that means around 4.5 hours on a 30 amp radial to charge up at home 

I know the build quality will be poor and the fit and finish compared to Skoda, Ford etc but I don't care. As long as it goes and stops and I never have to get covered in oil fixing it I will be happy. 

The reviews are fairly terrible although it's the cheapest 'proper' EV. I'm quite taken by the XBus although I realise that it's closer to a futuristic milk float than a standard car.

rlw

Honda Zr-V

Chimpankie

Sporky said:

A self-charting hybrid will generally be more efficient than a same-performance petrol, because (as crunchman says), it'll recover energy when you slow and use that to help you speed up again. If your journeys are smooth and have little acceleration and braking then there's less benefit.

A plug-in might be a good plan if a good proportion of your journeys won't exceed its range - and you can charge it at home or work where the power is cheap. I may well be out of date, but it used to be that at least some of the plug-is didn't have regenerative breaking, so once you'd used the battery up it was dead weight. I'm not sure that's generally true any more though. 

So it's about the "character" of your journeys as much as it is about the distance. 

Depends on the plug-in - the Toyota PHEVs still have the ability to operate as a standard hybrid once the battery is depleted and unable to be 'full electric' so it's more equivalent to driving a typical Toyota Hybrid at that point. 

The broader question, I'm very happy with my Toyota Hybrid. Routinely get 60mpg. I would like a plugin down the line (so many of my journeys are less than 50 miles but with weekly 200 mile jaunts so PHEV is perfect) but when I purchased my current car the only Toyota plug-ins were the Prius, which was only four seater at the time, or the RAV4 which was out of our budget. Unlikely to change my car for 5 years or so but when I do it'll be a Toyota PHEV or BEV. 

I wouldn't touch a mild hybrid, don't see the point in them. 

sweepy

Love my older Lexus 450h Hybrid, for a big comfy cruiser it’s relatively economical and cheap to run, I’d recommend one in a heartbeat but used prices aren’t cheap 

Sporky

Chimpankie said:

Depends on the plug-in - the Toyota PHEVs still have the ability to operate as a standard hybrid once the battery is depleted and unable to be 'full electric' so it's more equivalent to driving a typical Toyota Hybrid at that point. 

I thought that might now be the case - seems more sensible than the early ones that didn't.

Roland

Depends on the use case, and what’s on the market at the time. We’ve got a Yaris hybrid for short journeys, mainly local shopping. However about once a month we do a 400mile round trip to relatives. I also need something to carry band PA and lights. For those two purposes it’s a 2.0lt diesel, which I hope will last until there’s a decent alternative. Diesel might pump out CO2 and particulates, but replacing it early is going to incur the environmental impact of manufacturing a replacement.