A jazzy sound on a non-jazz guitar

Roundwound

There’s no arguing that anyone can play jazz on whatever they like. Hollowbody archtops remain in their own category for a specific type of tone and vibe though. They are a lot of fun.

EvansDrD

Roundwound said:

I honestly think that a full depth hollowbody archtop is very much in its own category when it comes to tone. Compressed YouTube comparisons don’t do the differences justice. Often some of the nuance of what you get in the room with an archtop is lost, including the acoustic sound itself and the faster note decay. I havnt been able to perfectly replicate a clean archtop tone with any solid body, including Les Pauls, strats and teles. The (vintage) tele neck comes closest.

My Gibson archtop is currently strung with TI Jazz Bepop strings (13s) which are technically roundwound strings. The guitar still sounds like an archtop. I’ll probably switch to flats next time, mainly to eliminate the string noise. Flats tend to be a bit stiffer and discourage string bending which can be good for jazz too. Archtops are supremely comfortable to play sitting down when you find the correct position and posture.

Apologies for thread drift here but I just wanted to chime in on the strings! I am a big fan of TI Bebop 13s but I have recently switched to Newtone Archtop strings. They are made in Derbyshire and are quite similar/a great alternative to the TIs. They are also a little cheaper and have better balance from string to string. Much less squeak as well. The Newtone 12s are overall similar tension to the TI 13s but ask for a 'custom set' of 12s, with the b and e replaced with a 17 and 13 respectively. No extra cost. These are the perfect jazz round wounds for me. I have asked if they are considering flat wound strings but there are no plans as yet. I should add that I have no affiliation here, I just really like these strings! 

EvansDrD

susbemol said:

The idea of a "jazz sound" is probably different for each person. There is no right or wrong answer, really.

Personally, I think it is much more to what and how you play than any choice of gear or "sound". In other words, it's about touch, phrasing, harmonic content, etc.

For example, here is Cecil Alexander sounding like a proper jazz badass on a Jackson Soloist:

This is incredible! Ashamed to say that I hadn't really heard of Cecil Alexander but I certainly have now. Wow. And thanks for posting 

EvansDrD

ICBM said:

MartinBush said:

A jazzy sound on a non-jazz guitar

Neck pickup, tone control down a bit, play further away from the bridge, use a thick pick.

Flatwounds might go further, may be worth a try.

MartinBush said:

I don't have the money to buy a jazz type guitar and don't envisage Joe Pass levels of demand for my playing.

Joe Pass used a Jaguar for a while.

https://youtu.be/7bByNpAx150?si=SM6W6PkYiJlUYC5J

Both the Jazzmaster (the clue is in the name ) and the Jaguar were originally designed for jazz, even if very few players did use them for that.

The short scale of the Jag was chosen to make complex chords easier to play.

The entirety of Joe Pass's debut (Sounds of Synanon) was recorded using a solid body Fender. I'd be hard pushed to tell if I didn't already know...

...but then fast forward to his 1964 albums (Joy Spring and For Django) for the platonic ideal of a 'thunky' jazz tone using a 175 

-

My guess is that choice of amp/amp settings (less scoop, more mids) and pick (1.5mm, small, teardrop) will really matter when going for a jazzy tone on a tele on similar 

Incidentally, I would echo the advice to use roundwound strings rather than flats on a tele (Tim Lerch would be your reference point here) 

DrJazzTap

I played jazz on an SG. 

Roundwound

EvansDrD said:

Roundwound said:

I honestly think that a full depth hollowbody archtop is very much in its own category when it comes to tone. Compressed YouTube comparisons don’t do the differences justice. Often some of the nuance of what you get in the room with an archtop is lost, including the acoustic sound itself and the faster note decay. I havnt been able to perfectly replicate a clean archtop tone with any solid body, including Les Pauls, strats and teles. The (vintage) tele neck comes closest.

My Gibson archtop is currently strung with TI Jazz Bepop strings (13s) which are technically roundwound strings. The guitar still sounds like an archtop. I’ll probably switch to flats next time, mainly to eliminate the string noise. Flats tend to be a bit stiffer and discourage string bending which can be good for jazz too. Archtops are supremely comfortable to play sitting down when you find the correct position and posture.

Apologies for thread drift here but I just wanted to chime in on the strings! I am a big fan of TI Bebop 13s but I have recently switched to Newtone Archtop strings. They are made in Derbyshire and are quite similar/a great alternative to the TIs. They are also a little cheaper and have better balance from string to string. Much less squeak as well. The Newtone 12s are overall similar tension to the TI 13s but ask for a 'custom set' of 12s, with the b and e replaced with a 17 and 13 respectively. No extra cost. These are the perfect jazz round wounds for me. I have asked if they are considering flat wound strings but there are no plans as yet. I should add that I have no affiliation here, I just really like these strings! 

Thanks, I’ll look those up

Litterick

Matt_McG

One of the best jazz on a non-jazz guitar vids is this one where George Benson is playing a superstrat in a club (and singing). Solo from about 3 min 40s.:

spir4L

tldr so not sure if already suggested but I'd buy some thomastik bebop strings for the tele At least that's what I use on both my archtops and tele 

Roundwound

Matt_McG said:

One of the best jazz on a non-jazz guitar vids is this one where George Benson is playing a superstrat in a club (and singing). Solo from about 3 min 40s.:

Very cool video and great performance. The guitar sounds like you’d expect from a superstrat played clean, which suits what is basically a pop song in a funky jazz fusion style. It’s distinct from, for example,  50s/60s bop.

“Jazz” is a huge genre. Good article on jazz guitar here: https://www.everythingjazz.com/story/tone-how-the-guitar-found-its-jazz-voice/

Zoonyboy

A cheaper Tele with HB at the neck, maybe a Squier, or an Epiphone LP or 335 on the neck pickup, decent setup, .011 strings and try playing with your thumb on melodies, instead of using a pick. Don't play too hard, and try to be expressive. Any amp will do if it is loud enough, don't go too bright or muddy, and be yourself. It's fun and you can always develop into what you want to do. Jazz has many sounds, not just mellow and dull. Watch Wes Montgomery on youtube having a great time in old footage, but you don't have to sound like anyone else.