Audio PC - same old dilema

spark240

So...I'm looking to upgrade from my trusty audio laptop.

Im running Presonus Studio One, so do I go Mac mini ( never had a Mac) OR custom audio PC from someone like Scan or Inta Audio.

Prices are all similar really £800 - 1k.

Opinions?   

Danny1969

Second hand Mac Pro would be my choice. Just about every studio I know runs a Mac Pro and you can get a very capable one for £800

BilliBob

I would love to get the presonus studiolive desk etc but refuse to go that route due to the Firewire scenario.  Cant for the life of me understand why they are not going usb3.  Simply crazy to expect people to go thru the getting a compatible PC just for their product.
The moment they do offer usb3 I will be buying.
Best of luck whichever you choose.  Personally would be PC for me not Mac but thats just a personal choice.
I really would love to have presonus explain clearly why they are still using firewire.  Just seems a bit mad to me.

Danny1969

@BilliBob

I use the Studiolive 16:4:2 with one band and it's as flakey as hell, if you want that kind of thing try A&H's QU16 or QU24 These digital multitrack mixers are USB and can even record multitrack straight to eternal USB drive, no computer needed

sweepy

I'd recommend a post 2008 Mac Pro tower anyday, The late 2008 have the 64 bit HD controller so can run Logic X Yosemite Mavericks etc etc  . You can fit any SATA hard drives you like very easily and it is near as dammit silent .I paid £650 for my s/h 2x Quad Core 2.66 Mac and its been solid as a rock.

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Apple-Mac-Pro-8-core-2-8-Ghz-8-Gb-RAM-500-Gb-Hard-Drive-/231419974567?pt=UK_Computing_Apple_Desktops_CV&hash=item35e1b493a7

Something like that

spark240

Danny1969 said:

@BilliBob

I use the Studiolive 16:4:2 with one band and it's as flakey as hell, if you want that kind of thing try A&H's QU16 or QU24 These digital multitrack mixers are USB and can even record multitrack straight to eternal USB drive, no computer needed

I have to say, I think all digital desks have their issues, I only use mine in a studio environment and so far its been great, thought I am aware that there are problems out there.

That said, in hindsight it was a bit OTT for my needs, but it looks cool !    

Heartfeltdawn

Build your own PC. It's ridiculously easy and cheaper than you'd think. I'll always stay PC as I don't like the Mac OS. 

spark240

Heartfeltdawn said:

Build your own PC. It's ridiculously easy and cheaper than you'd think. I'll always stay PC as I don't like the Mac OS. 

Yes...this has been said many times but...I don't have the inclination or the time to do it, and then if it doesn't work i wont know how to fix it !

 

ecc83

spark240 said:

Heartfeltdawn said:

Build your own PC. It's ridiculously easy and cheaper than you'd think. I'll always stay PC as I don't like the Mac OS. 

Yes...this has been said many times but...I don't have the inclination or the time to do it, and then if it doesn't work i wont know how to fix it !

 

In any case I thought you wanted a laptop?

If not a home build desktop is not as daunting as it once was. I type this on an Asus MOBO I bought off from 'Zon as a package with an AMD 3.5G 6core processor. I also paid top whack for Windows 7 Home P 64 bits but there are cheaper options.

I would suggest a package. MOBO/CPU/ram . I saw an Asus MOBO+i5+8G Crucial at about £380 today on the web . Still need a case+PSU+optical drive+HDD but I reckon £450 would get you a blinding computer.

So long as you still have a working PC to get help with, you really should have no bother. This is my second build and all went far better with this than the first just 3 years ago.

If you want an off-the-shelf PC or lappy I can recommend HP as I have both and they do music very well.

Dave.

spark240

ecc83 said:

spark240 said:

Heartfeltdawn said:

Build your own PC. It's ridiculously easy and cheaper than you'd think. I'll always stay PC as I don't like the Mac OS. 

Yes...this has been said many times but...I don't have the inclination or the time to do it, and then if it doesn't work i wont know how to fix it !

 

In any case I thought you wanted a laptop?

If not a home build desktop is not as daunting as it once was. I type this on an Asus MOBO I bought off from 'Zon as a package with an AMD 3.5G 6core processor. I also paid top whack for Windows 7 Home P 64 bits but there are cheaper options.

I would suggest a package. MOBO/CPU/ram . I saw an Asus MOBO+i5+8G Crucial at about £380 today on the web . Still need a case+PSU+optical drive+HDD but I reckon £450 would get you a blinding computer.

So long as you still have a working PC to get help with, you really should have no bother. This is my second build and all went far better with this than the first just 3 years ago.

If you want an off-the-shelf PC or lappy I can recommend HP as I have both and they do music very well.

Dave.

Hi, the laptop was indeed my initial priority, however as things have moved in this is no longer the case. 

Grunfeld

spark240 said:

( never had a Mac) OR custom audio PC from someone like Scan or Inta Audio.

Opinions?   

My recording PC is from Scan.  Very happy with it, and I'll probably go back to Scan when the time comes for another one.

Yep, I could have put it together a bit cheaper myself but like you I didn't have the time or the desire to do that particularly.  I wanted to choose my specs and have someone put it together for me.

spark240

Grunfeld said:

spark240 said:

( never had a Mac) OR custom audio PC from someone like Scan or Inta Audio.

Opinions?   

My recording PC is from Scan.  Very happy with it, and I'll probably go back to Scan when the time comes for another one.

Yep, I could have put it together a bit cheaper myself but like you I didn't have the time or the desire to do that particularly.  I wanted to choose my specs and have someone put it together for me.

Excellent !  Can I ask what spec you ended up with?

Grunfeld

spark240 said:

Excellent !  Can I ask what spec you ended up with?

Sure, although bear in mind this is a few years old now so you can probably get something much more nippy these days.  However, it really is fast enough for me (cos I've had some slouches in the past), and by that I mean it's like if I want to do something it just seems to do it and I don't get irritated, I can just get on with making music.  Right, it says here on the system bit of Control Panel (and I'm dunce with these things) :

Windows 7 professional
Intel core i7 CPU 975@3.33GHz 3.37 GHz
RAM 12.0 GB
64-bit operating system

Got three drives for Windows, music samples, and recordings

And I use an Edirol FA-66 external sound card/ audio interface

spark240

Well ...Id say that's pretty good even by today's standard?

What software are you using?

Grunfeld

spark240 said:

Well ...Id say that's pretty good even by today's standard?

What software are you using?

I genuinely don't know what today's standards are -- that PC is about three years old (which always used to be an eternity for computers so I don't know if that's changed), and because (I feel) Scan did a such a good job at giving me what I wanted after I'd chatted with them, (they were very helpful btw), I've not even looked at anything else yet.

As for software I'm using Reaper as my DAW.  It's not better or worse than anything else, it just happens to have the workflow that I like.  I still really miss Sonar in a way, I liked that, but it let me down at some upgrade or other and that's when I moved to Reaper and have had no reason to change back.

I've a bunch of VSTs.  Dunno what others think but because I guess I've been using computers for music for about 10 years you really get fond of some and it doesn't matter that they are old.  I've got stuff which is ancient but is still great (and of course I've let all the ancient crap go).  And modern stuff... some is great, some is crap. 

spark240

Good info...thanks, I will look at Scan some more. 

imalone

BilliBob said:

I would love to get the presonus studiolive desk etc but refuse to go that route due to the Firewire scenario.  Cant for the life of me understand why they are not going usb3.  Simply crazy to expect people to go thru the getting a compatible PC just for their product.
The moment they do offer usb3 I will be buying.
Best of luck whichever you choose.  Personally would be PC for me not Mac but thats just a personal choice.
I really would love to have presonus explain clearly why they are still using firewire.  Just seems a bit mad to me.

Firewire has been around for ages and is long established as a standard for off-board (not PCI) video and audio, USB 2 is not great for this kind of thing, USB 3 is much newer and there's probably not been enough of a push or need for pro audio with it, while consumer stuff is stuck at 2 because it doesn't have the same requirements.

ecc83

"I really would love to have presonus explain clearly why they are still using firewire.  Just seems a bit mad to me." ...Didn't see The Writing on The Wall and have a LOT of bits left BB?

Firewire was a PITA for audio for many years. The TI chipset would fix most issues but not much help to laptop users! A good deal of current computers will be without FW ports and I understand even with some mac products you need a Tbolt cable and adaptor?  But the biggest downside to Fussywire is that you cannot use it anywhere but the rig at home!

USB 2.0 has come of age thanks to the likes of RME  and to some extent MOTU.

I too am waiting for a "prosumer" USB3.0 interface but it seems no one is interested in developing a generic USB 3. 0 audio controller as yet?

Dave.

spark240

ecc83 said:

"I really would love to have presonus explain clearly why they are still using firewire.  Just seems a bit mad to me." ...Didn't see The Writing on The Wall and have a LOT of bits left BB?

Firewire was a PITA for audio for many years. The TI chipset would fix most issues but not much help to laptop users! A good deal of current computers will be without FW ports and I understand even with some mac products you need a Tbolt cable and adaptor?  But the biggest downside to Fussywire is that you cannot use it anywhere but the rig at home!

USB 2.0 has come of age thanks to the likes of RME  and to some extent MOTU.

I too am waiting for a "prosumer" USB3.0 interface but it seems no one is interested in developing a generic USB 3. 0 audio controller as yet?

Dave.

Dave,

I dont quite understand? There are loads of  YouTube vids showing it being used at live venues, albeit with an Imac mini usually. 

Danny1969

ecc83 said:

"I really would love to have presonus explain clearly why they are still using firewire.  Just seems a bit mad to me." ...Didn't see The Writing on The Wall and have a LOT of bits left BB?

Firewire was a PITA for audio for many years. The TI chipset would fix most issues but not much help to laptop users! A good deal of current computers will be without FW ports and I understand even with some mac products you need a Tbolt cable and adaptor?  But the biggest downside to Fussywire is that you cannot use it anywhere but the rig at home!

USB 2.0 has come of age thanks to the likes of RME  and to some extent MOTU.

I too am waiting for a "prosumer" USB3.0 interface but it seems no one is interested in developing a generic USB 3. 0 audio controller as yet?

Dave.

Er firewire is still the pro standard, I've used it for 12 years and never had a problem. In the days before computers were USB 2 we recorded to external firewire harddrives rather than USB (still do actually) and out of the 3 digital desks I use now 2 are firewire .

Even with non Apple laptops I've had no problem. With my Tascam DM4800 I can track 32 channels simultaneously to my Dell Latitude XT laptop via firewire 

ecc83

"Er firewire is still the pro standard, I've used it for 12 years and never had a problem. In the days before computers were USB 2 we recorded to external firewire harddrives rather than USB (still do actually) and out of the 3 digital desks I use now 2 are firewire .

Even with non Apple laptops I've had no problem. With my Tascam DM4800 I can track 32 channels simultaneously to my Dell Latitude XT laptop via firewire "

Yes Danny, quite agree but in the "prosumer" market FW is all but gone.

The protocol was never very common on all but the most expensive PCs and is now almost never seen  (MOBOs might have a 1394 header but few have the ports).

Almost all the AI mnfctrs in the Home Recording/semi-pro project recording market have replaced their FW models with USB versions. The top end have used both protocols e.g. RME and MOTU.

I am not knocking Firewire (tho it WAS a big problem for consumer audio and PCs some 5 years ago and if you got a FW earth loop? GHYa!) just that it has all but gone from the hobby recording scene. Yes, there is a TBolt adaptor but it is an extra cost and does not feed full DC power through. TB is also still confined to macs AFAIK?

Dave.