Any Keys Players? - Thinking of learning

Danny1969

For quick home practice one of the big plastic Yamaha keyboards with the built in speakers is ideal as you don't need an amp. I paid £45 for mine on Ebay

For Live I use a Roland Juno G which is a pretty versatile workstation but not too expensive. I have to say as handy as real hardware keyboards are I haven't heard any with as good a piano as my midi keyboard plugged into Protools running the free mini grand. Same for brass which is why you see a lot of guys using VI's live. Too much effort for me though

Assuming you know some theory on guitar it's quite transferable to keys so it's mainly the motor skills that would need a lot of practice. I expect you could play some stuff more or less straight away 

monquixote

I've been pondering what to get. 

Initially I was thinking I'd go straight in and just buy something pro as I don't expect to fail if I set my mind to something.

Of everything out there I think the Roland VR-09 would be the perfect thing for me as it focusses on what I'm interested in (Piano, Organ and analogue synth), but it's quite a hefty investment. 

In terms of something cheaper the Triton Taktile looks cool as a rather groovy controller with some of the sounds of the old Triton included though it doesn't really look like it's designed for stage use as it only has a 1/8" output. The MX49 as @rich75 mentions also looks like a sound investment. 

The more I think about it though the more what @Danny1969 says makes sense. I'm quite tempted to get something basic and Yamaha like the NP11 to learn on as you can't underestimate the imediacy of something with speakers in and then when I'm ready to play out get something compact like a Microkorg or Ultranova. 

bigjon

I have a nigh-on 20 years-old Roland A90 stage piano for my main playing / practising instrument in the home. For gigs / jam-nights I take a Roland AX09 Lucina, only 3 octaves and no key-weighting but it's all I need for the job, plus I can play it as a keytar if I'm feeling ironic ;-) 

BigMonka

Someone I work with has been teaching himself keys by using a youtube channel which has a piano version of guitar hero. So it shows the keyboard along the bottom and then coloured bars drop down the screen and you play those notes when they get to the keyboard at the bottom. It's quite a fun and quick way to start playing songs although it doesn't give you the basic knowledge of what you're doing.

The youtube channel is called HDpiano if you're interested in something to supplement 'proper learning'.

hywelg

I'm thinking of doing the same, but for a different reason. I desperately want a real B3 and Leslie, would probably settle for an M-100 or similar. But it would mean I'd have to commit to learning properly.

Got to get rid of a load of guitar gigging gear first though.

monquixote

I was once more reminded why bricks and mortar music shops are dieing yesterday. 

Went in my local music shop. The type that sells a few of each kind of low end instrument at vastly inflated prices presumably to parents that can't be arsed to shop around. They had about 4 staff members all of whom were stood around not doing anything.

Stood by the keyboard section for about 10 minutes doing my best "I want to buy a keyboard" look to no avail. Eventually walked up to the counter and said "Hello" the lad behind the counter just said "Hello" and then just stood there blankly like he couldn't work out why I was talking to him. After explaining that I might like some help buying a keyboard they sent someone over to help me. 

They only seemed to do Casio and what I've learned is that I don't want a "Basic" keyboard as the keys feel absolutely horrible compared to a proper piano. I looked at a high end Casio digital piano which did look and sound very nice, but I was told it was £650. It seems to be as far as I can tell £400 on Thomann so though I'm happy to pay a bit more in a real shop that seems totally mental (though based on her cluelessness she might have just been wrong). 

I said it's a shame you only do Casio as I can't compare and contrast and she said "We also do Roland" and then proceeded to show me the same Casio again, but this one had a hand written sticker on it saying it was a Roland. At this point I said "Thanks for your help" and walked out.

stickyfiddle

Sounds about right. FWIW I have a Yamaha P85 that I paid about 300 for a couple of years ago. There's no need to break the bank as long as you get weighted, full-size keys.

Dominic

I have played piano /keys for 40 plus years and guitar for 10 yrs -I play both in my band

The right teacher could get you going with what you need to know quite quick but you will not have the manual fingerskill to do anything especially clever -this really is years of muscle memory etc

The skill of a good piano player or any musician is to find their place in the mix be it a full lush chord voicing,a stab chord or one single note .......................it would take you a very long time to be a decent chord melody piano /keys player that could keep a cocktail bar entertained with a one man musical version of a song in the same way as it would take a long time to be able to do this on guitar like Tommy Emmanuel fingerstyle but for chord pads,fill -in and emphasis /doubled work you should be able to be taught quick

If you are N London I would be happy to get you going

bingefeller

Why don't you get a USB keyboard to learn on?  I got a cheap Korg Nano Key on Amazon and it's pretty good.  

monquixote

Dominic said:

I have played piano /keys for 40 plus years and guitar for 10 yrs -I play both in my band

The right teacher could get you going with what you need to know quite quick but you will not have the manual fingerskill to do anything especially clever -this really is years of muscle memory etc

The skill of a good piano player or any musician is to find their place in the mix be it a full lush chord voicing,a stab chord or one single note .......................it would take you a very long time to be a decent chord melody piano /keys player that could keep a cocktail bar entertained with a one man musical version of a song in the same way as it would take a long time to be able to do this on guitar like Tommy Emmanuel fingerstyle but for chord pads,fill -in and emphasis /doubled work you should be able to be taught quick

If you are N London I would be happy to get you going

Alas I am not in London or I would have taken you up on that.

Interesting to know your opinions and tallys with what I was hoping.

monquixote

bingefeller said:

Why don't you get a USB keyboard to learn on?  I got a cheap Korg Nano Key on Amazon and it's pretty good.  

I've been that route before and ended up giving it away. I don't have very much time so having to switch on the PC and dick about loading up plugins etc will kill it for me.

hubobulous

I use MIDI guitar live with either my Axon AX100 or Roland GR20. For filling out rhythms, it's great.

robinbowes

hubobulous said:

I use MIDI guitar live with either my Axon AX100 or Roland GR20. For filling out rhythms, it's great.

I must get my MIDI guitar going. I have a Jap strat with a Floyd Rose on that has GraphTech Ghost pickups. I've got most of the gubbins I need to finish it, but never quite got round to it...

One day... one day...

Nomad

Piano and organ/synth keyboards feel different (weighted and non-weighted). Trying to play piano stuff on a non-weighted keyboard feels wrong, and vice-versa. If you want to play piano and organ/synth sounds, but do it with only one keyboard, pick the type of board that you're going to use the most and accept the compromise for the other stuff.

For messing around at home (the only keyboard playing I've ever done), I like piano the most, even though I'm not especially into piano music, and certainly don't see my self as a pianist (even an aspiring one). I think it's the dynamic feel that makes the difference - the weighting of the keys works with how you apply the force to vary the volume and attack. Velocity sensitive synth type keys don't feel the same - you have to think more about applying more force and it all seems a bit artificial. At the other end of the scale (ho-ho) is non-velocity sensitive, which essentially means organ. Getting a keyboard that does 'proper' organ stuff with drawbars or stops can be pricey - the cheaper ones tend to have a few examples of organ sounds and thus miss the main thing about organs, which is being able to dial/slide/switch in a huge variety.

You kinda need to decide on what sort of real keyboard sound/type you're primarily interested in and then see what your options are, not only in selecting something to cover that, but in terms of what it can offer regarding other sounds that don't normally go with the feel of the keyboard.

Nomad

hywelg said:

I'm thinking of doing the same, but for a different reason. I desperately want a real B3 and Leslie, would probably settle for an M-100 or similar. But it would mean I'd have to commit to learning properly.

Seek out an A-100. Same as a B3 internally, but usually much cheaper (merely a kidney, rather than an arm and a leg). Rather than spindly legs, it has an enclosed base/stand (fixed - looks more like a C3 with its modesty panels) which is basically a built-in Hammond Tone Cabinet (a power amp driving two 12" speakers, and a second amp driving a third speaker with reverb). There are hookup kits of various sorts for connecting it to a Leslie - you can switch out the main power amp and run through the Leslie, but still have the reverb amp running.

Be advised - they're big fuckers and weigh about the same as an upright acoustic piano (200 kilos or so). And do plenty of research before committing to anything - there were lots of varieties of Leslie over the years, and not all were good, or compatible with the A-100.

Flink_Poyd

Well I bought a teeny Akai LPK25 this week to plonk around on, I'm under no illusions as to what it can and can't do but I now have to squeeze in relearning keys as well as guitar.
Kids love playing on Garageband with it and the wife now sees "a keyboard" which may evolve into something more substantial if I wring any sounds out of it. *cough*microbrute *cough *

Nomad

The Microbrute is rather good. Proper old-school mono analogue synth sounds with the addition of MIDI. The two octave range on the keyboard is a bit limiting, but the board itself is decent enough (certainly not the worst mini keyboard I've used), Comes into its own with full size keys and more octaves.

The sequencer is handy - like a DIY arpeggiator, so educational for the kids (hint, hint). It's good fun getting a sequence running (either built in, or from an external MIDI source), and playing around with the sounds, morphing them as you go. Also does some really nice lead/melody sounds.

Flink_Poyd

I paid £20 for the Akai and as limited as it is its great fun to dick around with keys again. Got a few free Audio Units for Logic Pro tha are pretty good, its a great way to spend a lazy Sunday just plonking around. I used to make the odd track here and there which has stirred up a lot of old memories, money well spent!

Snap

Mon - do it. That's the first thing I'd say.

Second, get a digital piano as its a better thing to learn on (than a controller) full stop.
Get a weighted keyboard too. I got my daughters a Casio Previa, and its very good to play. But there are equally good options from Korg and Yamaha. Do the obvious, find your budget and read up, buy one. FOr a new player, there won't be much in terms of feel between whatever you buy at a given pricepoint. Buying blind wouldnt phase me.

Learning keys is great for your overall skill in music IMO. ANd I'd get lessons for sure.

You will probably find that you will spend a lot of time practising technique and dexterity. It's a very difficult discipline to playing guitar, especially if you've played geet for a long time. However, IMO again, it's easier to see the relationship between notes on a keyboard. That could be because I learnt piano from an early age and only started on the guitar at 14, after maybe 8 years on the piano.

Lastly, if you go the digial piano route, you can always hook it up to your computer as a controller.

DO it!