Vibrato

shaunm

I have a problem applying vibrato to string bends when I am pushing the string up. When I am pulling the string down I have no issue and on a unbent note I have no issue at all. I have spent a good amount of time practicing and really working on this but I just can't seem to get it just right, I always lose the correct pitch of the note when attempting to apply vibrato. 

As a work around I slide up to the "correct" note and play it as normal. 

Has anyone else suffered from this? I know hand strength has something to do with this but I would have hoped that practice and changing gauge strings would have helped but it doesn't seem to have done. 

Apparently I read Robben Ford suffers this also and I have tried to hear it in his playing but I feel I could be trying to excuse my inability here.

Any advice?

Phil_aka_Pip

David Gilmour is a master at this, I am useless. I assume it's because he either put the work in or is naturally good, whereas I haven't and am not. However, I do believe that even them that can't do it to begin with, can get closer to doing it by regular practice - which is what I've learned from the regular practice of other things that I once thought I just couldn't do.

I wonder if it would be easier on lighter gauge strings? Put 9s on a guitar you don't use much, see if you can do it on that, then go back to your usual guitar and try it.

shaunm

This is true, I love DG and he really is one of the best. I wonder how much he did have to work on that?

I have tried changing strings but I may go back to a really light set. Good advice.

My playing in general is not grounded in good technique but one area I have made a conscious effort to work on over the last month or two is my vibrato. I am not a very fast player so I try to do what I can with the notes I do play.

I have worked on slowing my vibrato right down and speeding it up to get a nice wide Angus type of sound. I am not saying I have mastered it but it's improving but the string bend thing? It just sounds horrible to my ears, not controlled at all.

MatthewShreddery

It's one of the hardest techniques to master.

PRACTICE PRACTICE PRACTICE!

String gauges around 9/10 help.

Be sure to allow your fretting hand thumb to come over the top of the fingerboard - baseball bat grip - this will enable you to squeeze the neck by opposing the thumb with the fingers, making bending easier.

shaunm

Thank you @MatthewShreddery
Good advice with the thumb over the top, I will make a real effort to keep it there.

The type of music I play just sounds better with this technique nailed so I need to keep at it.

It's funny because I have played for years but I've never been overtly concerned with technique. I have always just been happy to play. As I now start trying to build up my technique I find I am having to really start at the beginning and take baby steps.

MatthewShreddery

Another thing to focus on is to bend by turning the wrist/forearm. Not by pushing with the fingers.

The fingers stay in whatever position you have them in. They stay rigid. The turn of the wrist is what moves the string.

This applies to vibrato too, as, in this case it is multiple consecutive string bends in quick succession.

slacker

I'm not an expert and all the above advice is good. I made the mistake of buying Let There Be Rock again (had it on vinyl when it first came out). So having tried to replicate it my advice is...

1 Dont try to copy Angus or Kossoff but develop your own style (YMMV)

2 Mine is to bend up a semi tone until you hit the note and then gradually add some vibrato. As I practice/get used to it I add more wobble.

3 I#ve not done this in public yet I am getting used to it/muscle memory etc

4 I also vary it it by using the classical/side to side vibrato on unbent notes (but I've been playing fretless and double bass for some time.

5 Keep going.

Catthan

I'm also trying to improve mine; I haven't regained all my wrist and finger strength after a long injury so what helps me is a Clapton like vibrato like you can see him do particularly in older 60's vids where it's more exaggerated. I think a lot of it comes from the forearm which helps and suits me as it's not too fast.

Make sure you can bend to pitch and hold the note first before doing vibrato

Clarky

most folk I see that struggle with vibrato do so because they execute it by bending / straightening the fingers rather than rotating the wrist

shaunm

@Catthan - I have studied his vibrato as 60's Clapton is one of my favourite players.
What I can't seem to make work is the way he bends and adds vibrato. He seems to let go of the next and shake from his elbow almost.

Catthan

It looks like it's from the elbow doesn't it? That's what I meant by forearm 

And yes, bend to pitch, release any unnecessary fingers and move the elbow. That's how I go at it anyway. And that's why it's important to be able to bend to pitch and hold it as once the elbow takes over there's less room for minor adjustments.

The nice thing about it is that you can do wide vibrato for longer. Not easy tho, and it takes time.

Sometimes I nail it and sometimes, most times rather, I don't. Takes time..

Branshen

Have you seen this Guthrie video? May be of some use to you.

Around the second half of the video. Basic idea is to bend it sharp slightly to overcompensate slightly for perceived drop in pitch when you vibrato a bent note.

shaunm

@Branshen God, he is some sort of wizard I'm sure of it. What a great teacher he is though because there's some great ideas in there

thomasross20

Anybody ever been to a guitar clinic like that? 

I used to help out at IGF so got to sit in on some lessons which was cool. Fancy doing something like that again but solely as a student next time. 

shaunm

I'd love to go to one

shaunm

Guthrie's method actually really works for me. I've just spent the last hour at it and bending a little sharp really helps

Clarky

Gurthie's technique demonstrates the method is pointed out in my previous post..

bending and vibrato come from a rotation of the wrist

viz

I went to one with Jennifer Batten which was really good.

strumjoughlamps

thomasross20 said:

Anybody ever been to a guitar clinic like that? 

I used to help out at IGF so got to sit in on some lessons which was cool. Fancy doing something like that again but solely as a student next time. 

I remember meeting you, Rockbabe and Bowksy at IGF Paul Gilbert concert...you just stood up pointed at me and said 'IT'S STRUM'  lols ...great times.

thomasross20

Haha yeah they WERE great times!!! Man, I've got to come out of my cage up here in Scotland.... I was very impressed with Paul Gilbert too (obviously!). 

Jen Batten - that would be cool!!

viz

Clarky said:

Gurthie's technique demonstrates the method is pointed out in my previous post..

bending and vibrato come from a rotation of the wrist

Exactly. It reminds me of one of those executive toy stainless steel galloping horses that rock on a plinth. Clapton's method of letting go of the neck and pulling down almost from the elbow is really odd and uncontrollable, it reminds me of someone bouncing on a tightrope. I like doing Vai's method, it reminds me of how my dentist used to tell me to brush my teeth.