Another experiment - Andyjr1515 finally flipped???

Andyjr1515

OK - now I know you all think I'm crazy to start off with, but this might confirm everyone's suspicions...

Ref my Walnut EVH re-body thread, I'm pre-empting a question not been asked yet by its owner...

What he HAS asked me is to see the body, finished but absolutely BEFORE I apply any finish to it at all.  

He knows that the present intention is Tru-oil applied a la @WezV.  

He also knows exactly how that comes out because this commission came about as a result of him seeing his mate's (and his band's bassist) walnut bass rebody that I did a few months ago:

  

...but I think he's going to ask me what would the possibility be of having no finish whatsoever, to retain the natural wood colour:

While it seems a terrible shame not to make the most of the wonderful figuring, he has always said he wants an un-fussy look...and I can see the attraction of the build looking like that if it was at all possible.

So - his request to see the unfinished body may be nothing to do with this at all but, in the meantime, I've done a couple of experiments on the offcut from the billet used on this build.

My thought process is:

• All conventional finishes change the colour of natural wood to some extent.  Varnishes and lacquers will darken the wood in the same way as wetting it.  The buffed tru-oil method less so but still a tangible darkening against sanded but otherwise untreated wood
• Even clear beeswax deepens the colour of many woods markedly
• Same happens with leather when you apply dubbin or similar
• But not if you apply nu-buck / suede protector spray. It does when it's wet, but when it's dried there is no discolouration at all

OK - I think you're ahead of me

So, pre-empting a question that may never be asked - I applied tru-oil to one half (not buffed yet, so it will lighten a little) and nubuck spray protector to the other.  When the latter was wet, the two sides looked identical, but 5 mins later:

Like magic, the identical wet-tainting on the right disappears and leaves it just like it was never there in the first place.

So IS it there?

Take one drop of water, and drop it on the 'untreated' wood:

No idea how long this would last / how easily it would rub off / how effective on greasy fingers / etc / etc , but if the guy ABSOLUTELY wants that colour and is not bothered by the high risk of progressive staining, worth the experiment?

Anyone done something similar or found a proven protection that does not change the colour at all?

Andy

Megii

I do kind of understand where your client is coming from - having done a few builds myself, I do find there is a certain something about the look/feel of bare wood. But I've got to be honest and say that IMHO it would be total insanity not to use a finish such as Tru Oil on a bit of walnut with figuring like you've got there. I repeat - total insanity.

hobbio

I thought about Never Wet, but it can apparently change the appearance of some materials. It lightens things up rather than darkening them though.

ThePrettyDamned

Interesting idea!

I thought you were going to suggest micro meshing it to 12000 grit. I did a wudtone finished neck and worked all the way up, just to see what would happen, and the rosewood board on the sides look like polished brown glass, despite being unfinished. Maybe you could do that first, then apply the spray as a protector?

10thumbs

I always prefer wood with a finish as it brings out the grain more.

WezV

i think its the wrong way to look at it.   Finish doesn't alter or darken the colour of the wood.  It reveals the true colour of the wood.

The walnut will look best with its natural colour revealed  - it will be stunning

Andyjr1515

I've sent the guy this photo which, as @WezV said on the main thread, if this doesn't convince, then nothing will:

...and it is quite likely I am misinterpreting the request to see the unfinished body.

Interesting experiment all the same because there are times you do want to protect but not change the colour at all 

Megii

@Andyjr1515 - no more than a thought, but when I did my walnut strat build, I was after something of a naturalistic look for the wood, although I did also want to make the most of the figuring and grain, and deepen the colours. I suppose kind of a polished wood look in a way. Anyway, I used Tru Oil, which did it's thing, but then also used the "stock sheen & conditioner" stuff that Birchwood Casey make. It's designed to be used on Tru Oil (after the Tru Oil has been allowed to cure for at least 2 weeks) - it's basically a bit like a very fine/gentle T-cut liquid kind of stuff, and it just takes away some of the glossy reflective sheen, leaving more of a "natural" satin kind of look. The colours and grain of the wood are still enhanced of course.

I do remember that because I deliberately hadn't used any grain filler, that "using the stock sheen & conditioner stuff" left fine white abrasive powder in the grain depressions - which was a bit worrying, but I found that it came out easily using a toothbrush with sugical spirits, and no ill effects on the finish...

Andyjr1515

Hi, @Megii Yes - I remember your build very well....beautiful! I've also used the conditioner - it does a great job of turning a shine into a sheen . Walnut is a great, great wood, isn't it... and especially with tru- oil

JudasVigilante

The above photo @Andyjr1515 (about 3 up) would convince anyone towards a finish. I could see someone looking a lesser wood or 'different' wood unfinished. But Walnut, it's an easy choice for anyone. Beautiful work btw @Andyjr1515.

Hope you're good mate and glad to see the man who first helped me out here on the FB is still going strong producing amazing guitars. 

Take care mate,

Paul

Andyjr1515

Thanks, Paul

bluechargeboy

@Andyjr1515, you might want to try the stuff that Washburn uses on N4 necks:

"We now use a concoction we make here. I buy Lemon essence, which is pure pressed lemon oil. Google “Essential oils” and find some. You can get a pint for about $16. You won’t need that much. We then heat the lemon oil on a hot plate and melt in Bee’s wax. We use a 2” square cube of bee’s wax for every pint of oil. The wax will take a while to melt, but will melt completely into the oil. Let it cool over a few of hours and it will start to thicken. Once it thickens up use it to finish the neck. The oil will get into the wood and condition it, but in doing so it carries the wax down into the wood fibers. The wax prevents the wood from drying out, and skins over on the top surface to prevent debris from working into the wood. Polish it up with a cotton cloth when you have enough worked in and it should be very smooth and very fast feeling."

I have used this on necks and have owned N4s with it on the body. It does not darken the wood very much at all but does make it look, feel and smell lovely!

I believe Washburn use tung oil on the N4 bodies.

Andyjr1515

Hi @bluechargeboy. Thanks - interesting stuff!

WezV

everything will darken walnut a bit - its very thirsty.  its not comparable to maple which is one of the few woods that can stay near its pale raw wood colour

Andyjr1515

The Man from Del Monte............. he say YES!!!!!!!!!!  \:D/