Acoustic Gig Setup

steamabacus

thomasross20 said:

M80 sounds best to me (by a country mile) - still a bit magnetic when hitting the treble strings but I don't think you can get away from that when using a magnetic pickup.

This is why I recommended a mic in front to complement the sound (if the situation allows and, of course, you'll have to sit still in front of it). It's been by far the best 'cheap and cheerful' combination in my experience.

ICBM

thomasross20 said:

What do you guys think of Taylor and Martin electros? 

Must admit I prefer Martin. The OMCP series looks good, electronics built in, and the battery compartment can be accessed easily. Going to check it out on YouTube but don't think it will sound as good as my Larrivee (just checking out the Fishman pickup system, it doesn't sound very natural compared to the M80).

Martin, by a mile. I detest the newer Taylor electros - anything with the Expression System. (Although I have not yet tried the totally redesigned version.) Earlier Taylors with Fishman electrics are OK.

The Expression System is unreliable, is not compatible with any parts from any other maker or even the newer Taylor one, can't easily be replaced with something else because nothing else fits, gives you enough control to annoy the soundman but not enough to be useful if you're doing it yourself, has a poor signal-to-noise ratio unless used in balanced mode (not always useful or what you want), and sounds too electric on the plain strings around the 7th-12th frets because it has a magnetic sensor under the end of the fingerboard. Have I forgotten anything? Oh yes, the battery holder sometimes rattles or jams depending on the size of batteries (they vary), and the endpin has a habit of working loose. AVOID.

If you're really after a proper electro, also check out Takamine - they set the benchmark and still do in some ways. Make sure it's one of the professional-series models with the square preamp box on the shoulder. Takamine are very good for having made this unit forwards and backwards compatible, and have said they always will - that's a huge reassurance that it will be replaceable or upgradeable for as long as you own the guitar. Cheaper Taks aren't in the same league though.

I know what you mean about the Fishman Rare Earth - to me it sounds thinner and less natural than the Baggs. It does work very well when added to an existing Fishman Prefix system though.

IanSavage

ICBM said:

 

The hole is 12mm (1/2") not 9mm… that's quite a big hole to put in a guitar if you don't know how best to do it without splitting anything.

Oh, okay - the self-contained jack I just fitted to my Tricone (supplied with a Schatten TC Player) was definitely 9mm (well, the instructions specified 3/8", but I only had metric bits); guess you just gotta check the directions you get with whatever you buy!  

ICBM

IanSavage said:

Oh, okay - the self-contained jack I just fitted to my Tricone (supplied with a Schatten TC Player) was definitely 9mm (well, the instructions specified 3/8", but I only had metric bits); guess you just gotta check the directions you get with whatever you buy! 

I wish they all were, it would make drilling acoustics for pickups much less invasive and risky - surprisingly so for a difference of only 3mm. The standard Switchcraft barrel jack that comes with Fishman and Baggs systems (and most others) is 12mm though.

PolarityMan

Danny1969 said:

The best solution for acoustic gigs is the Bose L1 system. You set it up behind you, it's crystal clear and radiates around the whole room, you don't need monitors as it's behind you. it's small. light, easy to set up. 

The Fishman SA220 is another alternative, not as good as the Bose but smaller still. 

The lead singer in my main band has both the above for his acoustic live lounge and solo gigs. He's earnt a fortune out of it.  

Not enough grunt for our full electric band but when we borrowed one it is awesome from a sound dispersal / fidelity point of view.

thomasross20

I did read Danny's (and everybody else's) comment(s) - the reviews for that were pretty damn good.

John_P

Just a thought,  but having followed the struggle you've been through with your cover band, it might be an idea to hang on until you are sure this is going to work.   As I understand it, you met the new singer thinking it would be to form a band and have already had problem getting her to reply to messages now it has turned into an acoustic duo.     

Are you sure you want to be in a duo? Is she any good on stage?  etc    Personally I'd be sure about these things before I spend more money on gear. 

thomasross20

I know what you're saying ... I think maybe I should get a pup in the acoustic regardless? But yeah, I've thought the same, believe me!

thomasross20

Great site for acoustic pickup comparions:

http://www.dougyoungguitar.com/pickuptests/

thomasross20

The "Lyric" is hands-down the best sound there.... it's a mic though.

It's active, no big bar across the sound hole... think this looks pretty good. Also easy to install. Who's tried one?

I think it'll be a no-go just due to feedback resistance.

http://www.musicradar.com/reviews/guitars/lr-baggs-lyric-575944

What a pain in the @rse acoustic pickups are.

stickyfiddle

I haven't used an M80, but I gigged (& rehearsed) a Taylor 214 with an M1A for 18 months and it was excellent. Not perfect sound, but every bit as good as you need for live, in a mix. Never had to change the battery either.

All these guys have used them too, so it's hardly like they're "bad" kit!!

http://c1.zzounds.com/media/fit,2018by3200/quality,85/KeithUrban-907702ef908351c5e7a132f62a0af8b9.jpg

http://www4.pictures.gi.zimbio.com/Coldplay+Perform+Carling+Brixton+Academy+1uVFKY_sLAsl.jpg

http://static.guim.co.uk/sys-images/Music/Pix/pictures/2010/3/26/1269621226447/Noel-Gallagher-live-in-Lo-001.jpg

http://www.gilmourish.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/12/gdansk_guitars2.jpg

thomasross20

Fair point!

I'd love to try each system but it's never gonna happen...! 

p90fool

I get excellent results with the M1 passive into a Zoom acoustic pedal, which I just use for DI/tuner/volume.

No batteries and very little feedback. I was going to buy the M1A but when I tried them back-to-back the passive just sounded better.

thomasross20

The passive does sound better from the videos I've watched

ICBM

It does need some sort of outboard preamp or buffer if you're going directly to a PA though. A decent DI box will be fine, but otherwise the impedance will be too low and it will sound poor. A buffered tuner pedal should also work.

thomasross20

I guess with a passive one there's no worrying about when the batteries are going to run out.

p90fool

Well I would've run my mains powered DI/tuner anyway, so buying the cheaper and better-sounding passive was perfect for me.

I wouldn't be surprised if most of those earlier pics of big names using M1s were actually passives. Batteries are a pain for guitar techs and they'll doubtless be using decent preamps anyway.

thomasross20

I still haven't heard back from this singer so the earlier post cautioning me to hold off on this (which I agree with) is right - let's see how it pans out... (doesn't sound hopeful)

thomasross20

Like I said in Rough Gigs thread.... singer has pulled out due to being too busy and having other ventures. 

Gutted. What is the point, is there something wrong with my playing or attitude? So despondent about it all now. COmplete album then sell off all my bloody gear

thomasross20

I just don't get it. She seemed very eager (other than lack of comms) - she said she thought the playing was great, loved what I did on the album (let her listen to most of it) and had loads of ideas for stuff we could do. Obviously I'm not such a musical catch. 

So angry and disappointed