Help me get started...........

Blueingreen

I want to get a home studio started from scratch.  The main reason is a band I used to be a songwriter in wants to reform, but there will be difficulties getting everyone together in the same room regularly enough to write and arrange new material so the hope is we can do a lot of the preliminary work via demos.

I have no experience of home recording and am mildly technophobic (or more accurately a bit techno-hopeless).

I do have some decisions already made:

For reasons not related to this project I'd prefer a Dell PC.  I don't know much about which models are best for music though.

I will be buying some version of Ableton Live, because a fellow band member is using that and will help me get started.  I don't know if I should start with intro with a view to upgrading later or move straight to a fuller version.

I know I need speakers and an audio interface but I don't know anything about which ones to buy.

I'm confused about Midi, which I've never used.  Will I need a keyboard as a Midi controller?  (I have no keyboard skills).  Which one should I get?

Budget:  is reasonably flexible but I need to be a bit cost-sensitive because my concern is I fail to make real headway and it ends up gathering dust in the corner of a room.

Any advice very much appreciated.

ecc83

You lakky BOY! One of the best interfaces ever made, the Native Instruments Komplete Audio 6 is presently available for just £139 (till Jan 1 I think)

The AI gives you two superb microphone/line/guitar inputs plus two more balanced line inputs, digital in and out and MIDI I/O. The interface has very solid, unfussy drivers and I have tried mine on XP. W7, W10 even the ghastly Vista. I know it also works on macs and even Linux. I cannot see a Dell being a problem*.

I am also going to suggest something controversial and don't normally say. Buy a small, two mic input mixer as well. Behringer Xenyx 802 (not the USB version) is fine or there are very good units by Yamaha, Mackie..... I am sure you will find a mixer very useful with a couple of the guys round for a jam and to lay down some tracks. You will need at least two sets of closed back headphones and the Sennheiser HD202 are quite good enough at this stage at about 15quid a pop.

Do you have any mics so far? If not at least look at a Shure SM57 (vocals and cabs) and one, preff two Small Diaphragm Capacitors (aka condenser) . These can be used on acoustic guitar, drums and V and C as well.

Some stands and a rake of cables and you can get started. No, you don't need a MIDI kbd as such but something with pads to smack can be handy.

Last thing for now, explore Cash Generator type shops, I have had several decent bits of kit from them over the years.

*Naturally go for the fastest processor you can and at least 4G of ram. At least one USB 3.0 port would be invaluable since a great future investment would be a USB 3.0 drive both to back up songs and keep the on board HDD uncluttered.

If you are up to it, remove all anti virus software from the Dell and replace with Msoft Security Essentials also use the free Malwarebytes once a week or so.

Dave.

Blueingreen

Thanks Dave.  I've ordered the interface you suggested from Amazon and am digesting the rest of your advice.

I agree about the truly awful Macafee.  I think I can get if off assuming I go Dell.  The reason for the Dell is I'm thinking of using it as an emergency back-up machine for business use, some of the business software I use doesn't run on a Mac and Dell are pretty good if you have issues while the machine is under guarantee.

spark240

Personally I wouldnt put anything other than music on my studio Mac, keeps it nice and clean.

Novation Impulse are good priced midi keyboard controller, or Nektar, both probably less than £100 used.

There are some cheap Behringer headphone amps out there also.

Ive gone Presonus all round, I just find it "works" but it wont come in at the budget at the moment.

Good luck and we hope to hear your choons soon !

Blueingreen

Thanks for input guys, have now ordered the following:

Dell Inspiron 7559

Komplete Audio 6

Shure SM 57 and stand

2 x KRK RP5G3-NA Rokit 5 Generation 3 Powered Studio Monitors

Novation Impulse Midi Keyboard 

Just the software and some cables to go and I hopefully have enough to get started.

spark240

Nice Xmas present that lot !

Blueingreen

Yeah I hope so.  Bit nervy about taking the plunge because my half-hearted attempts to get going with home recording in the past have led nowhere.  This time I've bitten the bullet and spent a bit of money on it.  I hope that gives me the motivation to make sure I make it work this time.

Winny_Pooh

Ableton is better geared to electronic music and sample based songwriting.

Reaper is the best value DAW out there and works on most platforms and they have a great user base. 

What and how do you want to record? Any suggestions would be better thereafter.

Blueingreen

The attraction for me with Ableton is that a friend and fellow band member has experience of using it and he has offered to help me set everything up and get started.  We'll also be doing some recording using his system.  I've struggled to get off the ground in previous attempts to get going with home recording so it's a big deal for me that I'm getting this ihelp.  It could make the difference to my chances of getting up and running.

OTOH I do have some reservations if Ableton is better geared to electronica and sample-based stuff, because that's not what I'll be doing.  I had an old school approach when songwriting for this band before.  Broadly I'd come up with a chord sequence, a vocal melody (which I had to teach to a singer) and lyrics.  I'd usually have some ideas about arrangement, but not the finished article. I'd communicate what I had to the band and it became the starting point for a collaborative arrangement, with the understanding that whoever came up with the original idea had ownership and final say.  

The initial idea is that I want to create demos that mean the band can come in at a later stage in the development of the music, so we don't need to spend so many hours with everyone in the same room to get an arrangement we're happy with.  The last line-up was vox, guitar, bass, keys, drums and 2 horns and I expect it will be similar.  Style-wise I'd describe the music as jazz-inflected pop.

I haven't ruled out the idea of eventually being able to create something more finished, in fact that's quite an exciting idea, but the short to medium term goal is decent quality demos that musicians can work from.

Winny_Pooh

What are you actually planning to record?
Is it acoustic guitar and vocal? A bit of electric guitar and bass? Sampled drumbeats on top?This determines mics and a few other things.

Blueingreen

Might be all of the above.  Vocals, electric guitar, bass, some sort of drum pattern, keys, horns.  We'd be looking for something that as far as possible incorporates all the ingredients of a finished arrangement without needing to be polished enough to go on the radio.  I picture it as a sketch pad, lets stick in this synth line on to help us decide if it would work as a vocal harmony part etc,

One feature is we will be forwarding files for other people to work on - eg I might sing a guide vocal but only so it can be replaced once the singer does his bit which will normally be later because we live too far away from one another to get together more than occasionally.

spark240

Blueingreen said:

Might be all of the above.  Vocals, electric guitar, bass, some sort of drum pattern, keys, horns.  We'd be looking for something that as far as possible incorporates all the ingredients of a finished arrangement without needing to be polished enough to go on the radio.  I picture it as a sketch pad, lets stick in this synth line on to help us decide if it would work as a vocal harmony part etc,

One feature is we will be forwarding files for other people to work on - eg I might sing a guide vocal but only so it can be replaced once the singer does his bit which will normally be later because we live too far away from one another to get together more than occasionally.

We use Dropbox for exactly this...

ecc83

Re Ableton etc, don't forget that the KA6 comes with a "lite" but still pretty powerful version of Cubase?

The learning curve is really no steeper than the others and there is arguably no better software for MIDI plus of course they INVENTED VST!

Yes, get Mcafee and other stuff off the computer but many, very serious studio people  have internet capable recording computers these days. I would not use any form of Wi fi just a simple copper Ethernet cable twixt laptop and router which can be unplugged if needs be (tho' in nearly 10yrs I have never felt the need)

Worth too having a browse over at Home Recording and Sound on Sound forums.

Dave.

Blueingreen

For various reasons using an ethernet cable won't be an option it'll have to be wireless.

I did notice that the KA6 came with Cubase but I suspect it's going to come back to the same thing, I've struggled with this stuff before so I'm better to stick with the one someone can give me hands-on help with.  I imagine once you've go up and running with one program it will be easier to experiment with others.

Winny_Pooh

Blueingreen;908184" said:

Might be all of the above.  Vocals, electric guitar, bass, some sort of drum pattern, keys, horns.  We'd be looking for something that as far as possible incorporates all the ingredients of a finished arrangement without needing to be polished enough to go on the radio.  I picture it as a sketch pad, lets stick in this synth line on to help us decide if it would work as a vocal harmony part etc,

One feature is we will be forwarding files for other people to work on - eg I might sing a guide vocal but only so it can be replaced once the singer does his bit which will normally be later because we live too far away from one another to get together more than occasionally.

I would still use Reaper as its internal Logic applies to most DAWs, Ableton is its own thing so perhaps demo both before you commit.

The Komplete interface will inculde some built in sounds but see if it has a step sequencer for basic drum beats, otherwise you will have to find one or use your controller to play the drums into the DAW to then snap to grid and fix later. (The drums bit is the biggest learning curve)

Tracking vox and guitar to a click is the simplest. An sm57 is ok for electric guitar cabs but If I had to pick one overall demo mic then it would be a Sennheiser MD-421. You can add a good condenser later if you are not tracking in a reflective box room. I still prefer a good dynamic for demos for utility and ease.

You should alse get a set of closed back headphones for the actual tracking.