Keep HRD III and mod it?

BintyTwanger77

I love my Roland JC40, but I have to admit it, I do miss having a tube amp, especially as my TV Jones pickups sounds so f***ing good through them.

I presently have a HRD III in a shop on consignment and the shop haven't managed to sell it for me yet. I'm just wondering that, for the return I'm going to get for it, why not just take it back from the shop and mod it with one of those Fromel kits or something?

I think I can justify it, as having both a solid state and a tube amp is very useful, and because of the drop in value by selling it.

Is the Fromel mod the best one for a HRD III, or can anyone suggest another? @ICBM?

Richardj

What don't you like about it and want to modify?

randomhandclaps

OK - two things.  Firstly it depends on what you are hipping to achieve by modding it.  Secondly the Fromel mod is a.) A pretty generic mod, information about which is available in countless places online and b.) Overpriced for a handful of parts so don't buy it separately.

TheMarlin

get yourself over to Omega Amps website.

They sell mod kits for Fender Hot Rod amplifiers.  I had a heavily modified HRDeluxe, and selling it has been by far my biggest gear sale regret ever....

To put this into context, I also had a Tone King Imperial 20th Anniversary (point to point hand-wired version).   An epic amp, that did sound more lush and detailed than the modded Fender, but the Fender had something more that suited me personally.  There was something in the pick attack, and breakup tone that really set my pants on fire.  

Buy a kit, get the upgrades done, I swear it'll kick all kinds of ass. Mine had three channels, Fender Blackface, Plexi and Dumble.  I REALLY miss that amp.  I think about it every day.  

edit:  I also had a stock HRDeluxe (which I sold to buy the Omega) and a RH Deville 4x10.  They sucked in comparison.

Marlin

BintyTwanger77

@Richardj @randomhandclaps

I find that the volume doesn't taper smoothly (it just leaps up at 2), the bass end sounds really muddy and flubby, the gain stack seems to be pretty poor, as the gain/more gain channels aren't very good, the reverb could be better past 3 on the dial.

Overall I think it's a good amp but it could be really great. I want its tone to be the best it can be. 

BintyTwanger77

@TheMarlin Thanks, really good tip, I'll look into Omega.

randomhandclaps

Check this out for a least and idea of what is possible - http://hotroddiy.com/

Richardj

BintyTwanger77 said:

@Richardj @randomhandclaps

I find that the volume doesn't taper smoothly (it just leaps up at 2), the bass end sounds really muddy and flubby, the gain stack seems to be pretty poor, as the gain/more gain channels aren't very good, the reverb could be better past 3 on the dial.

Overall I think it's a good amp but it could be really great. I want its tone to be the best it can be. 

I thought most of those issues were sorted out with the version III.  Curious as I have the previous version and I was expecting it to have those issues and it doesn't.  It is a fundamentally good amp so is probably worth the effort of modding. 

crunchman

Weber 12F150 speaker is a major upgrade on a stock HRD.  Might be worth trying that before you do much else.

TheMarlin

I loved a Cannabis Rex with it.  I also ran the matching 1x12 cab with a Swamp Thang.  Fantastic combination for thr HR series of amps.

BintyTwanger77

Thanks everyone, some great advice, ideas, do keep them coming.

ICBM

Richardj said:

I thought most of those issues were sorted out with the version III.  Curious as I have the previous version and I was expecting it to have those issues and it doesn't.  It is a fundamentally good amp so is probably not worth the effort of modding.  

Edited for my opinion .

I don't find anything wrong with the standard Hotrod and I see no good reason to throw money at it, unless you want to change the speaker (which will make the most difference) or possibly valves.

Danny1969

I've done a couple of HRD's with mod kits. In the kit were plate resistors, input 1\4 jack socket, bigger res caps, bigger dropping resistors for the 16V supply and some orange caps and a volume pot. Volume pot was probably worth doing, not so much the rest of it. Best mod I made was putting the 2  x 470R resistors on their own heatsink off the PCB

If your gonna mod the amp yourself be careful as the PCB isn't the best track wise and quite easily damaged if your not quick and precise with a good iron

Richardj

ICBM said:

Richardj said:

I thought most of those issues were sorted out with the version III.  Curious as I have the previous version and I was expecting it to have those issues and it doesn't.  It is a fundamentally good amp so is probably not worth the effort of modding.  

Edited for my opinion .

I don't find anything wrong with the standard Hotrod and I see no good reason to throw money at it, unless you want to change the speaker (which will make the most difference) or possibly valves.

Very fair comment @ICBM. I am quite happy with my older version, but if you have it in your mind to do some modding (necessary or not)  it can be pretty difficult to be persuaded otherwise.  I was just being supportive

Out of interest which speaker would you consider?  The wider interweb is of course full of as many opinions as choices!

ICBM

Richardj said:

Out of interest which speaker would you consider?  The wider interweb is of course full of as many opinions as choices!

I'd consider almost anything except a V30, which sounds pretty poor in it to me - the speaker Fender fitted as an 'upgrade' in some limited edition models of course…

It depends on what sort of sound you're aiming for really. I thought the V30 made the inherent 'shoutiness' of the stock speaker even worse, although I suppose there might be some people who want that. I like the more vintage Fendery options of something like a Jensen or Weber - I'm not particularly keen on trying to make it sound like a Marshall or a Mesa. One very good option if you can find one is the Eminence-made Fender Blue Label which came as stock in The Twin, Super 60, and a couple of the 80s/early90s solid-state amps, which is where I get them if I can find them. I think they sound better all-round with these than anything else I've heard, and I don't normally like Eminences. (NB, it's only the model with the huge vented magnet which is so good, the smaller one isn't.)

Like you I don't find anything wrong with the older HRD ('II' - not the very first version which needed a few minor upgrades, which Fender did) - but I also seem to be alone in actually not liking the HRDIII as much. Hard to put a finger on exactly what's wrong with it, but it seemed blander and less characterful somehow.

BintyTwanger77

I've been offered a cheap but unused still-boxed Eminence Cannabis Rex... ?

ICBM

BintyTwanger77 said:

I've been offered a cheap but unused still-boxed Eminence Cannabis Rex... ?

Give it a try. I'm not a huge fan but I think it's better than the stock speaker. (Not too difficult!) Bear in mind it will need breaking in if it's completely unused. It may sound a bit stiff or harsh initially.

Changing the speaker on the HRD is a bit of a pain though - you have to get the chassis out, and it usually snags on the foil shielding inside the cabinet. The best way to stop it is to remove the end screws from the amp first, but not the top ones yet. Lie the amp down on its front. Then slide a sheet of cardboard like half a cornflake box into the gap at each side (tape it to the cabinet to stop it slipping, if you need to) and that should make it possible to get the chassis out cleanly. You don't have to remove the reverb tank but you will need to undo the cable clip on the cabinet, turn the chassis round and put it down where the cable will still reach.

It's actually easier than that makes it sound, once you've done it the first time.

BenSirAmos

shouldn't you discharge the caps first?

BintyTwanger77

@ICBM Thankfully I don't have to do that myself. Bloke selling it to me works in a guitar shop that was holding my HRD III on consignment, and said he'd bring it to the shop tomorrow and fit it for free. Job done.

ICBM

BintyTwanger77 said:

@ICBM Thankfully I don't have to do that myself. Bloke selling it to me works in a guitar shop that was holding my HRD III on consignment, and said he'd bring it to the shop tomorrow and fit it for free. Job done.

You mean I typed all that passing on hard-won experience stuff for nothing?

BenSirAmos said:

shouldn't you discharge the caps first?

All you need to do is leave the amp on standby for a couple of minutes before turning off and unplugging it - the standby switch is directly after the PT so the caps will discharge through the valves. Not *always* true with other amps though, so you're right to ask.

BintyTwanger77

@ICBM Yes. Yes you did. But thank you!!!