Is there such a thing as a 'dog'?

jimmyguitar

Yeah, not the woofing kind! I mean a crap guitar.

Specifically regarding vintage guitars I read a lot of comments that allude to the fact that there are great ones and dogs.

But couldn't it be the case that the 'dogs' are really just poorly set up? I've played some pretty unremarkable guitars in my time but usually they're the ones in the shop covered in dust with manky, dirty fretboards, worn frets, rusty strings etc etc. Nothing a bit of TLC couldn't fix. 

ICBM

There is, but you're also right that most of them are the result of poor setups and maintenance.

There are still some that just don't resonate right or sound any good no matter how much work you put in - the same as for new guitars. They're at the outer end of the distribution, just as truly great ones are. The majority in both cases are perfectly good.

WezV

yeah, there are definitely ones which are beyond saving... but many more than just need a bit of TLC

octatonic

I did some work for a charity 2 years ago, where members of the public donated guitars in any state and they were to be fixed up and given to schools.
It was my job to decide what the guitars needed in order to make them playable.

There were about 3000 guitars in all- all sorts- everything from cheap nylon string acoustics, steel string acoustics and every the of electric including some nice archtops.
About 1/3rd of them were utter junk- completely beyond repair in any real sense- they were binned.

There were more than 1000 that needed a new set of string, a clean up and a setup but otherwise fine.
There were a few worth over £500, which I believe were to be sold in order to fund cheaper guitars to be distributed to schools.
The rest needed to things like machine heads, new bridges, saddled, nuts, electronics repairs etc.

Sassafras

Some guitars can have warped necks, dead spots and lifeless, dull lack of resonance. Not much to be done in those cases. 
That applies to new as well as old.

blueskunk

Like others have said, mostly it's a set up thing but... some woods are better than others and  some woods mothers are also better than other woods mothers. 

IvisonGuitars

I have a '77 Custom Telecaster that has a neck pocket like a wizards sleeve, manufactured from the finest concrete and covered, frets 'n all with thick poly goo.

The neck wide range humbucker sounds like you are shouting into a bucket and the bridge pickup will strip paint off walls.

It's been to 2 techs and still comes back shite. I refuse to spend anymore money on it.

It's everything that's bad about a CBS Fender and my bench mark of a dog.

However, its shortly going to be in the classifieds with a flowery description of being from the 'CBS Golden Era' for £3k....

Bridgehouse

miserneil said:

I have a '77 Custom Telecaster that has a neck pocket like a wizards sleeve, manufactured from the finest concrete and covered, frets 'n all with thick poly goo.

The neck wide range humbucker sounds like you are shouting into a bucket and the bridge pickup will strip paint off walls.

It's been to 2 techs and still comes back shite. I refuse to spend anymore money on it.

It's everything that's bad about a CBS Fender and my bench mark of a dog.

However, its shortly going to be in the classifieds with a flowery description of being from the 'CBS Golden Years' for £3k....

First dibs on that - it sounds perfect!

I really need something for turning over the garden what with winter coming and all...

IvisonGuitars

Bridgehouse said:

miserneil said:

I have a '77 Custom Telecaster that has a neck pocket like a wizards sleeve, manufactured from the finest concrete and covered, frets 'n all with thick poly goo.

The neck wide range humbucker sounds like you are shouting into a bucket and the bridge pickup will strip paint off walls.

It's been to 2 techs and still comes back shite. I refuse to spend anymore money on it.

It's everything that's bad about a CBS Fender and my bench mark of a dog.

However, its shortly going to be in the classifieds with a flowery description of being from the 'CBS Golden Years' for £3k....

First dibs on that - it sounds perfect!

I really need something for turning over the garden what with winter coming and all...

Mate, I can't sell it.....I don't want to inflict it on anyone else, it wouldn't be right...

Sassafras

miserneil said:

I have a '77 Custom Telecaster that has a neck pocket like a wizards sleeve, manufactured from the finest concrete and covered, frets 'n all with thick poly goo.

The neck wide range humbucker sounds like you are shouting into a bucket and the bridge pickup will strip paint off walls.

It's been to 2 techs and still comes back shite. I refuse to spend anymore money on it.

It's everything that's bad about a CBS Fender and my bench mark of a dog.

However, its shortly going to be in the classifieds with a flowery description of being from the 'CBS Golden Era' for £3k....

Not the finest sales pitch I've heard.

Jez6345789

Reverse psychology if ever I heard or the runt of the litter strategy. Ha ha

Jez6345789

The good new is I have been try to get "shouty into a bucket tone for years" lol

IvisonGuitars

Jez6345789 said:

Reverse psychology if ever I heard or the runt of the litter strategy. Ha ha

Nope, it's genuinely total shite!!

marantz1300

miserneil said:

I have a '77 Custom Telecaster that has a neck pocket like a wizards sleeve, manufactured from the finest concrete and covered, frets 'n all with thick poly goo.

The neck wide range humbucker sounds like you are shouting into a bucket and the bridge pickup will strip paint off walls.

It's been to 2 techs and still comes back shite. I refuse to spend anymore money on it.

It's everything that's bad about a CBS Fender and my bench mark of a dog.

However, its shortly going to be in the classifieds with a flowery description of being from the 'CBS Golden Era' for £3k....
i think you must give it to the poor
meaning me

Bridgehouse

miserneil said:

Bridgehouse said:

miserneil said:

I have a '77 Custom Telecaster that has a neck pocket like a wizards sleeve, manufactured from the finest concrete and covered, frets 'n all with thick poly goo.

The neck wide range humbucker sounds like you are shouting into a bucket and the bridge pickup will strip paint off walls.

It's been to 2 techs and still comes back shite. I refuse to spend anymore money on it.

It's everything that's bad about a CBS Fender and my bench mark of a dog.

However, its shortly going to be in the classifieds with a flowery description of being from the 'CBS Golden Years' for £3k....

First dibs on that - it sounds perfect!

I really need something for turning over the garden what with winter coming and all...

Mate, I can't sell it.....I don't want to inflict it on anyone else, it wouldn't be right...

To be honest I feel sorry for it now... Like a rough scarred limping rescue dog..

ICBM

miserneil said:

I have a '77 Custom Telecaster that has a neck pocket like a wizards sleeve, manufactured from the finest concrete and covered, frets 'n all with thick poly goo.

The neck wide range humbucker sounds like you are shouting into a bucket and the bridge pickup will strip paint off walls.

It's been to 2 techs and still comes back shite. I refuse to spend anymore money on it.

It's everything that's bad about a CBS Fender and my bench mark of a dog.

However, its shortly going to be in the classifieds with a flowery description of being from the 'CBS Golden Era' for £3k....

You could probably turn it into a good guitar if you stripped it, lined the neck pocket, recontoured the body properly (upper bout, on a Tele), finished it in something thin, and replaced the original 1M pots with 250Ks.

I did more or less that to a '77 Strat once - with a bridge replacement rather than pot replacement since Strats never got the 1M pots but did get crappy alloy bridges - and it turned it into a really nice guitar. It took around a pound and a half off the weight, I think.

It also probably halved its "value".

musicman100

jimmyguitar said:

Yeah, not the woofing kind! I mean a crap guitar.

Specifically regarding vintage guitars I read a lot of comments that allude to the fact that there are great ones and dogs.

But couldn't it be the case that the 'dogs' are really just poorly set up? I've played some pretty unremarkable guitars in my time but usually they're the ones in the shop covered in dust with manky, dirty fretboards, worn frets, rusty strings etc etc. Nothing a bit of TLC couldn't fix. 

The problem is that it's a very subjective area.
What you might think is a dog the next guy might love it.

IvisonGuitars

ICBM said:

miserneil said:

I have a '77 Custom Telecaster that has a neck pocket like a wizards sleeve, manufactured from the finest concrete and covered, frets 'n all with thick poly goo.

The neck wide range humbucker sounds like you are shouting into a bucket and the bridge pickup will strip paint off walls.

It's been to 2 techs and still comes back shite. I refuse to spend anymore money on it.

It's everything that's bad about a CBS Fender and my bench mark of a dog.

However, its shortly going to be in the classifieds with a flowery description of being from the 'CBS Golden Era' for £3k....

You could probably turn it into a good guitar if you stripped it, lined the neck pocket, recontoured the body properly (upper bout, on a Tele), finished it in something thin, and replaced the original 1M pots with 250Ks.

I did more or less that to a '77 Strat once - with a bridge replacement rather than pot replacement since Strats never got the 1M pots but did get crappy alloy bridges - and it turned it into a really nice guitar. It took around a pound and a half off the weight, I think.

It also probably halved its "value".

Na, it's all original so I'll just hang on till one on the frontmen of some new indie darlings starts using one and then bang it on eBay at an inflated price....I missed the boat with Franz Ferdinand last time... 

**EDIT** And yes, before you say it @ICBM, I know Alex played a twin humbucker Deluxe.... ;-)

IvisonGuitars

Bridgehouse said:

miserneil said:

Bridgehouse said:

miserneil said:

I have a '77 Custom Telecaster that has a neck pocket like a wizards sleeve, manufactured from the finest concrete and covered, frets 'n all with thick poly goo.

The neck wide range humbucker sounds like you are shouting into a bucket and the bridge pickup will strip paint off walls.

It's been to 2 techs and still comes back shite. I refuse to spend anymore money on it.

It's everything that's bad about a CBS Fender and my bench mark of a dog.

However, its shortly going to be in the classifieds with a flowery description of being from the 'CBS Golden Years' for £3k....

First dibs on that - it sounds perfect!

I really need something for turning over the garden what with winter coming and all...

Mate, I can't sell it.....I don't want to inflict it on anyone else, it wouldn't be right...

To be honest I feel sorry for it now... Like a rough scarred limping rescue dog..

You've described the sound of the neck humbucker to a T there @Bridgehouse....

Bridgehouse

@miserneil For goodness sakes man, swap those pups out - or give it over and let us swap them out.. Shurly it can be saved.

Or just shoot the bugger.

IvisonGuitars

Bridgehouse said:

@miserneil For goodness sakes man, swap those pups out - or give it over and let us swap them out.. Shurly it can be saved.

Or just shoot the bugger.

I reckon, if I took the pickups out and cut it in half, I might be able to get to down to around 8lbs in weight....