Should TFL maintenance workers get a final salary pension

capo4th

The RMT hold commuters to ransom in London how do they get away with these constant strikes to get what they want?  

The cost of these pensions will run into billions all paid for by long suffering London commuters. 

Dont know about you but I have to look after my own pension.

This strikes me as an unbelievable gravy train......

http://www.rmt.org.uk/news/rmt-secures-massive-victory-on-tube-lines/

Sporky

I think final salary pensions are a good thing.

holnrew

Instead of asking "I'm not getting this, why should they?", ask "They're getting that, why aren't I?".

It's good to have other employers offering this. As soon as they're not offered by anybody, there's no incentive to.

Roland

A couple of years ago I encountered a similar strike picket as I arrived at a London mainline station. He asked the man in front of me "Will you support us in our fight against this Government?" The man replied " So you want to retire at 60, which means that I will have to pay more tax, which means that I will have to work until I'm 70? Fuck off out of my way."

Garthy

holnrew said:

Instead of asking "I'm not getting this, why should they?", ask "They're getting that, why aren't I?".

It's good to have other employers offering this. As soon as they're not offered by anybody, there's no incentive to.

Why aren't we? because most private sector companies cannot afford it. We fought as hard as we could to keep our FSP and the management simply showed us the accounts and said if you can make the figures work then it's all yours.

mgaw

Roland said:

A couple of years ago I encountered a similar strike picket as I arrived at a London mainline station. He asked the man in front of me "Will you support us in our fight against this Government?" The man replied " So you want to retire at 60, which means that I will have to pay more tax, which means that I will have to work until I'm 70? Fuck off out of my way."

thats playing into the hands of those who make obscene profits keep them for themselves and dont feel looking after workers is worthwhile, dividng and conquering...instead of beiing so pissed off with the strickers why dont you get pissed off with the real villians of the piece

earwighoney

Roland said:

A couple of years ago I encountered a similar strike picket as I arrived at a London mainline station. He asked the man in front of me "Will you support us in our fight against this Government?" The man replied " So you want to retire at 60, which means that I will have to pay more tax, which means that I will have to work until I'm 70? Fuck off out of my way."

I fucking hate RMT so much.  An absolute bunch of cunts.  

They had a strike as a driver was sacked for being drunk on the job. 

RMT don't give a shit about their customers interests, be it safety or anything else.

John_P

holnrew said:

Instead of asking "I'm not getting this, why should they?", ask "They're getting that, why aren't I?".

It's good to have other employers offering this. As soon as they're not offered by anybody, there's no incentive to.

Wisdom.  

When we had teacher strikes all I heard was moaning about needing someone to look after the kids.     We are heading towards a recruitment crisis in many public sector professions thanks to the self interested who should be supporting people standing up against cuts and ideology driven changes.

holnrew

Garthy said:

holnrew said:

Instead of asking "I'm not getting this, why should they?", ask "They're getting that, why aren't I?".

It's good to have other employers offering this. As soon as they're not offered by anybody, there's no incentive to.

Why aren't we? because most private sector companies cannot afford it. We fought as hard as we could to keep our FSP and the management simply showed us the accounts and said if you can make the figures work then it's all yours.

They're just more beholden to shareholders than the people who actually make the company what it is.

holnrew

Roland said:

A couple of years ago I encountered a similar strike picket as I arrived at a London mainline station. He asked the man in front of me "Will you support us in our fight against this Government?" The man replied " So you want to retire at 60, which means that I will have to pay more tax, which means that I will have to work until I'm 70? Fuck off out of my way."

Yet you wouldn't get to work if he didn't do his job.

Roland

mgaw said:

Roland said:

A couple of years ago I encountered a similar strike picket as I arrived at a London mainline station. He asked the man in front of me "Will you support us in our fight against this Government?" The man replied " So you want to retire at 60, which means that I will have to pay more tax, which means that I will have to work until I'm 70? Fuck off out of my way."

thats playing into the hands of those who make obscene profits keep them for themselves and dont feel looking after workers is worthwhile, dividng and conquering...instead of beiing so pissed off with the strickers why dont you get pissed off with the real villians of the piece

Which one is the villain? The train driver/guard/manager who was on strike, the union rep who organised it, or the commuter struggling to look after his family?

axisus

Roland said:

mgaw said:

Roland said:

A couple of years ago I encountered a similar strike picket as I arrived at a London mainline station. He asked the man in front of me "Will you support us in our fight against this Government?" The man replied " So you want to retire at 60, which means that I will have to pay more tax, which means that I will have to work until I'm 70? Fuck off out of my way."

thats playing into the hands of those who make obscene profits keep them for themselves and dont feel looking after workers is worthwhile, dividng and conquering...instead of beiing so pissed off with the strickers why dont you get pissed off with the real villians of the piece

Which one is the villain? The train driver/guard/manager who was on strike, the union rep who organised it, or the commuter struggling to look after his family?

None of them. The butler did it

mgaw

Roland said:

mgaw said:

Roland said:

A couple of years ago I encountered a similar strike picket as I arrived at a London mainline station. He asked the man in front of me "Will you support us in our fight against this Government?" The man replied " So you want to retire at 60, which means that I will have to pay more tax, which means that I will have to work until I'm 70? Fuck off out of my way."

thats playing into the hands of those who make obscene profits keep them for themselves and dont feel looking after workers is worthwhile, dividng and conquering...instead of beiing so pissed off with the strickers why dont you get pissed off with the real villians of the piece

Which one is the villain? The train driver/guard/manager who was on strike, the union rep who organised it, or the commuter struggling to look after his family?

those that ruthlessly and very succesfully exploit an increasingly unfair market led economy fot their own obscene gain..all of those you mentioned are victims, me thinks you have missed the "big" picture of our and many other ages, those few with so much laughing at the rest of us squabbling amongst ourselves

Myranda

Isn't everyone getting a FSP one of the prime reasons Greece had such a crap economy?

Maybe we should allow more FSPs but restrict the time you're allowed to be around claiming them/

Axe_meister

At the end of the day the worlds populations is increasing and the worlds wealth is no longer concentrated in the west.
We can't have it all. FSP and large annual pay rises and low inflation and low interest rates and a perfectly funded MHS and low unemployment.
Now the whole TFL business is like a mini mafia to be honest. You can't get in ubnless you are introduced to a union rep. Half the staff are way overpaid for what they do.

Roland

mgaw said:

Roland said:

mgaw said:

Roland said:

A couple of years ago I encountered a similar strike picket as I arrived at a London mainline station. He asked the man in front of me "Will you support us in our fight against this Government?" The man replied " So you want to retire at 60, which means that I will have to pay more tax, which means that I will have to work until I'm 70? Fuck off out of my way."

thats playing into the hands of those who make obscene profits keep them for themselves and dont feel looking after workers is worthwhile, dividng and conquering...instead of beiing so pissed off with the strickers why dont you get pissed off with the real villians of the piece

Which one is the villain? The train driver/guard/manager who was on strike, the union rep who organised it, or the commuter struggling to look after his family?

those that ruthlessly and very succesfully exploit an increasingly unfair market led economy fot their own obscene gain..all of those you mentioned are victims, me thinks you have missed the "big" picture of our and many other ages, those few with so much laughing at the rest of us squabbling amongst ourselves

I used to work in the rail industry. I didn't recognise anyone who fits that description. Who are you thinking of?

mgaw

Roland said:

mgaw said:

Roland said:

mgaw said:

Roland said:

A couple of years ago I encountered a similar strike picket as I arrived at a London mainline station. He asked the man in front of me "Will you support us in our fight against this Government?" The man replied " So you want to retire at 60, which means that I will have to pay more tax, which means that I will have to work until I'm 70? Fuck off out of my way."

thats playing into the hands of those who make obscene profits keep them for themselves and dont feel looking after workers is worthwhile, dividng and conquering...instead of beiing so pissed off with the strickers why dont you get pissed off with the real villians of the piece

Which one is the villain? The train driver/guard/manager who was on strike, the union rep who organised it, or the commuter struggling to look after his family?

those that ruthlessly and very succesfully exploit an increasingly unfair market led economy fot their own obscene gain..all of those you mentioned are victims, me thinks you have missed the "big" picture of our and many other ages, those few with so much laughing at the rest of us squabbling amongst ourselves

I used to work in the rail industry. I didn't recognise anyone who fits that description. Who are you thinking of?

again I was talking of a bigger picture, although Mr Branson seems to be of that ilk

holnrew

There's a culture of profit before people, from the top to the bottom. We play into the hands of the corporatocracy by allowing ourselves to devalue our own labour by following their trail of breadcrumbs. If we stop pushing back we get pushed right up against the wall. Admittedly the amount of immigration into this country doesn't help matters, but it's not the root cause of the problems, it's a distraction while everybody races to the bottom. I don't really know what the answer is, other than a new approach to unionisation. Union has become a dirty word, and not without reason.

Sambostar

fields5069

Everyone should get one, or no one should get one. I remember (not fondly) joining Ericsson back in 1993 - flexitime, 40/60 final salary pension. life was grand. Er, for about 2 years, then it all went to pot. 

Chalky

A maintenance worker joins TFL at 30, retires at 55 on FSP.  25 years working and his life expectancy is another 25 years.  So that pension scheme is like contributing more than half his pay packet to his pension from the day he started.  There is no way that is affordable long term, except by commuters paying for it.