Kemper? Nae for me....

BintyTwanger77

Until today, I'd only ever tried a Kemper on headphones before, but today the lovely folk at GG let me try one through a cab (with a Fryette power amp).

I can completely see the benefit in having so many great amp profiles (and some decent FX) in one easily portable head or rack unit. It must be heaven for any amp tech on tour to only have to deal with one of these.

However I tried it (at a decent level) and it just didn't do it for me at all. This is no criticism of Kemper at all, it really is the best digital amp emulation money can buy. I think it just proves that at heart I can't do without valves and tubes. If I ever start guitar gigging then I'd probably invest in a good two channel tube head for ease (I don't drive), but today suggests strongly that digital amp modelling is not for me, though when the next new bit of kit comes along, happy to have my tastes challenged.

simonk

It's all down to the profiles though. A lot of the stock ones are pretty lame and there are so many of them it's bewildering to sort out the good from the bad. It comes alive with a few well made and respected commercial profiles though. All IMO of course.

BintyTwanger77

simonk said:

It's all down to the profiles though. A lot of the stock ones are pretty lame and there are so many of them it's bewildering to sort out the good from the bad. It comes alive with a few well made and respected commercial profiles though. All IMO of course.

One thing I will say is that the clean profiles are a lot better than I thought they'd be. I don't know why I didn't take to it, Simon, but maybe you're right, it's worth exploring some more profiles, but for the moment valve is still king for me.

Jalapeno

Probably better to get some driving lessons first rather than another amp !

Sassafras

You could always get a motorbike.

Cabicular

I'm confused by this TBH. The Freyette is providing a Valve power section (which is where the action is for valves in my opinion) Certainly with the Helix this gives me the best of both worlds. I'm surprised its not the same with the Kemper

sweepy

Similar setup in some ways, Axe-Fx into Marshall 20/20 and a pair of FR/FR  Yamaha monitors, the valve amp does add a certain something 

steveh

I went amp shopping with a mate a couple of years ago. Like the OP, we tried the Kemper at GG and really liked it.
We then went and tried a Lazy J20. No contest. We both bought the Lazy. Limited, one-sound, cumbersome etc etc, but it sounded so much more 3D and responsive. Different planet.
I was one of the first in the UK to get an Axe-FX. Same deal. I returned it.  
Like the OP, I'm not at all trolling or flaming here, and I appreciate that these things are fabulously convenient and real swiss army knives but, IMHO, if you want that nth degree of complexity and response etc, then you still need the real thing.

ruoma

Modelling still feels very flat to me. Kemper, line 6, in the box...

BintyTwanger77

Again, it's not me knocking digital amp-modelling at all, the technology is mind-blowing, it's just my ears prefer valves and tubes.

professorben

BintyTwanger77 said:

Again, it's not me knocking digital amp-modelling at all, the technology is mind-blowing, it's just my ears prefer valves and tubes.

There is some observational bias though, I bet if you had a blindfold challenge ala Andertons, you would be hard pressed to pick which was which or even a preference.

It sounds like you are being influenced by your desire to prefer traditional amps. 
which is of course no bad thing. 

I also like big heavy loud valve amps in the same way that I would prob love a Kemper, but I have the former due to:
1) I found an amp I like with the features I want 
2) I don't fly anywhere or even gig much so weight is no issue 
3) I don't have £1600 spare 

those are the main reasons I run valves. 

Jack_

Too many variables to dismiss the Kemper so easily.

Both profiles, and the output method (cab, frfr etc) heavily influence the end sound.

I love my Kemper, if I lose 1-2% off the top end compared to the real thing, then that's a worthwhile trade off for me personally, to have pretty much every amp ever at my disposal.

I am young-ish, though, so I never grew up with big valve amps, so there's no nostalgia/creature comfort nor do I have an amp or two that I absolutely adore, so I prefer the versatility.

Fiftyshadesofjay

In my opinion, the Kemper through a real can is not it's forte. It can sound good but it's not as good as a valve amp.

When you take that out of the equation and play it through a killer PA or studio monitors then it's unbeatable. 

Obviously not everyone will use it like that, and if you're one of them I'd tell you not to bother as well. 

crunchman

I can see both points of view.  I own a Kemper and I also own a Lazy J.  They are both great.

It's nicer to play through the Lazy J, but it's 10:30 at night and my daughters are in bed.  It's the Kemper that's currently switched on.

The other thing is the versatility.  Much as I love the Lazy J, it's nice to have something like Princeton as well, and there are times when it's nice to put a JCM 800 profile on and rock out.  The Lazy J takes drive pedals well, but good as it is, it won't sound like a JCM 800.

I've been trying to get rid of one or two other real amps but I don't currently plan to ever get rid of my Lazy J.   Having said that, the Kemper gets used a lot.

The other thing to bear in mind is what it sounds like to the punter.  I've probably said this in at least 8 different Kemper threads, but the first time I ever saw a Kemper was with a US band playing over here.  I'd seen them the previous year in the exact same venue with the same PA.  The first time, the guitarist was using a Marshall half stack.  The second time he had a Kemper.  The front of house sound was a lot better with the Kemper.

monquixote

I found playing with an Amplifire into the pa quite boring but I got loads more compliments on my tone.

p90fool

crunchman said:

It's nicer to play through the Lazy J, but it's 10:30 at night and my daughters are in bed.  It's the Kemper that's currently switched on.

That's an absolute monster price to pay for a late-night headphone practice amp!

ICBM

Is it wrong that I have absolutely no interest in the Kemper at all?

Not because I don't like digital, but because I have zero interest in emulating dozens of different amps, classic or otherwise. I can't even be bothered to listen to a demo - it would tell me nothing useful. I tend to dial all amps in to sound the same, or as close to it as I can - one good clean sound, one good overdriven sound, done. I don't really understand the obsession with having different amps, other than for functionality.

peteri

ICBM said:

Is it wrong that I have absolutely no interest in the Kemper at all?

Not because I don't like digital, but because I have zero interest in emulating dozens of different amps, classic or otherwise. I can't even be bothered to listen to a demo - it would tell me nothing useful. I tend to dial all amps in to sound the same, or as close to it as I can - one good clean sound, one good overdriven sound, done. I don't really understand the obsession with having different amps, other than for functionality.

That's interesting, recently as I've said on here - I spent Kemper money on a home use combo (Carr).

I thought so much about the Kemper, in many ways it made sense.

But I'm the same - I have no interest in all these amps, my dream number of sounds are:

1. Clean Fender (rarely used)

2. Driven SRV Fender

3. AC/DC Plexi

4. JCM 800

I can get all of these with my Carr and two pedals, arguably one pedal to be honest - and I can avoid programming.

And have no technology related issues (updates, resale etc)

digitalscream

ICBM said:

Is it wrong that I have absolutely no interest in the Kemper at all?

Not because I don't like digital, but because I have zero interest in emulating dozens of different amps, classic or otherwise. I can't even be bothered to listen to a demo - it would tell me nothing useful. I tend to dial all amps in to sound the same, or as close to it as I can - one good clean sound, one good overdriven sound, done. I don't really understand the obsession with having different amps, other than for functionality.

There are other less-obvious benefits to the Kemper.

For example...the Victory Kraken. I love the Gain I channel for rhythm - it's full-sounding and exactly "right" for me - but it doesn't have enough gain for solos. However, Gain II loses a lot of the low-end.

Solution? Profile Gain I through a Kemper, and just add gain for the second "channel". Instant fix, and suddenly the result is better than the original (for me, at least).

To my ears, having profiled the amp on its own with a DI box, the pure Gain I profile was utterly indistinguishable from the real thing (through the same cab, a Zilla Fatboy 2x12" with V30s) in terms of both sound and feel. The lead sound was much better than the Gain II channel on the real thing.

Then there's the noise gate, which is absolutely stellar.

Oh, how I wish I could afford one right now.

ICBM

digitalscream said:

There are other less-obvious benefits to the Kemper.

For example...the Victory Kraken. I love the Gain I channel for rhythm - it's full-sounding and exactly "right" for me - but it doesn't have enough gain for solos. However, Gain II loses a lot of the low-end.

Solution?

Boss DF-2

crunchman

p90fool said:

crunchman said:

It's nicer to play through the Lazy J, but it's 10:30 at night and my daughters are in bed.  It's the Kemper that's currently switched on.

That's an absolute monster price to pay for a late-night headphone practice amp!

It's not just a late night practice amp.  I use it for recording, and have used it live on occasion.  I want to use it live more.