DSL 401 good/bad/indifferent/alternatives?

rico

I have dug out my old DSL 401 over the weekend and was practicing through it and it took quite a bit of fettling just to get sounding OK. I was playing through the clean channel with a LP and OCD. It sounded a bit harsh when cranked (master at about 3 o'clock) and not very 'open' if that makes any sense at all. I used to gig with it a about 9 years ago and to my 16 year old ears it sounded alright! I've been using the rehearsal studios AC30 VR recently and the same guitar and pedals sounds much better.

Is this just an inherent sound of the amp? What can I do to make it sound better? What alternatives are there? I would love a JCM800 1x12 but at the current prices I can't justify it (well I can, but I can't). Are there decent JCM900 1x12 combos?

Cheers!

ICBM

Difficult question… I'm not sure Marshall have ever made a 1x12" combo which is simultaneously good-sounding, flexible, well-built, reliable, and not too expensive.

Replacing the speaker in the 401 might help, but don't expect a night-and-day change... although something like a G12H-75 Creamback might be worth trying.

I'd probably just get a JCM800 4010 and be done with it. (Which also benefits from a Creamback.)

timmysoft

I've had a few of the jcm900 50w 112 combos, they're pretty good, they at least sound like a big amp, which I always found to be a problem with the dsl40s.

the new dsl40 combo is actually better sounding I think, I dunno about the build but it certainly sounds a bit bigger and warmer.

ICBM

timmysoft said:

the new dsl40 combo is actually better sounding I think, I dunno about the build but it certainly sounds a bit bigger and warmer.

I haven't seen the 40W one yet (which itself may say something about its reliability) but if the 15W is anything to go by it's much better built. It also uses EL34s, unlike the DSL401 - while the power valve type doesn't make a huge difference, it does make some, and I've always thought 2xEL34 is bigger and more open-sounding than 4xEL84. (Likewise with the JCM900s.)

Annoyingly it still has a fairly poor speaker though (Celestion Seventy/80).

crunchman

I played a recent 40W Marshall combo (not entirely sure which model) when trying out a pedal in a shop.  I was pleasantly surprised.  Much better sounding than the old ones.

zepp76

I may be a bit biased but I own a DSL40C and think it is great, as has been mentioned the only thing I may change is the seventy/80 speaker but it is still good enough for me for time being. There are zero reliability issues and I have pretty much used it every day since getting it. It has switchable wattage 20-40w and can happily play at bedroom or club levels. All in all I'm very happy with it but once again I will say the speaker could probably do with being swapped.

HHwarner

I had a DSL 401 for a while, it definitely benefited from a speaker change, I put a Celestion Classic Lead 80 in it. Made quite a big difference. The clean channel cranked sounded quite good with the CL80. I used to use it at band practice cos I did my back in lugging my 2203 and cab. The DSL was cheap enough not to worry about leaving it in the practice room
 

CHrisP86

A dsl combo is on my radar. The new ones certainly seem to get decent reviews.

I was set on a 15 until I realised it had no effects loop!  Now I'm thinking a 5 and possibly modding the shell to fit a 12" speaker so I finally have a use for the Neo creamback I have...

Voxman

I have a 2003 DSL401. Its a pretty good amp but the Marshall forum will tell you to change the speaker to a Vintage 30 (most preferred) or a Creamback.  

But you might not need to. First thing I did was to put a jump lead in to jump the FX loop IN and OUT, and max the fx loop mix.  Immediately the amp became clearer and louder too.  The red distortion channel, previously a little fizzy and muddy, became very useable and all of a sudden the stock speaker sounded quite reasonable.

Because I'm currently using a Vox Tonelab SE through the PA for gigging, and the rehearsal room amps, I don't need to use my own amps so haven't yet swapped the 16 Ohm speaker, and I'm mindful that a Vintage 30 will add a fair bit of weight.  

You can also put an EQ or a BBE Sonic Stomp Maximiser in the fx loop which gives a noticeable sonic improvement although converting the parallel FX loop to serial is even more effective here because you don't get 100% wet-dry mix with a parallel loop.   

So before spending a small fortune on a new speaker, try the above first.  

One thing to be aware of is speaker bolt placings, and that a Celestion replacement will drop straight in. But be mindful that even a slight difference in spacings, e g. Eminence speakers, might prove a real pain as you may have to drill wider spacings in the speaker or refit the bolts.  

Finally, a new set of tubes can give a noticeable improvement and JJs have had a good review on the Marshall forum.

Now, re the DSL40c, these are decent amps that have a couple of extra buttons and the reverb has more range. BUT the EQ is shared..with the DSL401 you have independent EQ across 2 channels and the footswitch enables switching between clean (green), od1 (amber) and od2 (red) which is much more versatile.  Technically the red od2 is a distortion boost and not a third channel, but for gigging you effectively have three channels to switch through.

For me the DSL401 sounds more raunchy/ballsey and the DSL40c is a little smoother/tamer.  I therefore personally prefer the DSL401 to the DSL40c but YMMV.  It's also surprisingly loud with the fx loop db boost..I had to use it as pure backline at an open air gig and I don't think I had it set at more than half! 

mattdavis

Very interested in that fx loop jumper trick. I have the little 201 and will give that a go.....

Voxman

BTW, here's a clip of my DSL401 at the open air gig I mentioned.  We were playing at the Barnet Music Festival in 2014 for charity.  There were PA problems in that the sound kept cutting out, so it was problematic enough for the vocals and couldn't take the strain of guitar amps through the PA too.  This was our last number which turned into a free-for-all with various folk joining us on stage including a sax player and some extra vocalists...and you'll hear the PA drop out and the sound guy rush to fix it!

Anyway, I was expecting my little DSL401 to be miked up through the PA, and if I'd have known about the PA problem and that I'd have to play through a pure backline, I'd have brought my Vox rig with 4x12 speakers.  So, I was worried that the DSL401 with its single 1x12 wouldn't be loud enough or cut through the mix.  But I needn't have worried because even at half power there was plenty of oomph there and it punched through the mix just just fine!

rico

Thanks for the comments guys. @Voxman can you explain a little more about the FX jumper trick please? whats the reasoning behind it?

More comments from JCM800/900 combo owners welcomed please!

Voxman

rico said:

Thanks for the comments guys. @Voxman can you explain a little more about the FX jumper trick please? whats the reasoning behind it?

More comments from JCM800/900 combo owners welcomed please!

Good question and I honestly don't know why it works but I'm sure techs here e.g. ICBM could explain.  All I know is that it works very nicely and gives a dB boost of around (IIRC) 6dB that also gets rid of fizziness.  I think its only parallel loops and certain amps this trick works with, but it's something I learned from the Marshall forum. It's so simple but just makes such a huge difference to the amps tone, crunch quality, and volume.  

ICBM

Basically the parallel loop circuit has slightly more than unity gain, so if you max the mix control you're boosting the amp. I'm not sure if there's much real tone change from the loop circuit or if it's just the result of pushing the next stage a bit harder. This isn't the power stage, it's an earlier preamp stage - on the dirty channel it comes before the final overdrive stage and the tone stack. (So in fact, the loop is not brilliant for use as an actual loop…)

Voxman

ICBM said:

Basically the parallel loop circuit has slightly more than unity gain, so if you max the mix control you're boosting the amp. I'm not sure if there's much real tone change from the loop circuit or if it's just the result of pushing the next stage a bit harder. This isn't the power stage, it's an earlier preamp stage - on the dirty channel it comes before the final overdrive stage and the tone stack. (So in fact, the loop is not brilliant for use as an actual loop…)

Thanks ICBM - it does actually change the tone in that it becomes a little brighter, more transparent/defined and it gets rid of the fizziness - I can best describe it as taking a blanket off the amp so that it can 'breathe'.  The volume increase is also very noticeable.  

What's so weird is that such a simple 'trick' absolutely transforms the DSL401 from 'meh' into a really decent sounding Marshall Amp, even with the stock speaker.  Next year I might try another speaker in it - perhaps a 16 Ohm Celestion Vintage 30.  

I've actually been playing my 401 this afternoon on  the red OD2 'channel' - and I can comfortably play on FULL GAIN (which sounds dreadful without the FX loop jump) with my Epi Sherry II (p/ups are upgraded to Seymour Duncan SH1 59'ers) and its just stonking!