Just done my first neck repair!

thermionic

My mistake - I checked and it was Evo-Stik Wood Glue I had... or PVA as it's sometimes known!

At least I know know that it is definitely different. 

ICBM

dogload said:

@ICBM what do you mean by splint joint? 

http://www.chrislarkinguitars.com/resources/newsletters/clc-newsletter-september-2012.html

Scroll down to 'Tech Bit - Headstock. What again?'

You can do the channels with a chisel, if you don't have the right routing jigs. It will take a lot of patience and care, but it can be done.

octatonic

Kalimna said:

Titebond is a modified class of PVA, called 'aliphatic resin' glue. I dont know the specifics of why it is less appropriate, but I suspect it is to do with molecular adhesion, softness of cured glue, ability to have 'invisible' glue line amongst others.
Given a perfectly executed joint, it is unlikely that bonding strength would be an issue, but perfect joints are not straight forward on finished items.
If you take a look on luthier forums, for instance the MIMF, then hot hide glue is almost universally recommended for luthiery, both primary build and repair for two reasons  
1 - it dries crystal clear and very hard (for acoustically superior joints, so the argument goes)
2 - it is easily repairable (new hot hide glue will adhere well to old hot hide glue, which cannot be said for PVA/aliphatic resins), and 're-jointable' with the application of heat.

Cheers,
Adam

I use hide glue but there are some jobs where it isn't ideal.
It is reversible, yes- that is an advantage for an acoustic guitar bridge.
I don't see that being an advantage, for instance, when gluing head stocking facing woods or- you never need to take them off so why have that component reversible?

The problem with hide glue is the open time- which is seconds.
You have less than 10 seconds to get everything in the right place- otherwise you are reaching for the hair dryer to reopen the glue and it quickly gets messy.
Also hide glue needs to be heated up and kept warm- it is time consuming so there has to be a tangible advantage to doing it.
Some luthiers turn glue almost into a fetish item- virtually no factory made guitars use hide glue, fwiw.

Something that not a lot of people know about aliphatic glues is they can be reopened with heat- it just requires more heat than a hide glue. I've done this in the past when correcting bridge positions or fixing binding problems.
Also I find that different types of hide glue are better for different jobs- I tend to use rabbit skin glue for bridges and bone glue for binding. Rabbit skin glue is especially great because it doesn't creep.

So, for me at least, it is horses for courses. 

dogload

ICBM said:

dogload said:

@ICBM what do you mean by splint joint? 

http://www.chrislarkinguitars.com/resources/newsletters/clc-newsletter-september-2012.html

Scroll down to 'Tech Bit - Headstock. What again?'

You can do the channels with a chisel, if you don't have the right routing jigs. It will take a lot of patience and care, but it can be done.

Thank you

IvisonGuitars

WezV said:

dogload said:

octatonic said:

Titebond.

Ah, yes - you mentioned that earlier. Thanks.

More importantly , Titebond Original.  The red one.

Because I hate it when I recommend titebond original and people turn up with Titebond 2 or 3 assuming its better.

100% 

And the Titebond Hide Glue is rubbish so avoid that too.

ICBM

octatonic said:

Rabbit skin glue is especially great because it doesn't creep.

Does it hop?


Sorry .

WezV

miserneil said:

WezV said:

dogload said:

octatonic said:

Titebond.

Ah, yes - you mentioned that earlier. Thanks.

More importantly , Titebond Original.  The red one.

Because I hate it when I recommend titebond original and people turn up with Titebond 2 or 3 assuming its better.

100% 

And the Titebond Hide Glue is rubbish so avoid that too.

This is the funny thing to me.... a lot of people use the prepared hide glue and then make bold claims about how great hide glue is because they have read it elsewhere.

if it's liquid at room temperature you have none of the benefits it can bring

octatonic

ICBM said:

octatonic said:

Rabbit skin glue is especially great because it doesn't creep.

Does it hop?


Sorry .

Hopfully not.

Kalimna

Octatonic - as it happens I've never used hhg, but am under the impression that the titebond hhg (and other similar) isn't up to much for the reasons you mention. And also, the downsides to using it - the constant keeping warm, the smell, the short open time, etc would prevent me from using it in the foreseeable future.
As it also happens, I am acutely aware of Titebond I's ability to soften under heat. I built an acoustic with Mark of Bailey guitars and unfortunately the Macassar ebony developed several cracks in the the back. We took the back off and also the bolt on neck whose fingerboard was glued down with Titebond. It took a while, but a palette knife and a hot lamp worked.

cheers,
adam