Anybody on here know about violins?
My daughter needs to replace her beginner's violin with something better. Normal full-size classical violin. Teacher has suggested we should expect to spend at least £300, but I'd be happy to go slightly more expensive if it got her a significantly better instrument.
Before we go out trying some, can anybody recommend any makes to look for, or features that should be expected in a decent student violin? At that price, solid carved tops seem to be the norm (I assume the cheap one is pressed laminate) but anything else we should be looking out for?
Any suggestions very welcome - I know virtually nothing about violins.
Comments
I'd like to get her something that's going to be significantly better quality, and money spent on musical instruments is always a good thing IMO, but £1000 is probably a bit over the top considering it gets taken to school and the like (and is to be looked after by an 11-yr-old ). I'm certainly not against second-hand instruments - sounds like that may be the way to go if there's not much between cheap and £1000 new.
We'll have a look into Stentor, and see if we can look at some slightly better second-hand instruments, if only for comparison.
delurk. I assume from your name you're from Devon, so may be worth calling Rebecca at here: http://www.vivaviolins.co.uk/
she was really good when I got my student fiddle from her (helped get it all set up for me, fitted the shoulder and chin rest etc), and she carries a range of violins for different prices.
I'm not locked in here with you, you are locked in here with me.
However, 'play a bunch' is definitely the way to go and there are bargains to be had second-hand but it is a very strange market to get a decent feel of and easy to pay way over the odds. My advice would be to get your daughter to narrow down a few favourites and pay for her teacher to assess the shortlist - probably the equivalent of a single lesson.
Getting the teacher to look at them is something we'd considered, but there aren't any dealers closer than about an hour's drive (and the good ones are more like double that distance) so I don't know how practical that will be unless we can get a couple on evaluation.
"Take these three items, some WD-40, a vise grip, and a roll of duct tape. Any man worth his salt can fix almost any problem with this stuff alone." - Walt Kowalski
"Only two things are infinite - the universe, and human stupidity. And I'm not sure about the universe." - Albert Einstein
If you need to buy new for whatever reason, the top-end Stentor stuff is plenty passable. Like anything, strings makes a massive difference (buy dominant, everybody does, until you get into the crazy £200 a set stuff). Set up helps too - ideally get it from a reputable dealer who can help make sure it's going to work for the player.
Having said that.... If you can, buy second hand. You will get a significantly better instrument for the price - and as a bonus, it will (hopefully) be nicely played in - much like decent acoustics, they mellow out over time. A nice instrument is quite achievable from a decent dealer second hand for £500 - certainly enough for most students. As always when buying second hand - remember bows are interchangeable!!! Try several bows on the same violin, they sound and feel different. (This is another bonus of buying from a good dealer, second hand)
A good dealer should be willing to let you take a violin or two home to try (and show/play with teacher!) - this is very worthwhile, because obviously you never play at most comfortable in the shop, and it's great to hear it in some different settings to get a feel for it. My friendly local dealer has packed me off with £3k of violins to take home before!! (Sadly he's in Suffolk, a long way from you!)
I agree buying used is definitely the most sensible option if we can find some (when I said "needs a new violin" in my original post I meant "another" rather than necessarily bought new). We've had a few dealers recommended to us so will be going on a bit of a trip soon to have a look at what they've got (unfortunately they're all an hour or two away in different directions).
Regarding playing in the shop, my daughter is pretty good with that - she's quite happy to play in front of people, even when we bought her current cheap 3/4 a few years ago she was happily playing a few to see which one she preferred. But obviously this time there's more money involved and the decision is slightly more important than it was with a £100 instrument, so borrowing a couple for a bit would be very useful if the dealers are up for it.
One good thing about all this research is that I've learnt things about violins that I had no idea about before - like different bows making a difference... surely it's just a stick to drag the hair across the strings
Anyway, hopefully we can find her something nice but not too valuable to be owned by an 11-yr-old
After some trying of various violins in shops, we were in Brighton for the week visiting family, so while we were in civilisation we did a quick music shop tour. Turns out the Brighton branch of Hobgoblin had a good stock of used violins and the guy in there was extremely enthusiastic and helpful. Told him what we were looking for and we ended up trying a good number of them (all used), up to a £1500 one (that sounded nasty IMO!). Lots around the £700 mark that sounded very nice, but the one that really stood out was a late 19th century copy of a Nicolaus Amatus violin. It had had some sort of "relicing" at some point in its life (dark lacquer and fake cracks) that may have put some people off, and a couple of fine tuners missing, but my daughter and I love the look (it really looks ancient and very cool). Sounded as good as any of the £700 instruments (and better than a lot of them), and they were only asking £300... so we bought it
Dropped into a violin specialist in Lewes later in the week, who replaced the fine tuners and did a quick setup and generally agreed we'd bought well (phew!) (and refused to charge us - so I bought a set of strings from him) and it plays superbly. Absolutely massive improvement in tone from her beginner's instrument.
So all in all a successful result. Thanks for all the suggestions along the way.
I'm not locked in here with you, you are locked in here with me.
I know violins have been "relic'ed" for a lot longer than guitars have, in fact - for at least a hundred years, if not a lot more… ever since 'old' violins became desirable really. So it may even have been made new like that.
"Take these three items, some WD-40, a vise grip, and a roll of duct tape. Any man worth his salt can fix almost any problem with this stuff alone." - Walt Kowalski
"Only two things are infinite - the universe, and human stupidity. And I'm not sure about the universe." - Albert Einstein
It may have been finished like that from new, certainly looks like it was done quite a time ago. Although all the other ones I've found on the web have a more normal finish. It actually looks pretty cool - sort of "tiger bread" effect. Here's a couple of pics of it: