That guitarist in Roxy Music

JanekLubanski

Dunno if I'm allowed to quote a quote.....please delete if I've infringed any forum rules. But I like Phil M's take on technique.

Phil Manzanera: “I didn’t really want an incredible technique: I thought that would impede my ability to enjoy music for the whole of my life”

By Jamie Dickson ( Guitarist ) published October 28, 2021

Sassafras

Not if you like playing incredibly technical music (which I don't).

Funkfingers

There is a well-known quote about early Roxy Music that there wasn't enough room in the band for two Brians/Bryans. 

Manzanera always knew better than to upstage Ferry. Otherwise, he might have been pushed out too.

viz

It’s the same with any art - if you’ve studied English literature, it’s obvious you’re hardly going to enjoy reading books. If you’ve done a degree in fine art, you’re clearly not going to enjoy going round art museums. Same with musicians; any good guitarist - also any orchestra player, pianist, jazzer, whatever - will tell you they all can’t stand music.



Edit: Because it’s hard to express sarcasm reliably in forum posts, I’d like to make it clear: THE ABOVE WAS SUPPOSED TO BE SARCASTIC!

HAL9000

viz said:

Same with musicians; any good guitarist - also any orchestra player, pianist, jazzer, whatever - will tell you they all can’t stand music.

Glad I’m rubbish then ;-)  I do think though that I listen to music ‘differently’ than a non musician. Doesn’t stop me enjoying music though. I’m sure that an artist will look at works of art differently - probably more analytically- than a non artist. I bet that they still enjoy art though.

viz

HAL9000 said:

viz said:

Same with musicians; any good guitarist - also any orchestra player, pianist, jazzer, whatever - will tell you they all can’t stand music.

Glad I’m rubbish then ;-)  I do think though that I listen to music ‘differently’ than a non musician. I’m sure that an artist will look at works of art differently than a non artist. Doesn’t mean they can’t enjoy art though.

Yep, I was joking, it’s the silliest thing I’ve ever heard!

Blueingreen

What's missing is whether he still believe that's true.

I could say of my 17 year old self: "I didn't want to learn to read music because I thought it might get in the way of playing with a good feel for the music I liked".

I could also say of my 17 year old self: "I was an idiot".

viz

^ true. Indeed the rest of the quote might have gone on, “and how wrong I was”, or something. 

bertie

Blueingreen said:

What's missing is whether he still believe that's true.

I could say of my 17 year old self: "I didn't want to learn to read music because I thought it might get in the way of playing with a good feel for the music I liked".

I could also say of my 17 year old self: "I was an idiot".

and Id say,   bollocks   

prowla

Presumably it's a quote taken out of context.

I'd personally prefer to listen to a scrappy player than an automaton.

However, the sweet spot is somewhere in-between.

Gassage

Phil is awful.

downbytheriver

Nothing

impmann

Its easy to mock... but PM was integral to one of the greatest bands of all time, IMHO. He's not a virtuoso but his playing *in context* with Roxy was great... 

DrCornelius

He deserves a tip of the hat for the intro to More Than This for a start (assuming it’s him). Love the guitar work during that period of RM

JezWynd

I think he’s referring to the tendency to deconstruct something if you are studying it.  I feel what he’s saying - I had always loved movies and when I started making my own and started to learn about the process, I suddenly found that I was aware of all the subterfuges and techniques in movies as I was watching them. I was upset by it as it seemed that in studying movies I had lost the magic of watching. I thought I had ruined a special pleasure. After a few months of this obsessive deconstructing it faded away and I began to enjoy them the same way I had previously - getting lost in the moment but for a while there was a genuine feeling of loss.

Roxy’s first LP is still a regular listen, one of the best, most fully realised, first albums. It’s an astonishing achievement.

darthed1981

impmann said:

Its easy to mock... but PM was integral to one of the greatest bands of all time, IMHO. He's not a virtuoso but his playing *in context* with Roxy was great... 

Amazes me that Roxy Music don't get brought up more as an influence on bands like Suede, Blur and Pulp - clearly they all had at least one record at home if not more.

The subtle way the melody climbs all over that track is something Bernard Butler or Damon Albarn would be very familiar with!

AK99

JezWynd said:

I think he’s referring to the tendency to deconstruct something if you are studying it.  I feel what he’s saying - I had always loved movies and when I started making my own and started to learn about the process, I suddenly found that I was aware of all the subterfuges and techniques in movies as I was watching them. I was upset by it as it seemed that in studying movies I had lost the magic of watching. I thought I had ruined a special pleasure. After a few months of this obsessive deconstructing it faded away and I began to enjoy them the same way I had previously - getting lost in the moment but for a while there was a genuine feeling of loss.

Interesting. There's probably an element of 'first learn all the rules before you start to break them" in there too.

imalrightjack

impmann said:

Its easy to mock... but PM was integral to one of the greatest bands of all time, IMHO. He's not a virtuoso but his playing *in context* with Roxy was great... 

Totally agree. I love the first couple of albums and his playing is absolutely on point. 

In respect of knowledge, I definitely had that kind of approach, through fear that theory would inhibit me. I was wrong, although I do sometimes find it hard to break modular rules. 

Gassage

In fairness, I do love Roxy Music's homage to gay sex.

Both Ends Burning.

richardhomer

DrCornelius said:

He deserves a tip of the hat for the intro to More Than This for a start (assuming it’s him). Love the guitar work during that period of RM

Completely agree. Obviously not the Roxy period we’re supposed to like but Flesh & Blood and Avalon are pure class, as far as I’m concerned.

Gassage

I've always loved this version of Like a Hurricane- however, Andy Newmark steals the show- as exquisite as ever.