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I play guitar and take photos of stuff. I also like beans on toast.
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Is there anyone here that started out as a rock guy and moved into jazz and actually got it? What was the lightbulb moment? I'm waiting for something to happen and the penny to drop when suddenly everything just makes sense.
I play guitar and take photos of stuff. I also like beans on toast.
Seriously: If you value it, take/fetch it yourself
It is much more work than people expect.
Studio: https://www.voltperoctave.com
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https://barrygreenevideolessons.vhx.tv/ - also he's got quite of promo videos on Youtube that give a good idea of the material covered.
I wish I could find something that breaks it down into it's most simplest form and says, so you're a rock or blues guy, well do this and you're a jazz guy. Same way I learned how to play a ton of country guitar overnight for a tour. Move that blues scale down a few frets and you're a country guy. Easy.
I realise it goes so much deeper than that. I'm watching videos about soloing over chord changes and my brain just isn't wired to work that quickly. Watching George Benson shred is a wonderful thing but completely above my ability. Maybe I'm overthinking things and wanting it to just happen like most other things I've had to learn. Just looking for something that takes what I already know and turns into jazz. The long and short of it is I'm lazy and don't want to put the work in.
I play guitar and take photos of stuff. I also like beans on toast.
Seriously though, that’s your problem right there. We all love hearing Benson and the rest rip it up, but he spent pretty much all his life listening and playing Jazz. There aren’t any short cuts, coz believe me I’d have tried them
That’s not to say all is lost. I’m not a Jazz player at all, but I can fake it to most folks. Those in the know, will see right through it but that’s for me to sort out.
To get through the tour I’d get a good working knowledge of maj7, dom7, min7, m7b5 and dim7 chords, preferably with root notes on both E and A strings. Justinguitar is a good resource for the most common shapes. Anything else like 9ths and Altered chords or drop 2 shapes can come another time. Although you probably already know the Hendrix chord!
Learn the Jazz Blues (you’re part way there if you know the 12 Bar Blues) and get the Real Book and work through some standards such as Autumn Leaves, Satin Doll, Tune Up and then some more involved ones like Stella By Starlight and All The Things You Are.
As for soloing, you’d be surprised with how much you can get away with using the Pentatonic scale. Maybe check out... i think it’s jazzguitar.be for some single note lines to learn and plug in.
Listen to guys like Jim Hall, he can say a lot with few notes.
But most importantly you need to listen to a lot of jazz and get some sense of swing in your playing.
Good luck!
How well do you know the major scale?
With your level of playing you are certainly capable of playing awesome jazz. There are a few techniques or short cuts that can kickstart it for you; I was amazed when I had my eyes opened to it by my teacher; and once the thing clicks it takes on its own momentum.
Supportact said: [my style is] probably more an accumulation of limitations and bad habits than a 'style'.
Supportact said: [my style is] probably more an accumulation of limitations and bad habits than a 'style'.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NdWJpHt1Xws&frags=pl%2Cwn
*cough* Sorry, I'll get my coat.
I play guitar and take photos of stuff. I also like beans on toast.
I play guitar and take photos of stuff. I also like beans on toast.
Unfortunately for you, my lightbulb moment was occasioned by reading a book for pianists: A Classical Approach To Jazz Piano: Exploring Harmony by Dominic Aldiss
However I tried to distil the essence of what I learned into my Twinkle Jazz series which I did as part of Chord Of The Week here on the FretBoard - first thread in the series linked below and there's an index to the rest of the series in the second post.
http://www.thefretboard.co.uk/discussion/64757/chord-of-the-week-2-1-16-twinklejazz1-jazz-imaj7-3rd-7th-chord-frags
http://www.thefretboard.co.uk/discussion/30832/chord-of-the-week-3-1-15-the-universal-all-purpose-jazz-chord
Another good "sound like you know what you're doing" thing to play over the V7 chord is root note on the top string, up one fret, up another two frets, then extend that pattern over the next two strings. So the pattern is over a D7 into G is
I did a Youtube vid to illustrate, this lick is at 0:18 and the whole discussion is linked in the description with analysis of the other shortcut licks in the video
Feedback
There's lots of good advice above.
- Try not to be overwhelmed. Despite what some people write, there's zero need to learn all 8 modes, plus harmonic minor, melodic minor (and modes thereof), altered dominant, bebop, whole tone, etc. in all 12 keys, in every position of the neck, before you start. There's a huge amount of willy-wagging bullshit around on this one. Many of the greatest jazz players in history knew basically NONE of this.
- Learn chords. You really do need to know how to play each of the main chord types: major (and maj7), minor (and minor 7), dominant 7, m7b5 and diminished. It also helps to know how to find the common extensions (6/13, b9, 9, #9, b5, #5) relative to those shapes. And you need to know them in several places on the neck. That might mean CAGED, or it might mean something simpler. I found a 'gypsy' book by Stephane Wrembel that used a simplified system (basically CAE plus some connecting notes) a good way in.
- Start with learning to comp along with songs. Learning to smoothly connect chords across the neck will help you learn the neck and understand how you could, for example, play across some changes while staying in one position on the neck. Freddie Green style, and then into more modern styles of comping.
- When improvising: play the melody for the song, and play the chord tones (i.e. play arpeggios).
- Listen to stuff you like and try to hear it in your head.
For me, I found it easier to learn pre-bebop stuff first. So swing and gypsy jazz tunes. The progressions are easier, and there's not a ton of clever harmony stuff happening. That and jazz-blues (as per above).Personally, I'm at the point where I can noodle happily along with basic unes that aren't too fast, and don't have really busy progressions. But on fast stuff with a lot of changes, or bebop, I still get lost and mixed up really quickly.