Equality in Sport.

holnrew

crunchman said:

It's a tricky one.  I can see the argument but the players are better in men's events than in women's events.  Even if the women are equally skilled the men are stronger and faster.  Even in something that's not dependent on power like snooker, the extra reach of a man has to be an advantage.  As has been said above, events where everyone competes together will be completely dominated by men.  If the men's version is the pinnacle of the sport then it will get the most money.

The worry I have is that women's sport could essentially disappear completely if some of the transgender campaigners get their way.  They are already letting Caster Semanya compete as a women.  She's a difficult case, but if intersex athletes are allowed to compete as women then what is a the point of competing for other women.  If you make women compete with the men, or allow intersex or transgender athletes to compete then women's sport will die completely.

It's testosterone that makes men stronger, when they transition to women they lose that and their bone and muscle density becomes more in line with women

fob

holnrew said:

It's testosterone that makes men stronger, when they transition to women they lose that and their bone and muscle density becomes more in line with women

I know someone on the fringes of competitive weightlifting and there is a story that's not going down very well. I've posted the most neutral video I could find (although the YT channel name is unfortunate):

professorben

Because if you are not careful this is what happens. 

MattBanshee

I am a coach of a female sports team, and have been involved with it for the past 6 years, having helped set it up. The majority of the women are cisgender, but we also have had MTF trans people join, as well as members leave because they transitioned to men.

The only thing I have to add to this thread is that most of the previous comments have been so, so wildly off the mark that I can't even participate in the discussion beyond this post.

CabbageCat

MattBanshee said:

The only thing I have to add to this thread is that most of the previous comments have been so, so wildly off the mark that I can't even participate in the discussion beyond this post.

Well, aren't you just the soul of rationality and helpfulness.

xox

Zoolooter

Women's tennis gets my goat, severely. More than half need to diet and get to the gym. They play 3 sets maximum, compared to 5 for the men at the slams. But they get the same prize money! If they played an equal amount of sets I wouldn't mind so much. It's like someone doing a 3 day week and getting paid the same as someone knocking their pipe out doing 5.

CabbageCat

Zoolooter said:

 It's like someone doing a 3 day week and getting paid the same as someone knocking their pipe out doing 5.

No it's not. It's like someone spending three hours a day in meetings instead of five. They still spend the same amount of time training, travelling and performing media duties. It's only the on-court time that's different.

professorben

Zoolooter said:

Women's tennis gets my goat, severely. More than half need to diet and get to the gym. They play 3 sets maximum, compared to 5 for the men at the slams. But they get the same prize money! If they played an equal amount of sets I wouldn't mind so much. It's like someone doing a 3 day week and getting paid the same as someone knocking their pipe out doing 5.

I tried knocking my pipe out watching Sharapova and I barely lasted 2 games.....



new balls please!!!

Heartfeltdawn

Gassage said:

PS: I well recall opening the batting MCC v London Schools (all state schools)

Curwin Marc and Alex Tudor. It was easily the best school attack I've ever faced, by a mile, and Curwin was a distance better than Tudor. Both 85mph plus at 18.

Still avoiding all debate on the roots because it would last for weeks... but the PS deserves an answer. Tudor was decidedly quick. I faced him a few times at county rep level from U-15 upwards as he's a few months younger than me. Got him out more than he got me out which is one small victory, and it's nice to know that a scorecard at one point had a Tudor and a Hollioake credit against my bowling. It'd be hard to choose who was quickest out of Tudor and Simon Jones in the year group below me. He was more than sharp on a bouncy track and near unplayable on a damp Millfield early season track. 

Garthy

MattBanshee said:

I am a coach of a female sports team, and have been involved with it for the past 6 years, having helped set it up. The majority of the women are cisgender, but we also have had MTF trans people join, as well as members leave because they transitioned to men.

The only thing I have to add to this thread is that most of the previous comments have been so, so wildly off the mark that I can't even participate in the discussion beyond this post.

"You're wrong but I am not telling you why". Well clearly the women have been coaching you with their life skills in return.

Tavernor

MattBanshee said:

I am a coach of a female sports team, and have been involved with it for the past 6 years, having helped set it up. The majority of the women are cisgender, but we also have had MTF trans people join, as well as members leave because they transitioned to men.

The only thing I have to add to this thread is that most of the previous comments have been so, so wildly off the mark that I can't even participate in the discussion beyond this post.

Sambostar

This equality shite is the sort of thing universities are teaching these days wat with gender studies and all that nonsense.  They actually believe that sport should be noncompetitive and equal. The problem is that goes against not only human nature but the nature of the environment and world around us and actually would disenfranchise talented players because of it's communist nature. Competitive sport is a natural evolution as is Darwinism, skilled players want to play against players with equal skills and people watching want to watch the most talented players.  OK charity exists for the mentally challenged, it needs to, but of you have a brain and are crap at a certain sport, why should you expect to play at a top level?  Could I could just walk into a lecture hall and command tenure and £45k a year for teaching gender studies?  No thought not, it's not fair, it's unequal, boo bloody hoo.

Evilmags

holnrew said:

crunchman said:

It's a tricky one.  I can see the argument but the players are better in men's events than in women's events.  Even if the women are equally skilled the men are stronger and faster.  Even in something that's not dependent on power like snooker, the extra reach of a man has to be an advantage.  As has been said above, events where everyone competes together will be completely dominated by men.  If the men's version is the pinnacle of the sport then it will get the most money.

The worry I have is that women's sport could essentially disappear completely if some of the transgender campaigners get their way.  They are already letting Caster Semanya compete as a women.  She's a difficult case, but if intersex athletes are allowed to compete as women then what is a the point of competing for other women.  If you make women compete with the men, or allow intersex or transgender athletes to compete then women's sport will die completely.

It's testosterone that makes men stronger, when they transition to women they lose that and their bone and muscle density becomes more in line with women

Which is why every time a trans person has faced a female in a martial arts contest the female has had the shit beaten out of her. Thailand has a lot of trans kickboxing contests. No way you could put a biological woman in the ring. Professional sports has to be a fair playing field. Women´s sports and men´sports are different. Women and men are biologically different, especially when puberty is passed. A female athlete has to build muscle (A tennis player is about 2 stone). A male athlete who transitions is still training. Female athletes are not about to accept that. 

In Cricket how comfortable would male bowlers be throwing hard balls at 100 mph at women. It just stops beeing sport. Professional sport needs to be credible and sellable. Getting people badly hurt does not help that. 

Sambostar

Evilmags said:

In Cricket how comfortable would male bowlers be throwing hard balls at 100 mph at women.

Donno, nothing wrong with a good stoning every now and then, maybe they're just prepping us for the way of the future.

Skipped

In Tennis....I would pay Men and Women the same.
But change the Mens game to 3 sets to stop the whinging.

Because the dynamics of the mens game would change.......some tournaments would be won by a different male player. Maybe not the player that would have prevailed before the change.

"That'll learn em"

Heartfeltdawn

Evilmags said:

In Cricket how comfortable would male bowlers be throwing hard balls at 100 mph at women. It just stops beeing sport. Professional sport needs to be credible and sellable. Getting people badly hurt does not help that. 

They'd be fine with it. I haven't seen the Australians turn into pitch it up merchants since the death of Philip Hughes so I doubt they'd do anything different if bowling to a woman. 

The issue for a batswoman would be adjusting technique to cope with pace and bounce that you just don't get in the female game when it comes to quick bowlers. The comparative average height of a woman compared to a man isn't something that would concern me. James Taylor was doubted for a long time and showed he could play the international game. Most shorties tend to be good hookers and pullers and a short list of people shorter than Taylor includes the like of Tendulkar, Aravinda de Silva, Kallicharan, Mushfiqur Rahim, and Gundappa Viswanath. Not a bad bunch really. 

The bowlers and fielders would find it harder than the batsmen. Few female spinners really give it a rip and the quicker bowlers are medium-fast by male standards.