Is the new black Marshall Astoria kinda like malibu stacey with a new hat ?

timmysoft

jeztone2 said:

TTBZ said:

There's lots of cool new stuff in the works for marshall, don't worry  

But it's too little too late. I can't think of any other major musical gear manufacturer who has so recalcitrantly and consistently ignored both the will of the market and it's customer base. I mean imagine if Ibanez had refused to reissue the tubescreamer? 

There just arrogant. 

I don't think thats the case, the mid to top end of the market isn't worth as much as the beginner market and Marshall have had that sewn up and consistently delivered at that level for the best part of 30 years. The latest Code range is excellent, really shits all over Blackstar, Line6 and Fender.

Theres no arrogance involved, maybe a lack of market research for their semi-pro and pro ranges, but its where R&D costs the mosts and returns the least. They've always pushed new products out, its us as guitarists that don't support them, Mode4, JMD, Astoria, all pretty much commercial flops because we think we know better.

Plexi & JCM800 in one box, never heard an amp do it convincingly, its always a compromise, thats why Marshall have probably never done it. 

ICBM

timmysoft said:

I don't think thats the case, the mid to top end of the market isn't worth as much as the beginner market and Marshall have had that sewn up and consistently delivered at that level for the best part of 30 years. The latest Code range is excellent, really shits all over Blackstar, Line6 and Fender.

Theres no arrogance involved, maybe a lack of market research for their semi-pro and pro ranges, but its where R&D costs the mosts and returns the least. They've always pushed new products out, its us as guitarists that don't support them, Mode4, JMD, Astoria, all pretty much commercial flops because we think we know better.

Plexi & JCM800 in one box, never heard an amp do it convincingly, its always a compromise, thats why Marshall have probably never done it. 

It would be so easy to do it - the power sections are identical, so all you would need is to build both preamps on the same chassis and switch between them. I'm not sure why no-one - least of all Marshall - has done it. Maybe one of the smaller companies has, I don't know.

The Mode Four was a commercial flop because most of them caught fire - the players who they were targetted at actually rated them as sounding pretty good. The JMD also apparently had reliability faults, although I have only come across one myself.

One of their major problems from an R&D point of view is that they always seem to want to re-invent the wheel every time - they don't just evolve earlier products. This means that you have to go back to square one for reliability testing as well as sound, and has been one of the real bugbears with almost everything new they've brought out - then it gets a poor reputation for reliability and is a commercial flop, so Marshall repeat the cycle...

One of the few real successes has been the current MG series - in the several years they've been out I have never seen, or even heard of, one fail… after the disastrous MG-DFX series that's a really significant improvement. The new DSLs - made in Vietnam - also appear reliable, though they do still have some questionable bits (pots especially).

webrthomson

jeztone2 said:

TTBZ said:

There's lots of cool new stuff in the works for marshall, don't worry  

But it's too little too late. I can't think of any other major musical gear manufacturer who has so recalcitrantly and consistently ignored both the will of the market and it's customer base. I mean imagine if Ibanez had refused to reissue the tubescreamer? 

There just arrogant. 

Yup - given they already have a mini head platform in the 2525H - where is the JCM800 version, we could even call it the 2202 - I'd love that, so would my back and it would sell and sell

But no - fridges for fuck sake - what is going on in those board meetings!

I did think the black Astoria did sound good though, and at ~1K that seems pretty good price wise too, at least to me.

Musicman20

I've never owned a Marshall but I would love a decent clean-mid crunch early Marshall tone in a decent sized head, and made by Marshall here in the UK. I've watched the recent Andertons video on the JTM 2245 30W head, and that is what I want, but with a few modern refinements and in smaller, lighter chassis. Under £1k please. I don't want a high gainer.

Victory seem to be heading that way but I've no idea if they pulled it off.

Moe_Zambeek

Musicman20 said:

I've never owned a Marshall but I would love a decent clean-mid crunch early Marshall tone in a decent sized head, and made by Marshall here in the UK. I've watched the recent Andertons video on the JTM 2245 30W head, and that is what I want, but with a few modern refinements and in smaller, lighter chassis. Under £1k please. I don't want a high gainer.

Victory seem to be heading that way but I've no idea if they pulled it off.

Try an Astoria....really.

TTBZ

@timmysoft nail on the head. Code is awesome when you dial it in right, I've just been editing some artist videos with the 25 and some of the cleans and crunch tones are unbelievable and not even for the price, just great tone full stop. Astoria is great as well and has useful modern features with a fat vintage tone 

hywelg

Altogether classier...

ennspek

To answer the OP it brings the same amp for about a grand less I think.

jeztone2

timmysoft said:

jeztone2 said:

TTBZ said:

There's lots of cool new stuff in the works for marshall, don't worry  

But it's too little too late. I can't think of any other major musical gear manufacturer who has so recalcitrantly and consistently ignored both the will of the market and it's customer base. I mean imagine if Ibanez had refused to reissue the tubescreamer? 

There just arrogant. 

I don't think thats the case, the mid to top end of the market isn't worth as much as the beginner market and Marshall have had that sewn up and consistently delivered at that level for the best part of 30 years. The latest Code range is excellent, really shits all over Blackstar, Line6 and Fender.

Theres no arrogance involved, maybe a lack of market research for their semi-pro and pro ranges, but its where R&D costs the mosts and returns the least. They've always pushed new products out, its us as guitarists that don't support them, Mode4, JMD, Astoria, all pretty much commercial flops because we think we know better.

Plexi & JCM800 in one box, never heard an amp do it convincingly, its always a compromise, thats why Marshall have probably never done it. 

 A lack of market research in a company that size? C'mon listen to yourself. They're not British Leyland...or are they? 

J Rockett have done very nicely out of the Archer. Your not telling me it's not profitable building the mk 1 Guv'nor into a better quality pro housing? I mean that's all JHS have done with the Angry Charlie. 

FarleyUK

TTBZ said:

There's lots of cool new stuff in the works for marshall, don't worry  

*cough* Mini-JCM800 and Plexi *cough*

Grumpyrocker

Gimme a  lunchbox JCM800 with a loop and I'd be all over that. 

Telejester

Gimme a mini jtm45 with power scaling and I'll be all over it

Plectrum

Telejester said:

Gimme a mini jtm45 with power scaling and I'll be all over it

Just do a PPIMV mod to a normal JTM45. Or use a CODE like I do

timmysoft

Telejester said:

Gimme a mini jtm45 with power scaling and I'll be all over it

Why would you need a mini one, they've got fuck all volume as it is?

professorben

jeztone2 said:

TTBZ said:

There's lots of cool new stuff in the works for marshall, don't worry  

But it's too little too late. I can't think of any other major musical gear manufacturer who has so recalcitrantly and consistently ignored both the will of the market and it's customer base. I mean imagine if Ibanez had refused to reissue the tubescreamer? 

There just arrogant. 

Its butility, plain and simple. 

ICBM

timmysoft said:

Telejester said:

Gimme a mini jtm45 with power scaling and I'll be all over it

Why would you need a mini one, they've got fuck all volume as it is?

The head box is still unnecessarily large and won't sit neatly on quite a lot of small cabinets. They're not *that* quiet, either - dropping one to about half the power would still be useful.

A 20W one in the size of a 2061 head box would be a thing of wonder. But *not* an 18/20-watter, a proper lower-powered JTM45 with a full TMBP tone section and octal power valves.