Gibson lp v Tokai lp: which to buy

rolls1392

I am looking to buy a new LP type guitar and prior to reading comments on this forum, Gibson would been my first choice.
However I am no longer convinced a Gibson is the holy grail.
Local shop sells Tokai, which look great.
Anyway educated opinions please?
Budget is up to 2k.
Ta R

ThorpyFX

rolls1392 said:

I am looking to buy a new LP type guitar and prior to reading comments on this forum, Gibson would been my 
Budget is up to 2k.

Ive owned  several of both, I like you do not think Gibson are the holy grail. However, the les paul is their baby and so everything else is a clone of that.

that being said, a £2k tokai is stunning, fit, finish, and playability will be beyond anything gibson put out even upto £5k+. A £2k budget will get you a great secondhand CS 58 but as with all gibbons you really need to try before you buy....

Gibson Les Pauls I've owned: 2008 Les Paul traditional, 2010 Les Paul CS 59 Flame
Tokai's: LS55, LS100 and the daddy wass an LS-200 which is the best Les Paul style guitar I've owned and the only guitar selling regret I have.

ESBlonde

A good Gibson stands above most things. A good Tokia with Pickup changes will equal or better a mundane Gibson all day long.
The answer is always go play some Gibsons and pick the one that speaks to you, you might have to kiss a few frogs.
As a general rule in terms of resale a Gibson will realise most of its cost better than any copy irrespective of the 'upgrades' made.

sweepy

Gibson every day, get an LP Trad and fit better pickups or hunt around for a s/h R8 R9 R0 etc 

lustycourtier

Had hi End models of both. Liked owning the tokais, just not the resale. Gibson all day. 

bobliefeld

At 2k you should be getting an amazing guitar either way.  Don't worry about the details, let your heart decide.  

McToot

ThorpyFX said:

A £2k budget will get you a great secondhand CS 58 but as with all gibbons you really need to try before you buy....

I can't agree more.  A monkey is for life, not just for Christmas.  

Boromedic

Go on the My Les Paul forum and ask there, they will give you decent advice. A new LP Traditional is a nice guitar and they aren't badly priced, however I would be tempted to go used and either as sweepy said above look for an R8, R9 or something or buy an older Les.

Completely biased opinion, but don't believe the hype about all Gibsons of any recent vintage are badly made, there are some great and well made guitars out there, are there also some dogs out there? Absolutely. Thing is like others have said if your spending up to 2k always go and try them out and you'll find the one for you. Tokai's are great but despite what the subjective opinions on the internet say, they aren't the real deal or always better than the real deal. There are also Greco and Burny copies that are cool as well as Orville and others (older copies from the 70's and 80's).  

Can one individual Tokai be better than one individual Gibson, of course it can but it's not a Gibson. That doesn't matter to some folk and that's fine I've got no beef with that but I personally had to have the genuine article when I bought mine new in 99 and I'm glad I did. Resale is better but that wasn't an issue for me as I tried mine out and knew it was a keeper. Tried others including a nice Honeyburst the same day and the Heritage Cherry was the better guitar and it kept getting better with age. 

90's and early 00's Standards and Customs are beautifully made guitars with decent woods and parts and can be had on eBay for between £1200-£2000 depending on the model. Don't buy blind though whatever you do!! Someone will chime in with weight and long neck tenon arguments probably, personally I can't hear a difference between them but that's only my subjective opinion. However an overly heavy Les will diminish your comfort and therefore ruin the experience so check the weight before you buy.

RandallFlagg

I really like the nitro finish on recent Gibsons, it's feels good and sinks in over time. What's the finish on a Tokai like? I've tried poly finish LPs styled guitars and they just don't feel right to me, especially the back of the neck.

ICBM

Gibson. Not even close at that price.

If the choice is between a low-end Gibson and a Tokai, maybe different… but I've still never played a Tokai that feels and sounds quite 'right' to me.

guitars4you

to be fair to Gibson they do make some pretty nice guitars and for 2K you should find a good 'un - But Gibson can be a bit hit 'n' miss on both quality control and the overall grade of the guitar regarding playing performance

For 2K I would suggest a good used example over new - You'll get a higher grade of guitar for the same money - And certainly if buying new then I'd suggest a visit to a good dealer with a good selection and try a few and buy the one that feels right, plays right and sounds right - Whilst I would not suggest you accept 2nd best, if you have a keen eye and tend to be a bit fussy regarding quality and attention to detail, then you'll find a few 'cosmetic' defects on  a few Gibson Guitars but that almost goes with the territory

But as an overview I'd go with the G brand over the T brand - The other option is a nice used PRS Singlecut model like a SC245 or similar

crunchman

Don't know if it applies to all models but some of theTokai pickups are hotter than the traditional PAF style pickups in Gibsons.  I had a Tokai (Japanese) around 10 or 12 years ago where the DC resistance of the bridge pickup was around 10.7kOhms (compared with around 8kOhms for a typical PAF style pickup).

That one was poly finish.  I definitely prefer the look and feel of nitro.

rolls1392

Thanks for the advice
Tbh heart says Gibson

Boromedic

Not sure if you're near here, but this is a good guitar although the price is a little bit high due to some of the nicks in it but the pics don't show the guitar too well. Looks like it has some wear on the back of the headstock from hanging up (and maybe lacquer bloom from the wrong rubber foam), plus a few nicks on the back of the neck and body. Worth checking out anyway and trying to get something knocked off the price. It's been for sale a while so he may be keen to sell, also it's had a dress and setup so that's some extra cost you may avoid....

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Gibson-Les-Paul-Standard-/263103390502?hash=item3d422f2326:g:1HMAAOSwcstZdLs0

shaunm

I'd go Gibson. However if you are open to suggestion a Feline guitar would be the better made LP in that price bracket. 

RandallFlagg

rolls1392 said:

Thanks for the advice
Tbh heart says Gibson

Your buidget is just a few hundred away from this beauty that @JonHosker is selling in classifieds. I have a 2016 R8 in Iced Tea but not relic'd and they are very good, I would love the relic version:

http://www.thefretboard.co.uk/discussion/105453/fs-gibson-les-paul-cs-r8-2013-2350/p1

Boromedic

RandallFlagg said:

rolls1392 said:

Thanks for the advice
Tbh heart says Gibson

Your buidget is just a few hundred away from this beauty that @JonHosker is selling in classifieds. I have a 2016 R8 in Iced Tea but not relic'd and they are very good, I would love the relic version:

http://www.thefretboard.co.uk/discussion/105453/fs-gibson-les-paul-cs-r8-2013-2350/p1

It's not for me that (no fan of relic'ing or excess flame) but it's a beautiful guitar at that money for the right person, what a bargain. @RandallFlagg is right if it's your kind of thing and you can stretch to it...........

jaygtr

rolls1392 said:

Thanks for the advice
Tbh heart says Gibson

If your your heart says Gibson, you'll  always regret buying something else.

Dominic

To those that say anything other than a Gibson is not a Gibson Les Paul -they are right.
If they say can anybody make a better Les Paul style guitar .....the answer is Yes
Yaron etc by miles
What is the best guitar ......£2k worth of Gibson or £2k worth of Tokai ?
The Tokai all day long.
Bought secondhand £1000 worth of Tokai will match any £4000 Gibson (which may be £2600 secondhand )
Put a set of Lollar Imperials, OX4 etc in a Tokai and it's about as good as it gets under £6/7000

jumping@shadows

It's my opinion that most all modern Gibson LP's are a total rip- you're paying for the name/sales pitch hyperbole and even the highest offerings are laughably poor IMO- fit and finish, material used etc are far beneath high end Tokai, and the recent LS320 I have in with stock Braz board and flawless finish feels and looks like a handmade, bespoke instrument, and is leagues ahead of the True Historic Murphy '58 and recent CC Sandy '59 I've had. 

BloodEagle

Gibson all day long - I've come across some with a few fit/finish issues, but never come across one which doesn't play well and sound awesome.