Roland Blues Cube Artist: kaput and irreparable

xDottore

Will post developments on here, as it seems to be a topic of concern to a number of peeps.

darthed1981

Hope you get a result @Dottore Roland/Boss have built up so much goodwill with the Katana it would be very disappointing if they aren't supporting owners of their gear.

xDottore

jpfamps said:

Main issue is that these is SMPS which to be honest unless you have A LOT of experience in fixing and the correct technical documents to hand is not an easy fix, and beyond most repairers (myself included).

Even if you can trouble shoot these to the component level then it can be a time consuming, and hence often uneconomic repair.

Most manufacturers buying SMPS OEM so any warranty repairs would be fixed by a PCB swap.

If you have a huge number of products like Roland then trying to stock parts for obsolete products will result in a massive inventory. 

Worse the key parts in SMPS often become obsolete after a few production runs, so it's getting parts a few year down the line can be problematic.

I've just looked at a Blues Cube. Power is getting into the SMPS board, but nothing coming out.

Just realised, looking at your profile, that was *my* BC you were looking at!!! Cheers

TimmyO

jpfamps said:

Main issue is that these is SMPS which to be honest unless you have A LOT of experience in fixing and the correct technical documents to hand is not an easy fix, and beyond most repairers (myself included).

Even if you can trouble shoot these to the component level then it can be a time consuming, and hence often uneconomic repair.

Most manufacturers buying SMPS OEM so any warranty repairs would be fixed by a PCB swap.

If you have a huge number of products like Roland then trying to stock parts for obsolete products will result in a massive inventory. 

Worse the key parts in SMPS often become obsolete after a few production runs, so it's getting parts a few year down the line can be problematic.

I've just looked at a Blues Cube. Power is getting into the SMPS board, but nothing coming out.

This sounds like the kind of thing that reviewers/mags etc should be made aware of - imagine spending 800 or 900 or whatever these cost because you wanted to move away from 'unreliable' valve amps only to find in 2 years that you're knackered.

It would completely change the buying decision for many people. 

Legionreturns

darthed1981 said:

Hope you get a result @Dottore Roland/Boss have built up so much goodwill with the Katana it would be very disappointing if they aren't supporting owners of their gear.

To be fair, we have absolutely no clue about the longevity of a katana yet. Most of them are still in warranty. Anyone heard of one breaking? 

Wazmeister

I'm fairly sure that Roland/Boss do offer out of warranty repairs, but at designated repair centres. Ive read something along similar lines to the OP before, but can't remember how it was resolved.

It's outrageous really that it has come to this...

Maybe a link to the thread with Roland Customer Service and Facebook etc ??

axisus

I agree, Roland are sh*te. I bought a street cube off of someone here a while back, and it died a few months later. Couldn't get sod all help from Roland or Rose Morris. 

Last time I buy one of their products.

RiftAmps

Dottore said:

RiftAmps said:

The Roland website has a list of mnfr approved repairers for gear, whether in warranty or not

EDIT: Just called Roland spares dept. They recommend this guy for out of warranty repairs

Puretech - Dan 0845 128 4362

http://www.puretechsolutions.co.uk/

Mr Rift, you are a lifesaver! Just called Puretech and waiting for a call or email from Dan to see whether he can fix and, if so, how much. 

But I think you'd have to agree that Roland could make this process rather easier. I couldn't find a spare or repair number to call (though that may be me just being dim); perhaps easier if you're actually in the amp business, I suspect?

Thanks again

I just went to Roland.co.uk, clicked Support, then scrolled down to Repairs & Spares

To be honest, there are many mnfrs who won't give you the time of day unless you're an authorized service centre.
The good ones are Blackstar and Vox. The rest are terrible.

It took Mesa Boogie 4 months to 'approve' me to get the Lonestar Special schematic.

John_A

When and where was it bought? there may be more warranty on it than you think

Danny1969

Although SMPS can be a nightmare their general mode of operation is essentially the same regardless of the design, basically varying the width of the pulse on the command of the load sensor and reference voltage and averaging it out over inductors . Most of the faults I see are capacitor related .... if the load sensor senses a near or dead short it won't output anything, decoupling caps on the output going bad especially Tant caps on digital stuff where they are used in areas of little room. I mean there are other issues with switching transistors and the actual main IC it's self (which is often something completely obscure with no data sheet available) but bad caps are 90% of the problem in my experience 

I'n not familiar with this amp so this might not be an option but sometimes it's feasible to replace the SMPS with a linear supply if the voltages aren't too weird ....  

jpfamps

I don't have any problem at all with manufacturers only recommending "authorized" repair centres.

Ultimately if the manufacturer is recommending a repair centre to one of their customers they need to be sure that the work carried out by that repair centre is of acceptable quality.

DJH83004

I have to confess I've given up on switch mode power supplies, have changed many power mosfets, and supply caps, only to have them die on me half an hour later (or explode on the spot!)
good call Danny about replacing with a conventional psu if it will fit, the main reason for using Smps is the compact nature of the amps , just look at the modern generation of bass amps

Gassage

Give Greg Michalak a call at GuitarAid, he fixed a Cube before for me.

richh

Roland used to offer 5 year warranty - I assume they still do, though I haven't bought any of their stuff for a long time.

Obviously this is not valid if you are not the original owner, but have you tried contacting the guy you got this from, and asking nicely if they could help you out on this?  If so, that could be a way to get this sorted under warranty.  I think this range is fairly new, so would be surprised if it is older than 5 years.

Worth a try - worst they can do is say no!

stratman3142

richh said:

Roland used to offer 5 year warranty - I assume they still do, though I haven't bought any of their stuff for a long time.

Obviously this is not valid if you are not the original owner, but have you tried contacting the guy you got this from, and asking nicely if they could help you out on this?  If so, that could be a way to get this sorted under warranty.  I think this range is fairly new, so would be surprised if it is older than 5 years.

Worth a try - worst they can do is say no!

Thanks for that info which led me to do a quick 'Google'. It looks like amps might be covered for 3 years (see link below).

https://www.roland.com/uk/company/company_policy/warranty/

richh

Even if it is limited to the original owner, if you can contact them then hopefully they will help you with this - good luck anyway, and a shame that people are making equipment that may not be maintainable in the long term.

jpfamps

richh said:

Even if it is limited to the original owner, if you can contact them then hopefully they will help you with this - good luck anyway, and a shame that people are making equipment that may not be maintainable in the long term.

I think that is endemic in the consumer electronics industry.

Guitar amps are very unusual in that regard; there aren't many people using 70's TVs for example.

ICBM

jpfamps said:

I think that is endemic in the consumer electronics industry.

Guitar amps are very unusual in that regard; there aren't many people using 70's TVs for example.

I would say the concept of long-term repairability is limited to only guitar (including bass obviously) amps, and some hi-fi, and vintage radio/record player type things. Everything else, new is universally considered better than old and there is no incentive to keep old stuff going at all, beyond a lifespan of about twenty years at most.

jpfamps

ICBM said:

jpfamps said:

I think that is endemic in the consumer electronics industry.

Guitar amps are very unusual in that regard; there aren't many people using 70's TVs for example.

I would say the concept of long-term repairability is limited to only guitar (including bass obviously) amps, and some hi-fi, and vintage radio/record player type things. Everything else, new is universally considered better than old and there is no incentive to keep old stuff going at all, beyond a lifespan of about twenty years at most.

Indeed.

Although there are some people who think that new guitar gear is better than old.

Mind you last instrument I bought was made in 1949!

ICBM

jpfamps said:

Although there are some people who think that new guitar gear is better than old.

I certainly think there's an excessive reverence for old gear just for being old, in a lot of cases. Some old gear is great, but a lot is just old and knackered, and the values attached to a lot of it seem crazy, to me. If those values fall much, some of these old amps might become prohibitively expensive to repair.

I'm not even sure how maintainable even simple valve gear will be in the very long term. In fifty years, will there be valves being made? Or some of the components necessary to service valve amps, like high-voltage electrolytic caps. I'd guess we're safe for about the next twenty years, but I wouldn't like to call it much beyond that.

The problem with a lot of new gear is that it's essentially just a gamble - the majority of it never goes wrong. A small proportion does, and is then often unrepairable. Do you feel lucky, punk? I'm guessing Dottore doesn't… ditto the chap with the PA mixer, possibly.