strange selling practices on here

Strangefan

I really don't know why this is being discussed again  the admim team are not even considering let alone trialing any proper change, so they have to deal with the shit that comes their way, sorry but their have been so many suggestions to improve it which have been met with brick walls,..  They're clearly happy with the new sell sell sell vibe here. 

eSully

Bridgehouse said:

Roland said:

The problem with post counts is that the forum gets flooded with “I agree” and “thanks for posting”

That’s my issue with removing frets as well. 

@Roland - Thought this before, Why not replace the frets with a thanks button. Seen it done on another forum (rugby) and The username was included. Each post has a thanks button only and if you click it everyone could see something along the lines of ‘this post has been thanked by esully, bridgehouse’ etc. Could cut out some of the ironic lol-ing, fret whoring and that crap. Regarding the classifieds, I don't think I've used them much but a small donation to the Fretboard coffers to post on there isn't a horrible idea. If I wanted to sell a 500 quid guitar on here is it that unreasonable to ask for a fiver contribution to the forum. I don't think so. The fee could be waived for regular posters. Just my 10 cents

bingefeller

I think giving £20 a year to here is an absolute bargain.  I haven't donated yet but I plan to donate on the date @BigJon mentioned which is 3rd August.  So, you have my word Jon that I will donate and you can hold me to that.

The "Playing" , "Music" and "Classifieds" are both areas of this forum where it shines IMO.  The rest you have to wade through a lot of junk to find something good, which is the reason I rarely visit the other areas now.  If I have a gear question I find myself going elsewhere to ask because I know how most of the threads on here go - jokes, puns, a bit of arguing and very little information on the question or subject asked.   

artiebear

I's not about admin etc...its all about the scummy scrotes who see selling  or buying online as their cheap and nasty route to riches. A  community like this which in general is honest and decent not only draws but exposes these bar stewards , the same characters  easily spotted on face book with the same shyster ads 

shaunm

bingefeller said:

I think giving £20 a year to here is an absolute bargain.  I haven't donated yet but I plan to donate on the date @BigJon mentioned which is 3rd August.  So, you have my word Jon that I will donate and you can hold me to that.

The "Playing" , "Music" and "Classifieds" are both areas of this forum where it shines IMO.  The rest you have to wade through a lot of junk to find something good, which is the reason I rarely visit the other areas now.  If I have a gear question I find myself going elsewhere to ask because I know how most of the threads on here go - jokes, puns, a bit of arguing and very little information on the question or subject asked.   

With some noted exceptions like @ICBM who is a font of knowledge and always willing to offer advice.

bingefeller

shaunm said:

bingefeller said:

I think giving £20 a year to here is an absolute bargain.  I haven't donated yet but I plan to donate on the date @BigJon mentioned which is 3rd August.  So, you have my word Jon that I will donate and you can hold me to that.

The "Playing" , "Music" and "Classifieds" are both areas of this forum where it shines IMO.  The rest you have to wade through a lot of junk to find something good, which is the reason I rarely visit the other areas now.  If I have a gear question I find myself going elsewhere to ask because I know how most of the threads on here go - jokes, puns, a bit of arguing and very little information on the question or subject asked.   

With some noted exceptions like @ICBM who is a font of knowledge and always willing to offer advice.

Yes, ICBM's knowledge is pretty incredible.  One of the most knowledgeable guys on here.   

johnl

Instituting a membership fee would dramatically decrease the size of the membership and therefore the amount of gear on sale and those looking to purchase. Prices would rise, there would be significantly less variety and based on other forums that have tried similar the forum itself would be a far quieter and less interesting place. Inevitably as a forum grows it will change, yes it might not be the same small number of people who know each other very well but I'm not sure the "local shop for local people" approach is the way forward. 

This is a great forum, there are some very useful people and I've found some great UK makers. Dramatically reducing the membership in order to avoid a few sarcastic "lol"s seems self-defeating to me. 

sixstringsupplies

I lurk in and out of the forum (depending on mood/time etc...) I have to say, I've learnt so much from @ICBM and @Funkfingers in particular.

 Not to forget the many others @Wez @Bridgehouse  and @TheGuitarWeasel who give updates on builds,
pickup winds or whatever provide excellent tips and advice to others.  Too many to name in one post.

some of these people are literally giving away free info/tips/advice that others would normally have to pay for. 

i dont think you can charge for membership...just look at “YouTube premium” which hasn’t gone down too well in the YT community...lol. You would lose well over 50% of membership overnight (for the record YouTube hasnt, but they haven’t enforced it yet)

I think anything that warrants a fee or subscription requires a service and return on value. Don’t get me wrong -  this place offers that in abundance. Buts it’s freely available, it’s part of what makes this place tick. Community is the key word.

if I was In charge (haha) I would charge a very small %age to sell on the classifieds. Like 1% final selling fee or a base rate listing fee of £1.00 tops. Separate the wheat from the chaff. Leave everything else as is.

Kinda like eBay minus 95%

Every website needs funding....

OilCityPickups

sixstringsupplies said:

I lurk in and out of the forum (depending on mood/time etc...) I have to say, I've learnt so much from @ICBM and @Funkfingers in particular.

 Not to forget the many others @Wez @Bridgehouse  and @TheGuitarWeasel who give updates on builds,
pickup winds or whatever provide excellent tips and advice to others.  Too many to name in one post.

some of these people are literally giving away free info/tips/advice that others would normally have to pay for. 

i dont think you can charge for membership...just look at “YouTube premium” which hasn’t gone down too well in the YT community...lol. You would lose well over 50% of membership overnight (for the record YouTube hasnt, but they haven’t enforced it yet)

I think anything that warrants a fee or subscription requires a service and return on value. Don’t get me wrong -  this place offers that in abundance. Buts it’s freely available, it’s part of what makes this place tick. Community is the key word.

if I was In charge (haha) I would charge a very small %age to sell on the classifieds. Like 1% final selling fee or a base rate listing fee of £1.00 tops. Separate the wheat from the chaff. Leave everything else as is.

Kinda like eBay minus 95%

Every website needs funding....

As a trade member ... I'd have no objection to paying a contribution to the forum for space in a revamped 'Made in the UK' section ... at the moment it's an unloved backwater that could be so much more vibrant.

Strangefan

TheGuitarWeasel said:

sixstringsupplies said:

I lurk in and out of the forum (depending on mood/time etc...) I have to say, I've learnt so much from @ICBM and @Funkfingers in particular.

 Not to forget the many others @Wez @Bridgehouse  and @TheGuitarWeasel who give updates on builds,
pickup winds or whatever provide excellent tips and advice to others.  Too many to name in one post.

some of these people are literally giving away free info/tips/advice that others would normally have to pay for. 

i dont think you can charge for membership...just look at “YouTube premium” which hasn’t gone down too well in the YT community...lol. You would lose well over 50% of membership overnight (for the record YouTube hasnt, but they haven’t enforced it yet)

I think anything that warrants a fee or subscription requires a service and return on value. Don’t get me wrong -  this place offers that in abundance. Buts it’s freely available, it’s part of what makes this place tick. Community is the key word.

if I was In charge (haha) I would charge a very small %age to sell on the classifieds. Like 1% final selling fee or a base rate listing fee of £1.00 tops. Separate the wheat from the chaff. Leave everything else as is.

Kinda like eBay minus 95%

Every website needs funding....

As a trade member ... I'd have no objection to paying a contribution to the forum for space in a revamped 'Made in the UK' section ... at the moment it's an unloved backwater that could be so much more vibrant.






Unloved because any new business who comes along is kicked to the curb quicker than you can say snake oil  

OilCityPickups

Strangefan said:

TheGuitarWeasel said:

sixstringsupplies said:

I lurk in and out of the forum (depending on mood/time etc...) I have to say, I've learnt so much from @ICBM and @Funkfingers in particular.

 Not to forget the many others @Wez @Bridgehouse  and @TheGuitarWeasel who give updates on builds,
pickup winds or whatever provide excellent tips and advice to others.  Too many to name in one post.

some of these people are literally giving away free info/tips/advice that others would normally have to pay for. 

i dont think you can charge for membership...just look at “YouTube premium” which hasn’t gone down too well in the YT community...lol. You would lose well over 50% of membership overnight (for the record YouTube hasnt, but they haven’t enforced it yet)

I think anything that warrants a fee or subscription requires a service and return on value. Don’t get me wrong -  this place offers that in abundance. Buts it’s freely available, it’s part of what makes this place tick. Community is the key word.

if I was In charge (haha) I would charge a very small %age to sell on the classifieds. Like 1% final selling fee or a base rate listing fee of £1.00 tops. Separate the wheat from the chaff. Leave everything else as is.

Kinda like eBay minus 95%

Every website needs funding....

As a trade member ... I'd have no objection to paying a contribution to the forum for space in a revamped 'Made in the UK' section ... at the moment it's an unloved backwater that could be so much more vibrant.






Unloved because any new business who comes along is kicked to the curb quicker than you can say snake oil  

Not sure what you mean ... do elucidate 

paulnb57

Bridgehouse said:

Its not the money contribution - it’s the lack of community involvement. Look at the recent Jam party in Huddersfield and the fact that it’s not got enough interest. Symptomatic of lots of people coming here to get what they want and nothing more. The classifieds are where the majority of this happens.

Just catching up on a hundred or so posts since I last viewed this thread....

I think suggesting non attendance at an organised jam signifying a lack of comminity involvement is a little harsh bro......I'd love to have come to the Southern Jam, however, I live on the Isle of Wight, so I have to factor in a Ferry cost (wnich depending on the time of year can be eye wateringly dear) then if its any distance probably an overnight stay somewhere, but worst of all I work shifts, not 8 to 5 Mon to Fri, I work Weekdays, Weekends, Bank Hols, Nights, Xmas......so taking the above into account, Sods Law I was on shift for the Jam, my non attendance wasn't about not joining in with the community, it just wasn't possible.......
And I hugely appreciate the time people put onto organising this type event and the disappointmemt when no one comes....

Re the Classifieds, rather than paying a seller fee or subscription, how about having to wait a month after joining, before being allowed to sell? Then a first post is unlikely to be a Fore Sale ad...?

WezV

I agree.  I would love to go to a Jam, but  making that work with my current lifestyle is pretty damn hard.  I had to pull out of a jam last year and ended up missing the guitar show.   I don’t think that diminishes my input here.

finding a few minutes to contribute to the forum each day is easy 

clearing a day is a lot harder, and always makes me think I should either be building guitars or spending time with the family.

Bridgehouse

No, it wasn’t the fact it was a Jam. Neither is it a specific thing - yes we all have very full lives and yes people will always struggle to get to events, and yes it’s much harder to commit to a day rather than posting for 5 mins a day. I do get that. I’m not for one minute suggesting it’s any different.

My comment was the general apathy, lack of enthusiasm or posting in the thread about the Huddersfield jam specifically because it’s the birthday bash. Even people not coming could have made a contribution to the thread in a positive encouraging way. I think Tony really wanted the 5th birthday party to be a success but it just hasn’t. Out of the 1000 or so regular contributors we are struggling to get 20 to turn up. Of the 20 who are, 10 or so are regular jammers. 

Anyway, I’ve moved on now. I’m bored of the navel gazing and the “this is what’s wrong with this place” threads. There’s too much hand wringing going on. I’ve done my hand wringing and I don’t particularly want to do any more. 

DefaultM

Strangefan said:

I really don't know why this is being discussed again  the admim team are not even considering let alone trialing any proper change, so they have to deal with the shit that comes their way, sorry but their have been so many suggestions to improve it which have been met with brick walls,..  They're clearly happy with the new sell sell sell vibe here. 

Agreed. You can't advertise the forum at national guitar shows in order to get new members, then be surprised when the forum changes away from the small community it was when it began.

Hattigol

Are people, particularity grown-up people, seriously bothered by someone giving their comments a 'lol'?

I'm going to write to the Oxford English Dictionary. The word 'precious' needs redefining.

(And I will cry until I'm sick if anyone lol's this)...

Roland

Strangefan said:

I really don't know why this is being discussed again  the admim team are not even considering let alone trialing any proper change ...

Changes are being considered, both within the moderation team and with larger groups. Several changes have been trialled. At least one has been implemented. For obvious reasons none of this takes place in public view.

Strangefan said:

... their have been so many suggestions to improve it which have been met with brick walls,..  They're clearly happy with the new sell sell sell vibe here. 

There are many opinions on what should be done, and what the impact would be. You only have to read this thread to see some of the ideas about Classified access: post count, membership fee, advert fee, sales fee, private rooms, etc. Most of these have been dismissed because there’s not a clear advantage in implementing them, and each brings considerable risk to the spirit of openness on which the forum was founded. Anything that restricts access introduces a “them and us” feeling which we want to avoid.

Speaking as a forum member what annoys me about the Classifieds is not people who join in the hope of a tariff free sale. It’s people who won’t write a decent advert. We had one yesterday which effectively said “I’ve got a guitar and I want £4,000 for it”. No description or pictures. Most of those people get ignored. Their threads don’t get viewed. There’s no admin effort involved unless I choose to tutor them on writing an advert.

DefaultM said:

You can't advertise the forum at national guitar shows in order to get new members, then be surprised when the forum changes away from the small community it was when it began.

Precisely! The forum has grown. Internet behaviour has changed. None of us are the same people that we were five years ago, or longer if you consider the Musicradar and Intermusic fore-runners. We have to embrace that change. No degree of increasingly intrusive moderation will bring back 2013. On the contrary, it would be considered censorship. 

Bridgehouse said:

... I’m bored of the navel gazing and the “this is what’s wrong with this place” threads. There’s too much hand wringing going on. I’ve done my hand wringing and I don’t particularly want to do any more. 

Yes, on which note I’m going back to the real world for a few hours.