anyone here gigged a Roland JC40.......

skaguitar

I keep seeing and hearing about the legendary clean tones from these amps and when I watch old ska and reggae players on you tube I see a lot of the JC120's being used... so my question is is the jc40 gutsy enough to gig in a 9 piece ska band and be heard.
We do generally mic everything up so I know that in most situations it'll be fine but ocasionally.( last Saturday being an example ) the sound engineer doesn't mic the guitar amp up.
Also I've read that on these amps that one speaker is dry and the other wet and that is how you get the chorus sound...?... so where would you place the mic to get the best sound.. I wouldn't want to mic up each speaker seperately.

cheers guys

smigeon

Spookily, I’m just now off to (probably) buy a J-40! I tried it last week and loved it, and if I love it as much today, I’ll get it. I only really played solo clean jazzy stuff on it though. It did seem pretty spanky to me though - e.g. louder than my PRRI. I did briefly wind the distortion up on it and it sounded OK (this with a tele) but this wouldn’t be how I would use it.

Given that that’s my only experience, I obviously can’t say if it would be gutsy enough to gig with - and anyway, as usual, it all depends on the gigging set up. My expectation would be only to gig it in a fairly quiet “coffee bar” type band, and I’d be very confident of it that that context. In fact the other guitarist in that band used a JC-22 (the tiny version with 8” speakers) the other week, and he was audible just fine even with that, albeit he said it lacked bass (unsurprisingly!).

So, anyway, I can’t say anything with authority, beyond my confidence that it woukd be fine to gig in my circs, and probably fine in yours also.

Good point, BTW, about the challenge of micing it with the wet and dry speakers - but it has built in DI (mono or stereo) so I’d use that.

west

Sorry cant help with the 40 but i used to have the jc77 and it was fab with a 9 piece soul band , dont remember taking any care to mic a specific speaker , sounded excellent for the clean jangles ....

Creed_Clicks

Have also been thinking about one of these! I am guessing they would take pedals well too?

skaguitar

smigeon said:

Spookily, I’m just now off to (probably) buy a J-40! I tried it last week and loved it, and if I love it as much today, I’ll get it. I only really played solo clean jazzy stuff on it though. It did seem pretty spanky to me though - e.g. louder than my PRRI. I did briefly wind the distortion up on it and it sounded OK (this with a tele) but this wouldn’t be how I would use it.

Given that that’s my only experience, I obviously can’t say if it would be gutsy enough to gig with - and anyway, as usual, it all depends on the gigging set up. My expectation would be only to gig it in a fairly quiet “coffee bar” type band, and I’d be very confident of it that that context. In fact the other guitarist in that band used a JC-22 (the tiny version with 8” speakers) the other week, and he was audible just fine even with that, albeit he said it lacked bass (unsurprisingly!).

So, anyway, I can’t say anything with authority, beyond my confidence that it woukd be fine to gig in my circs, and probably fine in yours also.

Good point, BTW, about the challenge of micing it with the wet and dry speakers - but it has built in DI (mono or stereo) so I’d use that.

Let me know how you get on with it... tone report please..

west said:

Sorry cant help with the 40 but i used to have the jc77 and it was fab with a 9 piece soul band , dont remember taking any care to mic a specific speaker , sounded excellent for the clean jangles ....

I didn't know there was a 77... need to look into this..cheers 

FreddieVanHalen

@skaguitar not sure if you bought something today or not, but I have a JC40 that I'd part with if you're still looking...

skaguitar

FreddieVanHalen said:

@skaguitar not sure if you bought something today or not, but I have a JC40 that I'd part with if you're still looking...

@FreddieVanHalen  I haven’t bought anything yet although I’ve found a JC120 head that looks interesting...how old is yours...how much are you looking for and where are you based..?

FreddieVanHalen

Hi, it's about four years old, bought from bintytwanger of this parish.

I'm based in East/Central London and could meet up at a London station if needed, or you could collect and drink my tea whilst testing it.

Prob looking at around £350 if collected, which is less than I coughed up for it :-)

skaguitar

FreddieVanHalen said:

Hi, it's about four years old, bought from bintytwanger of this parish.

I'm based in East/Central London and could meet up at a London station if needed, or you could collect and drink my tea whilst testing it.

Prob looking at around £350 if collected, which is less than I coughed up for it :-)

Ok...I need to do a bit more research on these and their bigger brother..seems like a very good price for one though...cheers

What are your thoughts on it's gigging capabilities..?

FreddieVanHalen

skaguitar said:

What are your thoughts on it's gigging capabilities..?

No worries. Hard for me to say I'm afraid as I don't gig at the moment...hence the sale.

Wish I could be more helpful with this question but I don't want to mislead. The upside is that it's very portable and if you can mic it you'll be golden.

If you need the amp on its own to overpower 9 bits of brass whilst staying sparkly clean I just don't know...

skaguitar

FreddieVanHalen said:

skaguitar said:

What are your thoughts on it's gigging capabilities..?

No worries. Hard for me to say I'm afraid as I don't gig at the moment...hence the sale.

Wish I could be more helpful with this question but I don't want to mislead. The upside is that it's very portable and if you can mic it you'll be golden.

If you need the amp on its own to overpower 9 bits of brass whilst staying sparkly clean I just don't know...

As I said I normally mic up and have gigged my Princeton with no bother...the band is made up of a ( loud ) drummer..bass..keys..trombone..trumpet...sax..guitar and 2 vocalists so I have quite a lot to contend with..but every now and then we get to a gig and they don't mic the guitar up..that's where I'd need it to be powerful enough...I've read that the JC40's speakers become a bit flubby and raspy if turned up more than 5-6 and that is my only concern..I need to try one to be honest.

smigeon

Well I did get a JC-40 today - paid £509 new. Have only played it so far in the shop and at home, but it does seem to go louder than my Princeton 68 RI does, without flub. 

I absolutely love it! Lovely clean clarity and really lets the character of different guitars shine through. Not better or worse than the Princeton, just really complementary.

I’ll post later, prob in a few days, when I have more experience with it. (I need to give my left wrist a break - been playing so much today that I’m getting twinges. :-()

I can confirm that the amp has built in “line out” jacks which might be a viable alternative to micing up - again, will check over the next few days. On my Princeton I use a passive Palmer “the junction” DI box which works very well for clean, so I expect I’ll try that on the JC too (although the JC has no extension speaker jack, which is what I use to connect the Palmer to the Princeton, so I’d need to wire the Palmer directly to a speaker on the JC). More later...

skaguitar

smigeon said:

Well I did get a JC-40 today - paid £509 new. Have only played it so far in the shop and at home, but it does seem to go louder than my Princeton 68 RI does, without flub. 

I absolutely love it! Lovely clean clarity and really lets the character of different guitars shine through. Not better or worse than the Princeton, just really complementary.

I’ll post later, prob in a few days, when I have more experience with it. (I need to give my left wrist a break - been playing so much today that I’m getting twinges. :-()

I can confirm that the amp has built in “line out” jacks which might be a viable alternative to micing up - again, will check over the next few days. On my Princeton I use a passive Palmer “the junction” DI box which works very well for clean, so I expect I’ll try that on the JC too (although the JC has no extension speaker jack, which is what I use to connect the Palmer to the Princeton, so I’d need to wire the Palmer directly to a speaker on the JC). More later...

thanks for that... sounds like it could be viable for gigging with then.
this may be a stupid question but when you use the line out to the PA does that then bypass the speakers or as well as the sound coming from the speakers...because when miced up at gigs I basically use my amp as my monitor so would need it to be as well as..not instead of if you know what I mean..?

smigeon

No, line out doesn’t mute the speakers.

One wrinkle though is that if you want the Chorus sound in the PA, you have to send ouput from both line out jacks (i.e. the L/mono one and R one). If you send just L/mono you only get the dry signal that goes to the JC40s L speaker. I guess this is because of Roland’s thing is that the chorus effect is something that takes place “in the air” between stereo speakers. You do still get reverb, though, if you only use the L/mono jack.

ICBM

smigeon said:

One wrinkle though is that if you want the Chorus sound in the PA, you have to send ouput from both line out jacks (i.e. the L/mono one and R one). If you send just L/mono you only get the dry signal that goes to the JC40s L speaker. I guess this is because of Roland’s thing is that the chirus effect is something that takes place “in the air” between stereo speakers. You do still get reverb, though, if you only use the L/mono jack.

That's really stupid - surely the whole point of a jack marked 'mono' is that when the other one isn't in use, it should give a mixed mono signal. It might be possible to mod it to do that, in fact.

The need to mic both speakers if you're using the stereo chorus is a known characteristic of these amps, but it is exactly because the chorus happens in the air that's why it's so big and natural-sounding.

EricTheWeary

There's a chap on TDPRI who espouses the brilliance of the JC40 for gigging, he plays in a punk band IIRC. And I think that cutting through the mix in a nine peice ska band requires less volume than battling a horn section.
I'd love to try one at band level, the JC120 is definitely the sound of The Beat especially as they got into Afro pop.

I presume the Jamaican artists in the 60s were using the American valve combos of the day. Ernest Ranglin was using quite smart US guitars in the sixties so I guess he had matching amps. He's used a JC120 since the 70s though. 

@skaguitar do you use flatwounds? When I'm listening to stuff like Jimmy Cliff l,and that very percussive guitar, in my head that's flatwounds ( and that was almost certainly what they were using). 

smigeon

I've not actually tried the line outs yet - it may possibly be that the L/mono jack does sum the dry and wet channels if it's the only one connected, the manual is a little unclear on that...

It *is* clear on the matter of not muting the speakers.

skaguitar

EricTheWeary said:

There's a chap on TDPRI who espouses the brilliance of the JC40 for gigging, he plays in a punk band IIRC. And I think that cutting through the mix in a nine peice ska band requires less volume than battling a horn section.
I'd love to try one at band level, the JC120 is definitely the sound of The Beat especially as they got into Afro pop.

I presume the Jamaican artists in the 60s were using the American valve combos of the day. Ernest Ranglin was using quite smart US guitars in the sixties so I guess he had matching amps. He's used a JC120 since the 70s though. 

@skaguitar do you use flatwounds? When I'm listening to stuff like Jimmy Cliff l,and that very percussive guitar, in my head that's flatwounds ( and that was almost certainly what they were using). 

I’ve been listening to Misty in Roots and Black Uhuru recently and all their guitarists seem to use the JC120 ...a very distinctive clean sound..as iconic as a fender twin I’d say.
I have flatwounds on my 335 but not in my strat or tele.... I seem to be able to get that percussive sound from either but have been told that flats cut down fret noise too...  I need to try one of these amps before buying though

EricTheWeary

Those 1980s bands from South Africa and Zimbabwe and the Soukous musicians from the Congo used JC120s with lots of the chorus on, sometimes a delay as well. It's so distinctive and you hear it copied by
The Beat, Talking Heads or even Vampire Weekend. 

skaguitar said:

EricTheWeary said:

There's a chap on TDPRI who espouses the brilliance of the JC40 for gigging, he plays in a punk band IIRC. And I think that cutting through the mix in a nine peice ska band requires less volume than battling a horn section.
I'd love to try one at band level, the JC120 is definitely the sound of The Beat especially as they got into Afro pop.

I presume the Jamaican artists in the 60s were using the American valve combos of the day. Ernest Ranglin was using quite smart US guitars in the sixties so I guess he had matching amps. He's used a JC120 since the 70s though. 

@skaguitar do you use flatwounds? When I'm listening to stuff like Jimmy Cliff l,and that very percussive guitar, in my head that's flatwounds ( and that was almost certainly what they were using). 

I’ve been listening to Misty in Roots and Black Uhuru recently and all their guitarists seem to use the JC120 ...a very distinctive clean sound..as iconic as a fender twin I’d say.
I have flatwounds on my 335 but not in my strat or tele.... I seem to be able to get that percussive sound from either but have been told that flats cut down fret noise too...  I need to try one of these amps before buying though

Apparently Junior Marvin used a JC120 with Bob Marley.

Anyway, rambling on...

Reverend

Only time I've ever uses them has been the odd time in a rehearsal room and not been able to get a good sound. I know Billy Duffy gets a good driven sound from some version of the JC. Any ideas what The secret is?

John_A

Reverend said:

Only time I've ever uses them has been the odd time in a rehearsal room and not been able to get a good sound. I know Billy Duffy gets a good driven sound from some version of the JC. Any ideas what The secret is?

Billy Duffy runs his clean, and runs a jcm800 dirty alongside.