Guitar vs Amp

impmann

Rocker said:

 

No sense at all in destroying the sound of the guitar/amp by using an excessive number of FX pedals. If you need a lot of FX pedals, there is something wrong with your core sound. Get that part right first. IMHO. 

Errr... no, not necessarily.

If you are creating a sound that is completely nothing like a 'classic' guitar sound, then its not "destroying" the sound. If you are trying to recreate 'classic' sounds then you may be right, but not everyone wants to do that...

For example, I use pedals to create synth like sounds - because I can't play synth. I may use a chain of six or seven pedals to do that. Nothing wrong with my core sound, its just I don't necessarily want to hear that.

joetele

Rocker said:

The guitar and amp are a unit. Some combinations work better than others. There is no right answer, whatever works for you - keep on using it. 

No sense at all in destroying the sound of the guitar/amp by using an excessive number of FX pedals. If you need a lot of FX pedals, there is something wrong with your core sound. Get that part right first. IMHO. 

impmann said:

Rocker said:

 

No sense at all in destroying the sound of the guitar/amp by using an excessive number of FX pedals. If you need a lot of FX pedals, there is something wrong with your core sound. Get that part right first. IMHO. 

Errr... no, not necessarily.

If you are creating a sound that is completely nothing like a 'classic' guitar sound, then its not "destroying" the sound. If you are trying to recreate 'classic' sounds then you may be right, but not everyone wants to do that...

For example, I use pedals to create synth like sounds - because I can't play synth. I may use a chain of six or seven pedals to do that. Nothing wrong with my core sound, its just I don't necessarily want to hear that.

Yup - @impmann sums it up for me here - I of course want a lovely transparent guitar tone through a nice clean amp - and the pedals I tend to favour aren't for gain - they're for things like delay, reverb, and as Impmann says, things like synth. There seem to be a lot of misconceptions on the site surrounding pedals and the user's intentions - you can have a nice guitar tone and be able to play well, and enjoy using lots of different pedals too. I've seen a lot of comments with guitarists belittling those who choose to have lots of pedals/large pedalboards, is if it's somehow an inferior practice. Live and let live. 

Lestratcaster

Tone starts with the fingers! I can't stand people who think that buying the same equipment as their favourite artists will give them the EXACT same tone, they don't have the same skin genetics or touch as them, how many people want to sound like David Gilmour and actually succeed?

Anderz

Guitars have to feel right and amps should make it perfectly clear every time you plug in and power on and then turn up.

I have found effects to be the less value in the middle of that. Guitar great and amp likewise. Time for the effect? LOL crap.

My partscaster have the ability to sound awesome through every amp so there you have to be careful if the amp is really right.

jeztone2

I guess I’ve always seen the whole thing as a recipe. 

In my current band I’ve been using either my Yamaha SG1000 or my Les Paul. After I recovered my Stolen PRS CU22, I took it to rehearsal and with he same rig, I’ve noticed a more pronounced mid range and I’m not getting in the way of the Bass player with low end. So I can really hear a difference.

maltingsaudio

DannyP said:

If the OP wanted more agreement, he should have posted this in Amps!

Thought long and hard about that but as the Guitar section has 20k of discussions but the amp section has only 601 discussions it would appear that the general consensus on this forum is guitar weighted.

I'm not actually looking for more agreement, just chucking out a random thought looking for opinions and discussion. 

guitars4you

arayadis said:

For sound, amp is more important I think. You can find hundreds of youtube videos like 300$ guitar vs 10000$ comparison videos and they sound "similar". 
For performans and feeling ofcourse guitar more important.

they will through budget computer monitors and compressed digital audio - Here them in the flesh and a bigger difference - Is the difference worth the extra $9700 then not for me to answer or disagree

thegummy

I've always just used amp modelers so I just have to press a button to get a completely different amp sound  

Nikc

I see a guitar and amp as 'the' instrument in terms of sound. Personally I don't use many pedals (just an over drive) but that suits what I like to play. For those that do use effects I get that the combination of guitar, effects and amp is their instrument. Ultimately I kinda view it all as a balancing act, guitars for feel and playability, amps for the sound and effects well for effect  

57Deluxe

what gives you the greater pleasure in Scalextrix ownership? Heavily detailed cars or a sensible amount of track?...or  - a finely responsive contoller...?

Gadget

I'm betting that if you gave Gilmour or Clapton a Squier Start and a USA Fender CS Strat, they'd make both guitars sound very very similar through any single amp.

Leave them with the USA Strat, but change the amp between a Squier combo and a USA Fender CS combo and the difference would be a lot more marked.

richardhomer

Gadget said:

I'm betting that if you gave Gilmour or Clapton a Squier Start and a USA Fender CS Strat, they'd make both guitars sound very very similar through any single amp.

Leave them with the USA Strat, but change the amp between a Squier combo and a USA Fender CS combo and the difference would be a lot more marked.

There was an interview where Gilmour said something along the lines of ‘Give me any Strat and a few Boss pedals and it’ll sound like me’.

I actually think the most important part of the signal chain is always the player. The ones who are instantly identifiable stamp their personality on the equipment they use. I’m not suggesting that (say) Clapton playing a 335 is tonally identical to him playing a Strat - but I can still tell it’s him.

p90fool

thegummy said:

I've always just used amp modelers so I just have to press a button to get a completely different sound  

FTFY

guitarfishbay

There are only a small range of distinct sounds originating from the guitar anyway, if we're talking broad brush strokes.

Single coil (broad subgroups Tele, Strat, P90)
Humbucker (broad subgroups PAF, High Output, Active)

Then you've got in between positions, hollow and solid body... and that's probably about it.

As guitarists we often get stuck on the minute details, I'm no different but I try to remind myself every once in a while.

Teetonetal

All the gear in the world means nothing if you, as a player, are a bit shit. Sort out the skills and the gear is just the means to an end.

guitars4you

Teetonetal said:

All the gear in the world means nothing if you, as a player, are a bit shit. Sort out the skills and the gear is just the means to an end.

to a large degree - but give a shit guitar to a shit player and he'll probably stay that way - Give a good guitar to a shit player and they can generally feel the difference and hopefully this will help to inspire them to improve

Gadget

My good gear certainly makes me sound better than I am

Teetonetal

guitars4you said:

Teetonetal said:

All the gear in the world means nothing if you, as a player, are a bit shit. Sort out the skills and the gear is just the means to an end.

to a large degree - but give a shit guitar to a shit player and he'll probably stay that way - Give a good guitar to a shit player and they can generally feel the difference and hopefully this will help to inspire them to improve

I think that's missing the point. The OP is another one about finding the perfect tone.

I'm convinced that for tone, the no 1 part that's easiest to improve is the player. The lazy option is to buy gear and hope it makes a difference.

A good guitar player will get the most out of any setup that comes his way. One or other might feel better to the player, but it won't stop him sounding good.

Now I do agree poorly made or badly setup gear will put off any player, but once you get playable gear, concentrate on getting good with it first and foremost.

guitars4you

Teetonetal said:

guitars4you said:

Teetonetal said:

All the gear in the world means nothing if you, as a player, are a bit shit. Sort out the skills and the gear is just the means to an end.

to a large degree - but give a shit guitar to a shit player and he'll probably stay that way - Give a good guitar to a shit player and they can generally feel the difference and hopefully this will help to inspire them to improve

I think that's missing the point. The OP is another one about finding the perfect tone.

I'm convinced that for tone, the no 1 part that's easiest to improve is the player. The lazy option is to buy gear and hope it makes a difference.

A good guitar player will get the most out of any setup that comes his way. One or other might feel better to the player, but it won't stop him sounding good.

Now I do agree poorly made or badly setup gear will put off any player, but once you get playable gear, concentrate on getting good with it first and foremost.

Yet as you know, you have to learn how to get the best out of the guitar and amp when playing live/rehearsing - Far easier to get some tone from a processed Zoom in your bedroom, that is not responsive to you or any guitar - Yet a good guitar and valve amp you need to learn how to use it, find the sweet spot and use the guitar pots for additional emotion + expression - No manual tells you how to do this - You play and learn it - As an overview the likes of BB KIng and Kossoff nailed this - I know plenty of others have, but these are 2 great examples of how to work it, with far more 'simplistic' equipment, certainly regarding the amp

Yet as we both know, you can't buy a 'better player' and trade in the one you are - yes some lessons are a help and well worth pursuing for many  

Granted a good player will achieve good results with a Squier and a PV Bandit - but ask which they'd rather play/own

Rocker

It really comes down to how you as the guitarist sounds or fits into a band situation. Hence my (ignored by quoters) statement that the guitar and amp should be considered as one entity. If you need a certain sound, how does that sound sit in in your band sound?

It has to be easier to use a synth to get synth sounds than by using a guitar plus pedal. The synth can have its own amp or be fed into the PA, thus sounding as good as it can be. Not compromised by going through a guitar amp.

For the record, I use no FX for bass playing and a SparkleDrive to give a touch of drive for guitar. The music I play is country (American and Irish), country rock (CCR, The Eagles etc) and what is described as camp fire songs.