Prices gone OTT?

Chalky

I've seen a few guitars in the classifieds recently that were/are a little overpriced? No names but some want more than they paid brand new for a guitar only a few years old!

Then we see the Peach R8 sale for bargain prices.  Are we seeing the top of the secondhand market prices?

Brize

There will always be people who are completely delusional about the second-hand value of their gear. They often think that they're doing potential buyers a favour by saving them a few hundred quid over the new price.

If you can get over two-thirds of the new price in the used market, you're doing very well.

johnl

 The "I only want back what it owes me" crowd honestly do my head in. If it's a bog standard mass-produced guitar that's not limited or special in any way then it is not worth exactly what you paid for it 5 years ago, regardless of how much you'd like it to be.

terada

The difference is when the price increases much more than inflation. Then the second hand price is also inflated, which can take it beyond what a buyer bought it for x years prior.

Both Gibson and fender have increased their prices across the board massively in the last decade.

Funkfingers

Those of you who have traded with HarrySeven will know that he is keen on value-for-value exchanges. This way, it does not matter whether both parties to a deal are settling for realistic market valuations or delusionally inflated ones. Either way, any cash difference will be about the same.

Adam_MD

johnl said:

 The "I only want back what it owes me" crowd honestly do my head in. If it's a bog standard mass-produced guitar that's not limited or special in any way then it is not worth exactly what you paid for it 5 years ago, regardless of how much you'd like it to be.

I usually see people posting that in relation to gear they bought secondhand never new.  I always take it to mean they’re not trying to make money on it.  

johnl

Adam_MD said:

johnl said:

 The "I only want back what it owes me" crowd honestly do my head in. If it's a bog standard mass-produced guitar that's not limited or special in any way then it is not worth exactly what you paid for it 5 years ago, regardless of how much you'd like it to be.

I usually see people posting that in relation to gear they bought secondhand never new.  I always take it to mean they’re not trying to make money on it.  

Completely agreed but that's why I find it (irrationally) annoying. It's as if someone is doing me a favour by not trying to charge me more than they paid for their slightly beaten up Squier Strat 5 years ago - my assumption with my gear is always that it's losing value pretty much from the second I pick it up.

chrisjac2

Surely the price is dictated by the market? Something is only worth what some one is willing to pay for it? Generally people drop the price till it goes

richardhomer

Adam_MD said:

johnl said:

 The "I only want back what it owes me" crowd honestly do my head in. If it's a bog standard mass-produced guitar that's not limited or special in any way then it is not worth exactly what you paid for it 5 years ago, regardless of how much you'd like it to be.

I usually see people posting that in relation to gear they bought secondhand never new.  I always take it to mean they’re not trying to make money on it.  

I don’t have any problem with this at all - assuming it’s true. I think the sub-text is ‘don’t take the piss out of me with a low offer’. 

As I’ve said before, my pet peeve is someone advertising that they’re looking for something - you message them - and then they tell you their ‘budget’ is significantly below the ‘going rate’. Given that sellers have to name their price in the classifieds here, I can’t see any reason why ‘wanted’ ads aren’t required to post a ‘my maximum price is’ figure....

Fishboy7

Some stuff has been listed on eBay for well over a year; but for some reason the sellers don't reduce the price below 100% of retail. 

HarrySeven

Funkfingers said:

Those of you who have traded with HarrySeven will know that he is keen on value-for-value exchanges. This way, it does not matter whether both parties to a deal are settling for realistic market valuations or delusionally inflated ones. Either way, any cash difference will be about the same.

Thank you @Funkfingers.

mudslide73

Fishboy7 said:

Some stuff has been listed on eBay for well over a year; but for some reason the sellers don't reduce the price below 100% of retail. 

It's just to keep their Mrs happy. Some blokes deliberately misspell things to avoid selling them too. I saw a US Chavel San Dimas sit around for months on the bay.

breakstuff

A couple of years ago I sold a Fender 50's Classic Series Strat in surf green for £250.Given that they're £600 new now many would think i let it go for too cheap,but when you consider I paid £380 for it brand new I think I did ok.

At today's prices £350/400 would be a  fair price,but I was happy,the buyer was happy.It's all relative.


Still regret selling it though.They're great guitars.

guitars4you

When you can effectively list a guitar for sale at no expense to the seller, be it FB or Reverb, then you can see why some will try a high price, then hope and see what happens - Yes some maybe delusional about the price, but then they can either reduce it at a later date and let reality come into play - Or are they ever serious about trying to sell it in the first place ?

Equally I'll get a customer who paid £2000 for a guitar 1 month ago, purchased from another dealer, then think they'll get £1900 back for it - It won't happen - Granted they don't want to loose much, or indeed anything - So don't sell it and you won't loose anything 

Are we seeing the top of the used market ? - Only if new prices fall and I don't see that on the horizon - Granted the Peach R8 deal is a great deal but these are exceptional items - I've never seen any business stay open for to long by selling £10 notes for a £5 - As prices have/are rising it will generally push the used market up with it, in due course - Certainly on popular brands and classic models - The 1/3 of the new price is always a good guide line, assuming it is still a current model - If it is a discontinued model, then it will depend on the model and demand etc as to where the price on the used market place will take it

I think a big difference on a classified price is if they need to sell it, to finance other personal bills, as some desperation comes into play - As against, if I sell it I might now buy XYZ so let's try it for sale at the inflated price and see what happens

Jalapeno

Simple economics - £/$ & £/€ slide means new prices are higher - hence so are 2nd hand prices .....

fendergibson

guitars4you said:

When you can effectively list a guitar for sale at no expense to the seller, be it FB or Reverb, then you can see why some will try a high price, then hope and see what happens - Yes some maybe delusional about the price, but then they can either reduce it at a later date and let reality come into play - Or are they ever serious about trying to sell it in the first place ?

Equally I'll get a customer who paid £2000 for a guitar 1 month ago, purchased from another dealer, then think they'll get £1900 back for it - It won't happen - Granted they don't want to loose much, or indeed anything - So don't sell it and you won't loose anything 

Are we seeing the top of the used market ? - Only if new prices fall and I don't see that on the horizon - Granted the Peach R8 deal is a great deal but these are exceptional items - I've never seen any business stay open for to long by selling £10 notes for a £5 - As prices have/are rising it will generally push the used market up with it, in due course - Certainly on popular brands and classic models - The 1/3 of the new price is always a good guide line, assuming it is still a current model - If it is a discontinued model, then it will depend on the model and demand etc as to where the price on the used market place will take it

I think a big difference on a classified price is if they need to sell it, to finance other personal bills, as some desperation comes into play - As against, if I sell it I might now buy XYZ so let's try it for sale at the inflated price and see what happens

I’m in the market for another Fender CS relic and have been fairly startled at second hand prices. 
Would it be fair to say those in particular are bucking the trend somewhat ? They seem to be high and stay high.

guitars4you

fendergibson said:

guitars4you said:

When you can effectively list a guitar for sale at no expense to the seller, be it FB or Reverb, then you can see why some will try a high price, then hope and see what happens - Yes some maybe delusional about the price, but then they can either reduce it at a later date and let reality come into play - Or are they ever serious about trying to sell it in the first place ?

Equally I'll get a customer who paid £2000 for a guitar 1 month ago, purchased from another dealer, then think they'll get £1900 back for it - It won't happen - Granted they don't want to loose much, or indeed anything - So don't sell it and you won't loose anything 

Are we seeing the top of the used market ? - Only if new prices fall and I don't see that on the horizon - Granted the Peach R8 deal is a great deal but these are exceptional items - I've never seen any business stay open for to long by selling £10 notes for a £5 - As prices have/are rising it will generally push the used market up with it, in due course - Certainly on popular brands and classic models - The 1/3 of the new price is always a good guide line, assuming it is still a current model - If it is a discontinued model, then it will depend on the model and demand etc as to where the price on the used market place will take it

I think a big difference on a classified price is if they need to sell it, to finance other personal bills, as some desperation comes into play - As against, if I sell it I might now buy XYZ so let's try it for sale at the inflated price and see what happens

I’m in the market for another Fender CS relic and have been fairly startled at second hand prices. 
Would it be fair to say those in particular are bucking the trend somewhat ? They seem to be high and stay high.

you don't see any/many under 2K now - new prices on 2017/2018 orders are generally over 3K and as such many have now listed used models over 2Kish

Gadget

richardhomer said:

...As I’ve said before, my pet peeve is someone advertising that they’re looking for something - you message them - and then they tell you their ‘budget’ is significantly below the ‘going rate’. Given that sellers have to name their price in the classifieds here, I can’t see any reason why ‘wanted’ ads aren’t required to post a ‘my maximum price is’ figure....

I totally agree, so long as the same rule about not trolling people over prices applies just the same as it does for FS ads. I've done WTB ads in the past stating how much I'm looking to pay, only to be harassed by comments along the lines of "you'll be lucky mate!", "you 'avein a laugh?!" and "I paid x amount more for mine!".

It's a classifieds rule that (no matter how frustrating for potential buyers) a seller can ask whatever price he / she wants without reproach. The same should apply to WTB. Then let negotiations commence via PM.

richh

Fender Custom Shop models have fairly consistently sold for £1700 - £1800 or more for a while, so if new prices are going up, it is not surprising that used prices have gone up also.  But they are probably still a safe buy, as you would likely sell for a similar amount in the future.  Which is generally about as good as it gets I'd have thought?

fendergibson

richh said:

Fender Custom Shop models have fairly consistently sold for £1700 - £1800 or more for a while, so if new prices are going up, it is not surprising that used prices have gone up also.  But they are probably still a safe buy, as you would likely sell for a similar amount in the future.  Which is generally about as good as it gets I'd have thought?

Suppose we can blame the exchange rates for a lot of the pricing. Agree on that they are a safe buy. Wish I hadn’t sold my last one :-(

vale

Brize said:

If you can get over two-thirds of the new price in the used market, you're doing very well.

my general rule of thumb too. two thirds if it's clean and true, down to half the value if it has any significant issues (faulty electrics, important bumps, missing bits, etc). that's for general things that are still available anyway, squiers, etc.
but there are some ebay listers who are delusional. i honestly think they have some mental problem which blinds them to the concept of new things devaluing over time. too much 'antiques roadshow' and not enough reality maybe?

Funkfingers said:

Those of you who have traded with HarrySeven will know that he is keen on value-for-value exchanges. This way, it does not matter whether both parties to a deal are settling for realistic market valuations or delusionally inflated ones. Either way, any cash difference will be about the same.

totally respect that. i haven't had the pleasure yet but my instincts about him suggest as much. i'd very much like to clone HarrySeven and replace 75% of the sellers of the world with those clones.
actually make that 80% of the england football team, 90% of the cast of eastenders and 100% of parliament.

chrisjac2 said:

Surely the price is dictated by the market? Something is only worth what some one is willing to pay for it? Generally people drop the price till it goes

non-price-drop 'bump-itis' is a terrible affliction that can go on for many months.

richardhomer said:

As I’ve said before, my pet peeve is someone advertising that they’re looking for something - you message them - and then they tell you their ‘budget’ is significantly below the ‘going rate’. Given that sellers have to name their price in the classifieds here, I can’t see any reason why ‘wanted’ ads aren’t required to post a ‘my maximum price is’ figure....

totally agree. personally i usually state a min-max depending on condition if i post a wtb. but a max figure would serve the same purpose just as well.