Having trouble with learning lead styles

CharlesJS

Is this something best learned from a teacher? I am mostly self taught on guitar with a few lessons here and there; plus the 5 or so years of lessons and 3 other instruments I used to play as a kid. ringtones free

I'm more specifically talking about guitarists such as SRV and Santana. Tabs and sheet music can only get me so far. I am having trouble finding information on their unique styles and how to go about learning/practicing. 

Chords bore me and I mostly stick to a lead style when I play. I'm pretty good at the pentatonic scales but when improving I feel like my styles are not evolving and my sound stays the same.

Guitar ringtone

Any advice?

p90fool

Dare I be the first to say it?

It's probably because chords bore you. Lead guitar uses them as a jumping off point, and if you don't understand the structure of what you're playing over and your interaction with it then you will just end up in a rut. 

HAL9000

You might find chords ‘boring’ but remember that, in a live situation, most players will spend 90% of their time going ‘chugga chugga’ and only 10% going ‘Neeeooooowww!’.

Get the chords right, learn the inversions, how different chords work (and resolve), etc. THEN start worrying about how, where, and why solos and fills fit in.

By pentatonics, I’m guessing you mean minor pentatonics. Learn the major pentatonics too, and learn to mix the two together. I once heard someone describe pentatonics as scales with the ‘awkward’ notes left out. That might be the case when you’re starting out - later on you’ll realise they’re actually scales with the interesting notes left out. If you know your pentatonics then you’ve always got something to fall back on if a solo starts to go tits up, but they’re certainly not the be all and end all.

sev112

HAL9000 said:

You might find chords ‘boring’ but remember that, in a live situation, most players will spend 90% of their time going ‘chugga chugga’ and only 10% going ‘Neeeooooowww!’.

Get the chords right, learn the inversions, how different chords work (and resolve), etc. THEN start worrying about how, where, and why solos and fills fit in.

I often say my favourite rhythm guitarist is Eddie van Halen.  He plays interesting and dynamic rhythm guitar which is so different from conventional thoughts that rhythm is knocking out 6 string chords while the singer sings or the lead guitarist dazzles.

ii play almost all my “rhythm” parts between the 5 and 12th fret, and there isn’t a barre to be seen. So I suppose you are right about inversions, although I found the notes up there that “fitted” rather than played a chord inversion, I just got there the other way round, and I found that  fun

antonyiv

Boring chords? No problem, learn inversions.

Regarding lead playing - try to spell out what you play - find the root and then the intervals that create the solo around the root. Like root-fifth-second and so on.

If that boring too, try soloing over changes - change the root of the solo as the chords change.

TeleMaster

I would say, learn solos. Go on YouTube and watch lessons and learn the solos of the songs you like. You’ll adopt the licks and riffs you like and develop a style that’s inspired by the people you like. 

57Deluxe

Oh yes - good tutorage is essential. I have a specific formula for learning lead and solo motifs and is something I have developed and it works a treat! Attempting to learn long rambling solos by the note-by-note process is laborious and bewildering.

Funkfingers

CharlesJS said:

Any advice?

Try bass guitar or drums.

p90fool said:

chords … jumping off point … structure … interaction

Actually, this applies to all band instruments. 

CharlesJS said:

… specifically … SRV and Santana … unique styles

Without wishing to appear patronising, you kinda just answered your own question.

SRV and Santana have unique, personal touches that make their performances instantly and unmistakeably recognisable.

Nobody will ever cop exactly what they do down to the finest detail. That goal is unachievable.

Set yourself achievable goals.

newi123

CharlesJS said:

Tabs and sheet music can only get me so far. I am having trouble finding information on their unique styles and how to go about learning/practicing. 

Any advice?

For the kind of style you`re after tabs are probably the wrong way to start. When SRV and Santana started and developed their styles, they would have done it by ear. If you have a basic grasp of playing, personally i`d go back and just listen through speakers and headphones (you`ll hear different things both ways) and then try and cop it.......... that way you get to learn the nuances you`re after that really can`t be conveyed through tab.

axisus

If you are having trouble with Lead Styles try Harry Styles. Much easier I'm told.

Roland

CharlesJS said:

... guitarists such as SRV and Santana. Tabs and sheet music can only get me so far. I am having trouble finding information on their unique styles and how to go about learning/practicing ... Any advice?

To play like that you need to understand their style of playing. YouTube will get you further than tab because you’ll hear the emphasis and timing which they use. You’ll also realise that a lot of tabs are wrong. The right teacher can take you even further.

As several people have said, you won’t get very far without learning the background. That means chords, arpeggios and scales. A lot of the time SRV plays a mixture of chords and single note fills. This means that he uses a lot of chord tones. To play like him you need to know what chords he’s playing over, rather than what scales/modes you can get away with.

A good example of what this learning contributes to your playing can be seen and heard in this video https://youtu.be/D-GpiMgq-EU where Justin Sandercoe introduces the major pentatonic, and then shows how it adds flavour to blues playing.

Lestratcaster

There's a big relationship between chords and scales so you shouldn't dismiss chord playing altogether. The CAGED system is a great way to learn scales too as they link in 5 fingerboard positions.

Getting a teacher will help you apply use it quicker as you get to jam with them and learn all the theory behind it.

tralfamadan

Transcribe the stuff you like. Slow it down as much as you need to - ideally in something that won't affect pitch (unlike YT) and work out what they're playing yourself and write it down however you like. Tab and sheet music only gets you so far - transcribing is the best way to learn imo; its just a real slog and can take a lot of time & effort.

fastonebaz

Learn to play solos in a major scale.  Very different vibe to pentatonic blues scales and with freshen up your soloing a treat. 

TeleMaster

tralfamadan said:

Transcribe the stuff you like. Slow it down as much as you need to - ideally in something that won't affect pitch (unlike YT) and work out what they're playing yourself and write it down however you like. Tab and sheet music only gets you so far - transcribing is the best way to learn imo; its just a real slog and can take a lot of time & effort.

Youtube doesn’t affect pitch if you slow it down. 

bloomer

I'll second that transcribing is a great way to learn. I recently started using free transcription software called musescore 3. What's great about it is it plays back your transcription so you can hear whether you've got it right or not. You can even add bent notes and vary the character of a bend (slow, prebend etc.). So far I've transcribed The fleetwood mac and santana versions of black magic woman as study of how two great players interpret the same song.  

Flanging_Fred

Santana spends an awful lot of time using the Dorian mode.

However, to understand properly what the Dorian mode is and how and why you use it, you really need to go back to first principles and really understand the Major scale first, as @fastonebaz suggests.  Justinguitar and a guy called Desi Serna, who does podcasts and books on theory for guitarists are great places to start.

DrJazzTap

I got a lot from the musicians institute lead guitar book. Learn the positions of the minor scale and then you'll be able to jam along to the greatest hits of Santana.
Chordal theory may sound boring but it'll give you an insight as to why you can play a particular scale or mode over a given chord.

Dominic

It's far harder to play GOOD rhythm guitar than lead .
To master inversions , suspensions , substitutions and partial chords over other chords with commonality  is a skilled art.
 I.E. -A Tune has 12 continuous bars of E7 
 Basic player simply plays 12 bars of a root position E7
 Skilled player can fit in 8 chords in that space that all suggest E7 but sound interesting and textured by using the above or a suspension like Bm9  etc etc

TeleMaster

Dominic said:

It's far harder to play GOOD rhythm guitar than lead .
To master inversions , suspensions , substitutions and partial chords over other chords with commonality  is a skilled art.
 I.E. -A Tune has 12 continuous bars of E7 
 Basic player simply plays 12 bars of a root position E7
 Skilled player can fit in 8 chords in that space that all suggest E7 but sound interesting and textured by using the above or a suspension like Bm9  etc etc

If I’m feeling adventurous I might move that E7 from the 12th.... to the 7th! Basic shmashic.

tralfamadan

TeleMaster said:
Youtube doesn’t affect pitch if you slow it down. 

My bad - In that case it's ideal. I got told otherwise and just went with it.