Tone is a LIE

Barnezy

You may have seen these already, but I think these video's give some context to why the tone we want is unattainable. 

Tone is a LIE


Tone is TRUTH 

thegummy

I want to know what's in that pipe he's smoking.

He seems to be suffering from a bad case of sophomania.

That unplugged Tele recorded on a laptop mic suddenly sounds good with other instruments added? Maybe if you're "tone" deaf...

TeleMaster

That Tele into the mic was atrocious. Out of time, poorly played. 

What is this?

Funkfingers

Parody.

thegummy

I have seen quite a few instances where someone lacks the experience and/or listening skills to hear things properly and projects that as a fact as if they're whistle blowing and had a profound break through when they realised that everyone else is wasting their time caring about something relating to tone.

Barnezy

I think it's a bit of a joke, but the point is still true, regarding tone in context. I also think the second video is quite informative. 

Rabs

Not Tone..  Timbre....   Even the main word is wrong  :P 

timbre

noun

noun: timbre; plural noun: timbres

1. the character or quality of a musical sound or voice as distinct from its pitch and intensity.

merciful-evans

He's done a great job of convincing himself. 

'Tone is tone' was his conclusion.
So... that's that then.

thegummy

Rabs said:

Not Tone..  Timbre....   Even the main word is wrong  :P 

timbre

noun

noun: timbre; plural noun: timbres

1. the character or quality of a musical sound or voice as distinct from its pitch and intensity.

I bet you comment on Facebook posts "it's their not there" :P 

Nikc

Tone - Noun 

A musical or vocal sound with reference to its, pitch, quality and strength 

synonyms: timbre, sound, sound quality, voice, colour, sound colour etc.... 

maybe not 'so' wrong after all

Rabs

thegummy said:

Rabs said:

Not Tone..  Timbre....   Even the main word is wrong  :P 

timbre

noun

noun: timbre; plural noun: timbres

1. the character or quality of a musical sound or voice as distinct from its pitch and intensity.

I bet you comment on Facebook posts "it's their not there" :P 

Haha no.... That was from another thread about "tone".. This time it was just my turn to be a silly arse    

I don't think actually its the language we use. Like creamy, scooped, crunchy etc etc..  Its what peoples exact expectations of those words mean, that's the issue because that comes from experience and even worse, individual taste so therefore is slightly different for everyone and why I think we get so caught up in trying to describe something that often comes from however we are feeling at any given time.

But hey.. If it were all as simple as that, we would all be amazing musicians with the best tone ever and we wouldn't need to discuss anything on here, apart from moaning about Gibsons QC or Rob Chapman or something.. Now that would really be boring

Bridgehouse

Rabs said:

thegummy said:

Rabs said:

Not Tone..  Timbre....   Even the main word is wrong  :P 

timbre

noun

noun: timbre; plural noun: timbres

1. the character or quality of a musical sound or voice as distinct from its pitch and intensity.

I bet you comment on Facebook posts "it's their not there" :P 

Haha no.... That was from another thread about "tone".. This time it was just my turn to be a silly arse    

I don't think actually its the language we use. Like creamy, scooped, crunchy etc etc..  Its what peoples exact expectations of those words mean, that's the issue because that comes from experience and even worse, individual taste so therefore is slightly different for everyone and why I think we get so caught up in trying to describe something that often comes from however we are feeling at any given time.

But hey.. If it were all as simple as that, we would all be amazing musicians with the best tone ever and we wouldn't need to discuss anything on here, apart from moaning about Gibsons QC or Rob Chapman or something.. Now that would really be boring

I made the original post.. I tried really hard to get my tongue even further into my cheek than I managed but it clearly wasn’t far enough

Rabs

Bridgehouse said:

I made the original post.. I tried really hard to get my tongue even further into my cheek than I managed but it clearly wasn’t far enough

Well this is a guitar forum..  What do you expect   

Im kind of surprised that I managed to mention ROB CHAPMAN without starting an argument   :P 

Bridgehouse

Rabs said:

Bridgehouse said:

I made the original post.. I tried really hard to get my tongue even further into my cheek than I managed but it clearly wasn’t far enough

Well this is a guitar forum..  What do you expect   

Im kind of surprised that I managed to mention ROB CHAPMAN without starting an argument   :P 

Outside, now!

NelsonP

I quite like ROB CHAPMAN

terada

Came here just to make the timbre comment. Too late. Nice one @Rabs ;

Rabs

terada said:

Came here just to make the timbre comment. Too late. Nice one @Rabs ;

Well my next comment would have been.. If I hadn't have said it someone else would..

I should have known that would be you   

stratman3142

 The logic seems arse about face to me. There are 'sounds' that work in the context of the overall mix. But in isolation they might not sound great.

 For example, guitar parts might sound good in isolation but too muddy in an overall mix. Removing the 'mud' can improve the overall mix, even though the guitars might then sound thin in isolation.

 So there's the approach of starting with good isolated sounds, then applying sound sculpting to achieve a good mix. That's quite different to starting with a poor sound and then trying to place it in a mix. 

Funkfingers

Bridgehouse said:

Outside Now

This is The Central Scrutinizer.

“Imaginary guitar notes exist only in the imagination of the Imaginer.”

Three-ColourSunburst

Another Zappa quote on the importance of timbre.

The Ultimate Rule ought to be: 'If it sounds GOOD to you, it's bitchin'; if it sounds BAD to YOU, it's shitty. The more your musical experience, the easier it is to define for yourself what you like and what you don't like. American radio listeners, raised on a diet of _____ (fill in the blank), have experienced a musical universe so small they cannot begin to know what they like.

In radio music, timbre rules (the texture of the tune, i.e., "Purple Haze" played on accordion is very different from Hendrix playing it on a squealing feedback guitar).

On record, the overall timbre of the piece (determined by equalization of individual parts and their proportions in the mix) tells you, in a subtle way, WHAT the song is about. The orchestration provides important information about what the composition IS and, in some instances, assumes a greater importance than the composition itself.

The Real Frank Zappa Book (1990), p.188.

dazzajl

The concept that what you play and how you play it is fundamental, while what you play on or through is marginal at best, seems pretty solid to me