Modifications and their effect on value.

JohnnyPlectrum

I came across a guitar on a popular site and it caught my eye. It was a signature guitar from a mainstream US manufacturer. The seller was not the original owner. It had been customised in the following manner;

No tags

No candy

Pickups changed

Control covers changed

Signature logo and serial numbers sanded from neck.

Body stained non factory colour.

The asking price was around £400 more than if it hadn’t been customised. I can’t deny it looked attractive and the neck and body were unquestionably the signature item but the seller had no information on who did the work or any record of the work actually done.

At the right price I would have bought it, but my right price was about 50% of the asking.

 

Rhetorical questions – is it stolen goods with identification removed? Is it a parts-bin special? Would any sane person ‘customise’ a signature model in such a fashion? If the latter would it not come with the original bits?

 

Interesting.

JerkMoans

I can think of only one reason to remove a serial number, and it ain’t good.

RaymondLin

If I smell the slightest hint of foul play, i would pass.

ICBM

Who cares?

It would only matter if it was of some great cultural or historical significance - like Jimi Hendrix’s Flying V, which was found in a similar state, and identified by the unique patterns in the pearl neck inlays compared to original photos.

Otherwise it’s just a vastly overpriced fucked up piece of junk, and possibly also stolen. Ignore it and move on...

fretfinder

JohnnyPlectrum said: It had been customised in the following manner;

No tags

No candy

Pickups changed

Control covers changed

Signature logo and serial numbers sanded from neck.

Body stained non factory colour.

I wouldn’t call no tags and no candy customising! 

And all those changes would hit the value of the guitar imho, so it should cost a lot less than if it hadn’t been ‘modded’.

crunchman

The only one of those changes that might possibly add a very small amount of value is the pickup change - if it was a very expensive set of boutique pickups.  Even then a £180 set of pickups would probably only add £30 to the value. 

All the other changes will devalue it - especially the sanded off serial number.  I wouldn't touch it with a barge pole.

guitars4you

I can cope with no tags and no case candy

I can cope with p/up changes - Will that have any impact on the value - Depends what came off and what is going on

Body stain will have a big impact, as per a refin - 30-50% as a potential devaluation, depending on how it looks and how well it is done

But taking away the serial number + signature logo and it will start to set off the alarm bells - Even if it is genuine and not nicked, any logic will say WHY !!!!!! - It is logical to assume it is stolen. but I know a guy who recently just removed the Hendrix logo of the rear of a Mex Strat, because he did not want it on there - I don't see his logic but I know it is not nicked

If you like the guitar, feel, tone, vibe etc then it is up to you but I'm think at least 50% de-value and maybe more

guitars4you

Just re-read your opening comment @JohnnyPlectrum ;

You say it is £400 more than a regular/clean example - I don't know what guitar it is, but would be an interesting conversation as to why anyone can justify £400 more for a guitar that has a host of serious issues that should be reducing it by at least 50% and probably more

ESBlonde

Stop salivating and go look at some decent guitars!

Fishboy7

I’m intrigued now – have you got a link to it?

JerkMoans

Further to my response above, I can 'get' removal of a logo: kid trying to 'Fenderize' a Squier, for example.  But, barring accident, the only reason to remove and identifying serial number is to conceal the guitar's identity...  Unless the player is working under cover, playing bar gigs behind enemy lines, it's either nicked or otherwise not what it purports to be.  Avoid.

ICBM

JerkMoans said:

Further to my response above, I can 'get' removal of a logo: kid trying to 'Fenderize' a Squier, for example.  But, barring accident, the only reason to remove and identifying serial number is to conceal the guitar's identity...  Unless the player is working under cover, playing bar gigs behind enemy lines, it's either nicked or otherwise not what it purports to be.  Avoid.

There are other reasons - mostly accidental, eg if someone wants to refinish a modern polyurethane-finished Fender neck to look like something more vintage, and the serial number is a decal under the finish, then removing the finish will also remove the serial number.

It will still be of questionable provenance though.

Funkfingers

Occasionally, user modifications transform a guitar into something far better. Even when this does happen, the monetary aspect is difficult to assess. 

The commonest folly is expecting to recoup the full MSRP for a set of posh aftermarket pickups. 

JohnnyPlectrum

Fishboy7 said:

I’m intrigued now – have you got a link to it?

I don't think a deal will happen so yeah.

https://reverb.com/uk/item/29453576-charvel-guthrie-govan-signature-model-custom-w-custom-hard-case

JerkMoans

ICBM said:

JerkMoans said:

Further to my response above, I can 'get' removal of a logo: kid trying to 'Fenderize' a Squier, for example.  But, barring accident, the only reason to remove and identifying serial number is to conceal the guitar's identity...  Unless the player is working under cover, playing bar gigs behind enemy lines, it's either nicked or otherwise not what it purports to be.  Avoid.

There are other reasons - mostly accidental, eg if someone wants to refinish a modern polyurethane-finished Fender neck to look like something more vintage, and the serial number is a decal under the finish, then removing the finish will also remove the serial number.

It will still be of questionable provenance though.

See "barring accident..." - having now seen the advertisement, the 'top Luther' (sic) responsible might have faced a somewhat grumpy customer after the fettling was done.

Then again, people do the weirdest shit to their guitars.  I tend to stick Hare Krishna stamps on the back of the headstocks of mine  

ICBM

JohnnyPlectrum said:

https://reverb.com/uk/item/29453576-charvel-guthrie-govan-signature-model-custom-w-custom-hard-case

Done by a top Luther...

Martin, or Idris?

Fishboy7

Not what I was expecting. 

 

It looks really good actually, but I agree the value should be lower than if unmodified.  

octatonic

That is just silly.

pintspiller

I accidentally sanded serial number off my 74 SG Special when I tried to refinish it years ago. I realised at the time that I'd never be able to sell it for a realistic price so had no remorse when I sold on the pickups and put a cheap P90 into the bridge.

John_A

Fishboy7 said:

Not what I was expecting. 

 

It looks really good actually, but I agree the value should be lower than if unmodified.  

I agree it shouldn't be more than an untouched one.  Although it does look nicer than any of the ones I've seen with original finish

TeleMaster

No tags and case candy aren't modifications. I don't care if it's there or not. Leads, straps included are meant to be used. There's way too emphasis on having all of this stuff for bog standard production model guitars.