NGD Takamine AN10

Smellyfingers

Continuing my expensive and somewhat idiotic quest for the 'one', I bought this 15 year old example, blind over ebay

It's proven to be a bit annoying, because the tone is as impressive as Gibson and Martin's I have had  costing 3 or 4 times more.

It's got a western red cedar top,, which seems particularly responsive to softer strumming. Unusually for a Tak it has no electronics. Nice and light and few clues as to it's age, other than the endearingly naff pink tuners.

I am not sure if anyone has an idea of what strings might be best for a Tak cedar top?

It's currently strung with Martin thin 
Here's a photo
https://i.imgur.com/FzFGqy3.jpeg

Mellish

Looks good mate.

How does it sound? What are the woods?  

Smellyfingers

It's got a solid cedar top, mahogany back and sides.

I would say it's sounds a bit softer or to use a cliche a bit 'warmer' than spruce tops.

Importantly for me, note distinction is very good, even on subtle or minor chord changes.

Mellish

Only one thing now: find the ideal strings  

tone1

Congratulations! I love my AN45 too…

https://i.imgur.com/lweTxDf.jpg

Smellyfingers

tone1 said:

Congratulations! I love m AN45 too…

https://i.imgur.com/lweTxDf.jpg

I love the rosette on that.

ICBM

I've always liked 80/20 bronze strings on cedar tops - I agree completely with your description of 'soft' compared to spruce, so strings with a brighter top-end seem to suit them better, phosphor bronze can be a bit muddy. I would probably stick with 12s for a dreadnought, although 11s aren't actually that much lighter and usually sound fine.

As usual I would give Newtone a try - Masterclass 80/20 bronze 12-52.

Soupman

@tone1 that AN45 looks to be in immaculate condition. How old is it ?

tone1

@Soupman 2003 

Mellish

@tone1 ; - that's a nice looking acoustic. Congratulations mate  

Tannin

Nice pick-up @Smellyfingers ;

 
I agree with ICBM on the benefits of brass on a cedar top and have often had 80/20s on my cedar-top Maton. They work well. Our two guitars are very similar on paper, however I'm guessing that a mahogany-backed Takamine might be a bit toppier than the Queensland Maple Maton and brass might be a bit too much of a good thing. Only one way to find out!

The following are the strings which I've liked best on the Maton. Like your Takamine it is a dreadnought; Queensland Maple is a bit more rounded than mahogany, a fuller sound, but broadly similar. I'm a fingerpicker using a mix of flesh and nails.

BRASS

* SIT Silencers (£7.50). Supposed to be semi-flat surfaced for noise-free fretting; in practice they play just like any normal string: they have a normal ring (not weird and compressed like D'Addario Flat Tops or Pyramid Hand-rubbed) but also a moderate amount of normal finger noise. In short, they play like a normal round-wound brass string, but sound a bit less strident. The sound is warm and medium-bright with a good, slightly slinky feel.

* Darco 80/20 (£6.75). (Martin MA140s are the exact same string in a different packet at a higher price.) Nasty fresh on, somewhere between shouty and shrill, but improve enormously as they age. After a week, much better balanced and they improve further with time. Excellent after two or three weeks and still good after about seven. (That is a long time for an 80/20.) 

* La Bella Golden Alloy (£8). Good strings with a sound and feel all their own. Not a lot of body to the sound, almost tinny fresh on, but they feel great, as supple and easy under the fingers as round cores. The tone soon settles down to something sweet and pleasing. Beware: they squeal like crazy: a 9 out of 10 on the squeak-o-meter. 

PHOSPHOR BRONZE

* GHS Americana (£9). Lovely, well-balanced straight-ahead strings. Start out a little thin but the longer they are on the better they get. Once played in (a week, say) they are full and rich but never cloying or muddy. Last really well, twice as long as a typical uncoated string.

* John Pearse Phosphor Bronze (£8.50) Not much to say about these, just an excellent string in all the normal ways. Good feel (stiffish but not overly so), great all-purpose tone, last well. 

Finally some more phosphor bronze strings that I know and love on other guitars and think would work well on the cedar Maton but haven't had the chance to try yet. 

* Galli LS. £7. Another great middle-of-the-road phosphor bronze string. Warm, bright, rich, well balanced, soft, smooth feel: all class.

* SIT Royal Bronze £8. Another favourite which does all the usual things to a higher-than-usual standard.

* DR Sunbeams £8. Gorgeous soft, responsive round-core feel; a lively and well-balanced sound. 

* Pyramid Western Folk (£10.50). Slightly fuller-bodied than the otherwise similar DR Sunbeams. 

Hold a gun to my head and tell me to put them in order and I might say Galli LS and GHS Americana, then get a bit stuck for a third choice. These are all good strings. It looks like a fine guitar and the reality is it will probably sound pretty good with any of them, or with any of several dozen others.

Dave_Mc

Lovely guitar @Smellyfingers . I agree about cedar, too- softer and more compressed. Haven't got as far as changing the strings on my new(ish) Dowina yet, that's some good info about brass strings, I'll keep that in mind @ICBM and @Tannin ;

tone1

@Smellyfingers does the lack of fretboard dots bother you? I’m considering having some fitted.

Tannin

I'm going to get into trouble for saying this, but wouldn't it be easier just to hold it properly?

tone1

Tannin said:

I'm going to get into trouble for saying this, but wouldn't it be easier just to hold it properly?

I wouldn’t want to break a habit of a lifetime  

Tannin

^ Fair enough!

artiebear

Tannin said:

I'm going to get into trouble for saying this, but wouldn't it be easier just to hold it properly?

LOL I did like that one !

Dave_Mc

Tannin said:

I'm going to get into trouble for saying this, but wouldn't it be easier just to hold it properly?

 

That would have used to annoy me too... I can usually get by with side dots these days though. Given the free choice I probably prefer dots, though. 

Smellyfingers

Many thanks for the appreciations and advice re strings.

I had read somewhere that because cedar was a softer wood using heavy gauge strings was unwise.

On that basis I made the boring choice and ordered D'addario 80/20 11.52 coated bronze.

Tannin

Cedar is softer than spruce and also has less strength for any given thickness. However it is also lighter, so it is normal to make a cedar guitar with a slightly thicker top of roughly equal strength and weight. I've had brass 13s on my cedar top without the slightest ill-effect on it. They sounded fantastic but I took them off because it took too much muscle to play and I am a lazy bugger.

A recommended technique for hand-made manufacture (with any timber) is to decide on a target strength and thin the top to that exact strength, thus achieving the lightest possible top commensurate with durability. (Obviously, this isn't the way big companies make guitars. Factories make them all the same regardless of individual variations in timber, which is why (counter-intuitively!) every factory guitar is different!) 

Tannin

PS: in another thread @Mellish recommends those very strings you choose (well, the same string in 12s). I plan to add them to my long, long list of strings to try next time I do an order.