New Beginner's YouTube Channel - Going from Dreadful to (hopefully) Decent

BillDL

Excellent points made there by @digitalkettle and yes, that's really what I was trying to say when I gave the proviso "This is going to vary depending on the chord changes".  I also fully agree with him when he says "don't overthink it".  You will pick up some useful little "tricks" to make chord transitions more seamless as time goes on and you are able to make the switches without thinking.  What I would say is that you are doing very well at carrying on strumming even when you fluff a chord change a bit.  There was only one part where I heard your strumming break as you struggled, but we've all been through that and it is not a criticism.  I quite like your relaxed but well presented videos.  Are you used to communicating with people in your normal job?

ShawnE

@digitalkettle Yes understood! I did assume leading with the index as being a good thing would only relate to certain chord changes.

I had a good dabble around this evening with finger independence stuff... while playing through a couple of new songs at the end of my practice it was clear that transitioning to the D chord (from just about every one of the other 6 I know) is the main thing I have to crack for now... in this case it's Em to D... I think it's because D is down at the edge of the fretboard. Gonna take some getting used to. It's funny because the D was the very first chord I learned but it's only now almost 2 months later that it's clearly obvious how much work I'll have to put into it compared to the others I know (well... so far anyway... till another set of changes poses problems & further chords are learned haha).

@BillDL I have been making a conscious effort to try to keep a rhythm & continue strumming through mess ups. Very tough to do! Especially with new stuff but I find it does generally get a bit easier once I get used to the song or exercise I'm practicing so will make sure it continues as best I can! And thanks a lot glad you enjoy the videos! I do a lot of organising of people with my work so I guess the communication with that sort of stuff helps... I'm usually on the other side of the camera (I'm a photographer) so still find it weird talking to a lens!

ShawnE

https://youtu.be/ATQQtktiSRA

Well.... I learned the C chord this week.

However, with that opening me up to an abundance of new songs I was immediately reminded that I have to work on continuing to polish up not only the chords I've previously learned but also the action of changing between them all - of course, I'm aware certain changes are more commonly used than others so it makes sense to at least prioritise those for now - namely the changes that specifically take place in the songs I'm practicing.

So, it took all of 10 seconds into a new song to discover that I'll be putting a ton of work into the changes between Em and D, Em and C, and C and D (just as a main focus - still doing all other standard practice stuff & whatnot) for the next week or two before I reassess. I don't expect to vastly improve these within a matter of weeks but I do want to feel more comfortable with them before introducing yet another chord (.....G!).

Thanks for watching!

BillDL

You're doing well and you are making some very definite and properly structured progress.  Well done.  It really won't be long before you have learned all the "open" or "cowboy" chords and I'm sure you will then be able to jump from one to the other quite fluently without looking.  Before you know it you will be able to form the chords with your fingers while holding some object other than a guitar and perhaps even in mid air.  When that muscle memory starts to become second nature you will really feel as though you have completed a very significant step.

I liked the little change in strumming pattern from 13:10 in the last song.  It's small things like that which make a song more interesting to play and to listen to.

You wondered whether to persevere playing the Em chord with your middle and ring finger, or whether to switch to using your first and middle fingers to try and execute the change to D more fluently.  I would suggest that in this instance you stick with the middle and ring fingers, and leave the index finger floating, for now.  The reason will become clearer when you come to learn the F chord and then start learning "barre chords" where the index finger is used.  It would actually be more useful to experiment with playing the E (major) chord with your middle finger, ring finger and pinky, and then lift the middle finger to create the Em chord.  Don't dwell on this though, or it could be offputting.  Just give it a try a few times to get a feel for this alternative fingering.  This suggestion will be made clearer in about a month at the pace you are going.

The G chord is one you will have some fun with.  The nice big "open" sound will immediately have you hearing a lot of songs.

I'm curious to know whether you are learning these chords as being "in the key of ...C, or D, or A etc".  For example the chords A, D and E are in the key of A.   When you learn the G chord, the chords G, C and D are in the key of G.  This is just curiosity.  The structure of your learning is probably placing the emphasis on geting you playing as many chords as possible and will THEN start grouping them into certain keys as you go.

digitalkettle

BillDL said:

I'm curious to know whether you are learning these chords as being "in the key of ...C, or D, or A etc".  For example the chords A, D and E are in the key of A.   When you learn the G chord, the chords G, C and D are in the key of G.  This is just curiosity.  The structure of your learning is probably placing the emphasis on geting you playing as many chords as possible and will THEN start grouping them into certain keys as you go.

I guess he's implicitly doing so because he's letting songs prescribe the chords (obviously that's not entirely precise). Or maybe he's looking for songs that suit the chosen chords...I dunno...what are you doing Shawn?!!

Full-assed cowboy G chord: 3-2-0-0-0-3
Cool G voicing: 3-2-0-0-3-3
Less mud in the bass cool G voicing*: 3-x-0-0-3-3 (let the 2nd finger mute the A string while it's fretting the low G)

* you'll only find two different notes in this voicing: G (root) and D (fifth)...so it's a G5...a 'power chord'.

digitalkettle

You're not getting the 'Come As You Are' riff right...check this:


Extra marks: like anything at this point, you can wring out lots of goodness from the simplest riff. Instead of playing everything with downstrokes, it might flow better with the picking pattern above (the squarish bracket is a downstroke, the arrow is an upstroke). Note that, fairly typically, the downstrokes happen on the beat...four to a bar (albeit with an imaginary one in the second bar)...this helps your timing (which is pretty good as it happens!).

Disclaimer: I have no idea how Kurt played it (he wasn't revered as a technical alternate picker )

BillDL

I think Shawn mentioned "Justin" with regard to the tutoring.  That would likely be Justin Sandercoe.  He generally teaches slightly simplified versions of songs and stresses that they aren't note for note copies.

digitalkettle

BillDL said:

I think Shawn mentioned "Justin" with regard to the tutoring.  That would likely be Justin Sandercoe.  He generally teaches slightly simplified versions of songs and stresses that they aren't note for note copies.

Hmmm [scrunched-up_face].

ShawnE

@BillDL ;@digitalkettle ;

To be honest I'm not sure haha! I don't recall the specific mention of keys in any of the lessons but I know that's all brought in later... you're right in that it is the Justin Sandercoe beginner course that I'm following... I'm still on grade one so it's all still very basic & super beginner-friendly (like the riffs being simplified, as you mentioned!)... there is a methodical structure in the order of how the chords are being taught.... and a basic intro to rhythm, strumming, tempo etc. is all introduced throughout this first grade as well.

First D & A were taught together in a lesson, then E came in another (so first chords taught in this key of A you also mention), then there was a focus on minor chords with Em & Am being taught in one lesson together, followed by Dm in another... now I've got C... next comes G... then that's the end of grade one. Throughout the lessons songs are suggested that use the specific chords that have most recently been taught but I can obviously go off & find my own one's as well.

Then in grade two the focus will be on the F chord & an introduction to scales, power chords & other stuff that's of course a step up from the basics (like palm muting, fingerstyle, alternate picking etc.)

Then there's grade 3 (the last of the beginner grades) but I haven't even looked at what those lessons involve yet! I suspect I'll be well into 2024 by the time I get anywhere near this.

ShawnE

https://youtu.be/_NQ04QlhWTg

This one isn't for the squeamish... if you don't like looking at calluses forming you may want to give this one a miss... if you're morbidly curious like I am then you may want to give it a watch... 

Short 6-7 minute documentary outlining the 54 days it took for my calluses to develop before settling down.

blobb

That F chord 'moment' is coming.....  wait for it .... 

digitalkettle

blobb said:

That F chord 'moment' is coming.....  wait for it .... 

Weird that (probably) the first bar chord you learn is the toughest

BillDL

If I don't play at all for a couple of weeks I get the same little dry tough peeling pads for a few days after I start again, and I do just as you have done i.e. emery board.

One thing you mentioned in your video is very true.  You will still be pressing down unneccesarily hard on the strings.  We have all done so during the learning stages and sometimes even after many years of playing we might find ourselves doing it after picking up a different guitar.  As you progress you will find yourself relaxing the death grip a bit.  One thing to watch out for, as you now move onto what will become barre chords, is a pain in the joint at the base of your left thumb.  You will naturally get some pain, but be aware of this and don't push on if it becomes a burning pain.  Take a break, warm your hand, move your fingers and thumb around gently opening and clenching, and rotate your thumb joint for a while before resuming.

ShawnE

@blobb ;;Haha! The F chord is still a little while away... I have G chord next week... then some consilidation of what I've learned so far.. F chord then follows that so maybe sometime late next month or in December... F chord gifted to me for Christmas, perhaps.

@BillDL Yes the death grip I hope will find its way to relax! I do of course find it way easier to switch when my hand is relaxed.. and during a particularly positive session where things are going well I am able to relax it way more. Sessions that are going less well - not so much! Everything is always easier said than done for some reason haha! Same with strumming... at times it feels like my hand is super relaxed & strumming away but I watch things back & it's like wow ok... still looks like a hammering piston despite not feeling that way hah!

ShawnE

10 weeks in... not too much change as I've mainly been going over the same things for the past 2/3 weeks... hopefully just some small improvements with bits & pieces.

The polishing of chord changes, technique, strumming, picking, rhythm etc. continues.. onwards & upwards with the G chord next.

Thanks for watching!

BillDL

I can see and hear that your strumming is now a lot more fluid and less mechanical, and your chord changes have also become more effortless.  If you think about 59 hours of practice in terms of working hours and days, you have been working at it for the equivalent of only 5 x 12 hour shifts, or a Mon - Fri then Mon and Tues of 8 hour shifts and a half day Wed.  That's not a whole lot of time when you think about it, but from a practical viewpoint it would obviously be impossible to sit down with a guitar and play continuously for 8 or 12 hours while learning new chords or techniques at the start of each working day or even thrown in after lunch each day.

You will soon be approaching the stage where a lot of learners give up, but you clearly have the resilience and strong desire to keep going, you are learning in a structured and progressive way (which makes a huge difference), and there is the additional aspect with you sharing your progress publicly that will get you over the hurdles.  A significant number of learners who are using books or watching random "How to play <song title>" videos will actually have given up before now because the tedium of repetition and sore fingers makes it hard to see an end goal.  Others will pack it in when they have learned all the "open" chords and then wonder "Where do I go now?  I want to play like Steve Vai / Tommy Emmanuel".  A good progressive learning package will keep you interested by giving you new things to learn before you reach that stage, but without throwing too many things at you in one go.

I noticed that you attempted a couple of "magical" bends with your ring finger while playing the Sunshine Of Your Love riff    You mentioned "vibrato".  There is a technique used in a lot of blues and rock and country guitar playing where the player will bend a string slightly for effect.  Not enough of a bend to take it up in pitch to the note that would sound if playing it normally one fret higher, but somewhere just less than that.  It's often used as a "passing note" just before playing another note, because by itself it might sound horrendously out of tune.  This is hard to execute on an acoustic guitar, but not impossible. There is nothing wrong with experimentation, but that kind of thing will come more naturally to you at a later stage. If you were to pull down slightly with your 1st finger on the 2nd last note of the repeating riff, you would get this effect.  Vibrato is where a fretted string is made to waver in pitch either by bending and releasing it while it's ringing or in the traditional classical style by rolling and wobbling your fretting finger to vary the pressure and tension on the string.  Vibrato can be slow or fast, or it can be "wide" or "narrow".  You will usually hear and see it being used while playing single string passages, and more often on an electric guitar than on an acoustic.

Keep at it.  You are doing really well.

ShawnE

@BillDL ;;;; It's funny you say that as I was thinking the exact same thing around the 40 hour mark... I was thinking that the first 40 hours practice was the equivalent of getting through the very first week of a highly skilled, intricate & complex job with zero experience at the start haha... you're right, no time at all, and certainly does put everything into perspective.

I can see why beginners either give up or get to a stage where they just think hey, I know a bunch of basic chords... this will do me now. Even if I just focused on getting to the point of proficiency with the 8 chords I now know that would obviously be enough to play through 1000's of tunes & have plenty of fun... but no, we march on!

I bet a lot of people also call it a day when it comes to learning more because of how much it can (temporarily, I hope!) set you back... every time I add a new chord (G this week) it feels like everything chord related takes a little step back in quality for the first week until I get that chord 2% more locked in 

Plus I've added a little 6:8 time signature strumming this week which is happily tripping me up... I've only been used to 4:4 up until now... so it's always being in the mindset of right.. something new... time to accept being totally crap again for a while...! 

BillDL

There's an advert on the TV at the moment for Currys where they boast about the 40 hours of product training each member of staff has.  If you actually think about the amount of technical knowledge needed to advise a customer about the differences between different TVs, washing machines, vacuum cleaners, etc, 40 hours really is just a smattering of knowledge.  It provides them with the basics and a framework to learn more as they go though, and they can always ask a more experienced person if they are out of their depth.

You have been building up that same framework to expand on and, although you never stop learning in any field, just around the corner you will be in the position to start taking a deeper dive into learning different techniques, understanding how chords all fit together into a key, and being able to hear when a chord needs to change to another to fit in with a melody or harmony.  In the near future you will be able to listen to a song, go up and down the low E and A strings until you find a note that underpins the key of the song, and then figure out what key it is in so you can start figuring out the chords that are most likely to be in that song.  From there you will most likely be learning barre chords and/or how to use a capo to play the chord shapes you already know in a different key.

I would think that within the next few lessons some very basic theory will be introduced, for example being able to walk up each string naming the notes that are being sounded.  Once you have that in your grasp a lot more avenues will open up for experimenting by yourself in between future lessons.

ShawnE

https://youtu.be/J6UBSnYjkgI

Shrews

"The starting point of all achievement is desire" - Napoleon Hill

Very true, but the key word there is 'achievement', because what is that for you?

For me (starting aged 52) it was just to be able to strum and singalong to my favourite songs on an acoustic and I have managed to do that. Not interested in playing in a band, not really interested in playing electric (although I was intrigued by it and it seemed a natural progression), not really interested in being technically competent (doing musical grades etc).

What I do know is that if I can do it, then so can most people. I would be confident now that with practice I could improve further if I so desired (although we will all have a limit). As a beginner you don't necessarily have that same confidence. It's a sort of negative myth you put in your head that you have to have natural musical ability. That's why the guitar ends up back in the cupboard. 

There are physical issues with me - my fingers just don't stretch. Maybe with exercises I could get this suppleness back but now aged 57 I doubt that will come easy, if at all. But ultimately the biggest thing is 'desire'. I don't have that desire to push on my guitar playing towards another goal.

Therefore, I think one thing I would say to anybody starting out is just to know what you want and make that your goal. And if the negative myth of 'you have to have some natural musical ability' enters your head (likely it will) then fight it and practice even more. Once you're comfortable with achieving your goal, just either stick to doing that or if you then want more then set yourself a second goal. 

When you're a kid, really you're just at a time when you should be trying 'everything' to see whether you like it and whether you have talent for it. If you like it, but don't have talent then you should keep doing that thing nevertheless. It's always good to do things you like.

Many of the greatest musicians ever have come from a background where they had bugger all in the lives. Maybe they were given an instrument by someone, or scrimped and saved pocket money because they wanted to be in a band. But having 'nothing' and then having an instrument put in your hand surely is a great motivator to get better. And you have the time too because you have nothing else. If the kid has a Playstation downstairs then likely there's a distraction there if he doesn't take to the instrument.

So I think if you do want to learn to play guitar you have got to focus on that and eliminate the distractions whilst doing so. The old adage: don't do it because it's easy but because it's hard (Kennedy?). And you're not going to have the achievement if you don't have the desire or the distractions removed.