Help with fx loop solo boost please !

riffpowers

I’m re-doing all of my guitar stuff and I’m finally looking at using the fx loop on my jcm800 studio to get a solo boost. 

I’ve got myself a boss ge7 eq, is this a good pedal to use for this ??
I was going to get a couple of 6m guitar leads so I can have the eq on my board . Is this ok ? I’d wondered if there was an issue with using cable lengths like this ?? I was also looking at using a delay for solos so I don’t know if this is better in the loop or in front. 
I’m open to using a different method for this solo boost if there’s a better way. 

ecc83

I shall keep a keen eye on the contributions to this question.

Dave.

DartmoorHedgehog

I use a GE7 as a boost, now in front of the amp because my current amp has no loop, but I used to run it in the loop of a Blackstar HT-20 and it worked really well so I don't see why it shouldn't work with the Marshall.  My cables were about 15' I think, so not far off your 6m.  I suppose it may depend a bit on how the loop in the amp is buffered, but the GE7 has a buffer so that should help with long cables anyway.

The only bad thing I would say about the GE7 is they're quite prone to being noisy (loads of hiss, getting worse the further the sliders are away from centre). I modded mine with better op amps and caps and it made a huge difference.

EDIT: Probably obvious, but just in case... a boost in the loop will be mostly a volume boost (assuming the amp isn't running totally flat-out), whereas a boost in front of the amp will give a gain boost as well (and not so much volume if the preamp is already distorted). I don't run anywhere near as much boost with the GE7 in front as I used to when it was in the loop and acting purely as a volume boost - too much boost now and it just goes to mush and disappears in the mix (and my normal sound isn't really that gainy).

ecc83

Ah! The HT 20, this combo was sold with the 'delightful' Rocket 50, possibly THE most universally hated guitar speaker of all time?

I was told by the guy who had the job of making it all work that the amplifier was 'voiced' to defeat some of the innate grottiness of the speaker. The upshot of that is that 20, played through almost and other speaker sounds a bit "flat". This cane be corrected to some extent by a 4-6dB boost in the 2-3kHz region.

Other matters: "Twenty watts" is not a lot and just boosting the signal voltage in the FX loop will NOT turn the amp into a 50W fire breathing monster.

Dave.

DartmoorHedgehog

ecc83 said:

Ah! The HT 20, this combo was sold with the 'delightful' Rocket 50, possibly THE most universally hated guitar speaker of all time?

.

No mine was a head into a 2x12 with V30s

HAL9000

I use an MXR 6 band EQ as a solo boost but use it in front of the amp rather than in the FX loop. Does a good job of giving a Claptonesque mid boost and pushing the amp into mild breakup. I don’t use anything like 2 x 6m of cable though. 

ICBM

If both the amp FX send and the pedal are properly buffered then cable length shouldn’t be an issue. The Boss GE-7 is - I don’t have a schematic for the amp, but I think it’s unlikely not to be, I’ve had a look inside the SV20 and there’s an IC where you would expect the loop buffer to be.

ecc83

DartmoorHedgehog said:

ecc83 said:

Ah! The HT 20, this combo was sold with the 'delightful' Rocket 50, possibly THE most universally hated guitar speaker of all time?

.

No mine was a head into a 2x12 with V30s

Yes, but AFAIK the voicing was the same.

Dave.

Danny1969

You will get a little bit of noise even with a buffered loop, with a well shielded cable it will be minimal though. I've always used 2 jacks to 1 x XRL  and wired pin 1 ground, pin 2 send and pin 3 return. I do this because I can then use one single mic lead rather than 2 instrument cables and if I'm on a really big stage I can easily extend the mic cable with another one. 

The original GE7 is a noisy thing but reissue isn't as bad. You can however get a totally silent boost in the loop just by installing 2 pots in a box with a footswitch that selects one or the other pot in the path. Turn one down a bit, that's your normal volume and crank the other pot further up, that's your lead volume. I built one out of a can of tuna once when I had to do a gig with no pedal board. 

Traditionally a lot of people like the delay in the loop so the amps dirt hits it before. However some of the coolest sounds are when the delays first and the dirt is second. So on my pedal board I have one overdrive before the delay and one after. 

p90fool

If it's noisy when boosted, use the pedal to cut the volume for rhythm. 

Set the amp for your lead tone with the EQ pedal off, then use the pedal for a quieter rhythm tone, possibly with a bit of mid cut as well. 

Barney

I use a boss g7 EQ in the loop and also boss dd3 and it works great I have them both together with them solid connector jacks so i habe the option of stepping on them both together or individually ...it's a really sime setup that works great 

fastonebaz

For a solo boost I use a TC electronic spark mini in the fx loop using the 4CM for cables with the Boss NS2, and its perfect.  And silent too when not playing, no hissing or hum despite high gain and volume.   

My mini spark is set just below 9pm (maybe 23%) and its just ideal for a great solo boost.

Stratavarious

The DSL40CR has two master volumes for solos and the crunch channels is bang on JCM800 territory… how much versatility are you looking for?   For use with a band?  Delay in loop usually for me.

Jonathangus

I use a GE-7 in the loop of my (modded) 2204 and it works great.  Slight cut in the bass and treble and boost the level.  Oh, and an SD-1 up front, of course.

Barney said:

I use a boss g7 EQ in the loop and also boss dd3 and it works great I have them both together with them solid connector jacks so i have the option of stepping on them both together or individually ...it's a really simple setup that works great 

These things?



Yeah, they're great - for putting strain on the jack sockets and eventually breaking them.  A standard patch cable with some give in it is much better.

fretmeister

Barney said:

I use a boss g7 EQ in the loop and also boss dd3 and it works great I have them both together with them solid connector jacks so i habe the option of stepping on them both together or individually ...it's a really sime setup that works great 

Do not use those solid connectors!

They will ruin your pedals.

fretmeister

I've always either used an EQ pedal or a DOD BiFet preamp in the loop for a volume boost.

Either is good.

HAL9000 said:

I use an MXR 6 band EQ as a solo boost but use it in front of the amp rather than in the FX loop. Does a good job of giving a Claptonesque mid boost and pushing the amp into mild breakup. I don’t use anything like 2 x 6m of cable though. 

That doesn't work if the preamp is already saturated though.

Depends whether he just wants a volume boost or to change the tone.

ecc83

Of course, the idea of a "solo boost" is a new one and not musical valid? Back in the day, the clarinet or D bass solo was effected by the rest of the band shutting TFup! With maybe the drummer keeping time with a gentle 'tish' on the snare or hat with brushes*

*These will be unknown items to the 'rock drummer' but they can Google!

Dave.

fretmeister

ecc83 said:

Of course, the idea of a "solo boost" is a new one and not musical valid? Back in the day, the clarinet or D bass solo was effected by the rest of the band shutting TFup! With maybe the drummer keeping time with a gentle 'tish' on the snare or hat with brushes*

*These will be unknown items to the 'rock drummer' but they can Google!

Dave.

I've got over a decade of experience playing in jazz outfits ranging from duos to 25 piece.

It's amazing that they can all knock the volume down enough to let a single clarinet be heard!  

But that's jazz. It's not rock n roll!

p90fool

ecc83 said:

Of course, the idea of a "solo boost" is a new one and not musical valid? Back in the day, the clarinet or D bass solo was effected by the rest of the band shutting TFup! With maybe the drummer keeping time with a gentle 'tish' on the snare or hat with brushes*

*These will be unknown items to the 'rock drummer' but they can Google!

Dave.

That's all very true and fairly easy when everyone is playing acoustic instruments, but most modern bands are trying to replicate live a studio situation where the solo is pasted on top of a band mix in exactly the same way as the vocal is. 

Barney

fretmeister said:

Barney said:

I use a boss g7 EQ in the loop and also boss dd3 and it works great I have them both together with them solid connector jacks so i habe the option of stepping on them both together or individually ...it's a really sime setup that works great 

Do not use those solid connectors!

They will ruin your pedals.

Really...I didn't realise that ....they are level and both boss pedals on a board ...it just makes it handy with being close together but I'm going look at it again now 

ICBM

Barney said:

Really...I didn't realise that ....they are level and both boss pedals on a board ...it just makes it handy with being close together but I'm going look at it again now 

It’s because the sides of the pedals are not truly vertical, due to the diecastings having a ‘release angle’ - otherwise they couldn’t be got out of the die. Using those straight couplers strains the jacks.

Pedals where the jacks are mounted on the PCB are actually safer, because the jacks are then truly horizontal.