Trading your expensive new guitars for a single vintage guitar

ryanverbena

I know the general consensus being that older guitars definitely does not mean better. And in some cases this can be quite the contrary. 

But I've been offered a 58 LP Jnr refin for my CS 52' Tele and my CS VOS 61' SG, both of which are for sale. 

I've never actually played a vintage guitar and obviously would want to have a good play of it first. I think, for that fact, I'm more curious about this trade than I otherwise would have been. 

Knowing full well that there will be a range of different opinions on this, I was just wonder what peoples intuitions are on such a deal?

Here is a link to the guitar:

https://www.gumtree.com/p/guitar-instrument/vintage-1958-gibson-les-paul-junior-tv-/1475433799

digitalkettle

I think you'd want it looking over by an expert so you know exactly what you're getting.

chris78

You want to trade 2 custom shop guitars for a single pickup student guitar because it’s old?
Youve got to be mad (maybe with the caveat that if you’ve played it and it’s a genuine stunner there’s slightly more sense)

ICBM

(edit - updated due to serious doubts about the authenticity.)

If your guitars are for sale anyway you’re not losing anything, and a Junior (edit - not this one) will almost certainly not go down in value or be difficult to sell if you don’t like it. It may not be as good a guitar or as versatile as the two you have, but that means nothing in the market.

Obviously that depends on it being genuine - looking on a bigger screen, and with what @jumping@shadows said, I’m not sure it is. Not anywhere near enough to swap two £3K guitars for it, at the least.

Offset

Horses for courses.  I have a small collection of guitars I've acquired and traded over the years and for me, they cover all bases.  Different is good, and when my interest is waning with one I'll transfer my attentions to another for a period of time, knowing I'll go back to the former.  With one possible exception, I wouldn't want to be without any of them and I most definitely wouldn't trade a bunch of them for one vintage instrument.

I should show my hand here and say I'm not especially interested in vintage guitars - that isn't to say I wouldn't buy one but I  wouldn't do so at the expense of my other guitars.

In the course of writing this I'm acknowledging to myself I'm pretty happy with what I have, but sadly the GAS is still ever-present :-)

Fingers657

I’ve just mailed the pictures to an expert friend of mine to have a look at.
Ill post what he thinks when he replies.

Fiddlesticks_

Personally, I would not make that particular trade. It may well be a nice guitar, but at the end of the day it’s just an LP Junior that’s very expensive because it’s old.
But it’s all a personal choice, you might really like LP Juniors and want a 50s one and that’s your prerogative.

DrCornelius

If that Lp junior has that certain something that makes you want to pick it up and play it more than the he other two then go for it . I was about to say they aren’t making any more vintage guitars but then realised someone probably is somewhere :-)

ICBM

DrCornelius said:

If that Lp junior has that certain something that makes you want to pick it up and play it more than the he other two then go for it . I was about to say they aren’t making any more vintage guitars but then realised someone probably is somewhere :-)

They are, and Juniors are becoming expensive enough to be worth faking now, which they weren’t in the past.

jumping@shadows

Very fishy guitar imho- headstock shape is off as is the neck/headstock transition on the back, plus the control cavity is wrong. 

elstoof

Why do the peg strips look so off centre, the left side is right on the edge

digitalkettle

jumping@shadows said:

Very fishy guitar imho- headstock shape is off as is the neck/headstock transition on the back, plus the control cavity is wrong. 

That one caught my eye...there seems to be all kinds of wonk going on!

Iamnobody

digitalkettle said:

I think you'd want it looking over by an expert so you know exactly what you're getting.

Yep. My concern is I wouldn’t know how to navigate my way round a vintage guitar - particularly one with a refin. 

The only vintage guitar I own I bought as a player grade and did as much research as I could beforehand. However it was relatively cheap and therefore the risk was low. 

guitars4you

Buyer beware needs to always come into play with an old guitar - When the likes of @jumping@shadows is expressing doubt then you need to be careful

I have nothing whatsoever against a player grade non original old guitar - Often they can end up being a better player than an original example - But the most important aspect is that you need to play it and enjoy the experience that it offers - If it doesn't feel/play/sound right then it is not for you

Your 2 guitars probably have a used value pushing 6K - Don't know what your thought process is, if yous ell them - Are you buying another guitar - Need the cash for other bills etc - Some players are turned on by such old guitars, but old doesn't always mean good and often they are not good at all

Tree carefully - But if it gives you some wow factor as/when you play it then that is good 

OilCityPickups

If you look at the front of the headstock pic you can clearly see the line where the left hand 'wing' was glued onto the neck block to allow for the sculpting of the headstock. On the right I can't see that ... and I wouldn't mind betting that that narrow 'wing' split off and was destroyed or lost  ... and the headstock was reshaped to make it look a bit more even ... this would explain the odd gap at the side of the tuner. 
My worry would be - did a headstock break cause the loss of wood on that side ... and what is under that finish in the critical area?

Fingers657

Here's what my friend said about it.

Looks pretty authentic to me, although the logo seems a bit blocky, but they were screen printing them, so that might explain it.

They moved to double cuts part way through 1958 then onto 1960 - so you see more double cuts in TV yellow.

Cheap for what it is (assuming it is what it's claimed to be) but still a lot of coin to drop on a guitar without doing a lot of research on the looks and specs of other 1958 Juniors though.

At least he's done a black light test to show there's no breaks.

rossi

I can remember playing vintage guitars when they new shiny and a bit pricey .Some were good some a bit iffy  and one was dreadful though now much collected .So it just depends whether you buy a good ,bad or ugly very old guitar.

stickyfiddle

Personally I can't imagine ever switching from an SG and Tele to a Jr because those are my favourite solidbodies. But if it plays well and you're interested in a Jr then I'd do it. 

elstoof

Fingers657 said:

Here's what my friend said about it.

Looks pretty authentic to me, although the logo seems a bit blocky, but they were screen printing them, so that might explain it.

They moved to double cuts part way through 1958 then onto 1960 - so you see more double cuts in TV yellow.

Cheap for what it is (assuming it is what it's claimed to be) but still a lot of coin to drop on a guitar without doing a lot of research on the looks and specs of other 1958 Juniors though.

At least he's done a black light test to show there's no breaks.

It’s a refin, could’ve been any colour originally and the logo might not be original. New paint will hide any repairs under a black light also. 

Best case scenario with this one imo, whoever did the refin stripped the paint off with a belt sander and took a load of wood with it

jumping@shadows

Fingers657 said:

Here's what my friend said about it.

Looks pretty authentic to me, although the logo seems a bit blocky, but they were screen printing them, so that might explain it.

They moved to double cuts part way through 1958 then onto 1960 - so you see more double cuts in TV yellow.

Cheap for what it is (assuming it is what it's claimed to be) but still a lot of coin to drop on a guitar without doing a lot of research on the looks and specs of other 1958 Juniors though.

At least he's done a black light test to show there's no breaks.

Not to be rude, but it’s a refin (a bad one at that), and a black light would show nothing, plus it’s a solid colour which would mask any wood work.

Plus the logo and Les Paul silkscreen are non original, so again don’t indicate much.

The critical detail is the flattened back of the headstock/neck transition, and that completely incorrect wire channel leading from the control cavity to the pickup route.

I buy and work on guitars exactly like this day in day out, and I wouldn’t touch this one. 

I’ll post some pics of an original ‘54 Jnr I have here and I’m sure we can spot more issues. 

Danielsguitars

I thought that wiring channel is wrong too, I'd be very cautious and would probably pass too, the pickup is in the earlier position closer to the tailpiece.

I'd want to see the pictures before the refinish and I want to know who did it.