Repairing stripped screw holes with solder?

Dave_Mc

Hi everyone,

So I'm an idiot (this won't be news to anyone) and seem to have stripped the P90 Dogear screw/mounting holes in the body of my Harley Benton SG Jr. I was looking up online about what I should do, and I came across this article here: https://www.guitarworld.com/lessons/guitar-911-how-repair-worn-out-screw-holes-your-guitar

It suggests using solder. That sounds an awful lot handier than faffing around with wood glue and cocktail sticks (it's also less for me to mess up, which is a genuine concern and definite possibility), but does it work?

Also, the article says "solder is essentially lead", which presumably isn't, in the strictest sense of the word, remotely true when you consider that I have lead-free solder. It is decent (I think!) silver lead-free solder, though, around 4% silver IIRC. Will it still work with silver lead-free solder? (Also am I right in thinking that you don't even need to melt the solder, just bung it in there unmelted? Cut to the correct length, of course.)

Thanks for your help,
Dave

BillDL

"Cut a piece of solder to length (you can cut more than one piece, if necessary) and place it in the worn-out hole. Then put your screw in. The solder expands around the screw, filling the gap between the screw and the walls of the hole, making for a nice, firm, quick and easy installation".

It doesn't really "expand" though, does it?  Probably just a poor choice of words rather than a fundamental misunderstanding.  The soft metal deforms and squeezes into the space between the threads of the screw and the wood.  I would have to try this myself before I could make a judgement on the effectiveness of a short length of solder wire and more traditional methods like cocktail sticks/toothpicks, matchsticks, or sawdust and wood glue.  I've used the tapering tail of a cable tie for smaller holes and it works well as the screw's thread doesn't cut all the way through the plastic but makes a thread in it and pushes it in tight against the wall of the hole at one side.  I would have thought that a screw's threads would cut through the fairly soft solder wire.

TTony

Solder isn't the first material I'd think of using!

It's not really much "faff" to break a cocktail stick into a few pieces of right length, dip each into some wood glue, and stick into the hole.  Wait an hour for glue to set, trim off any sticky-outy ends, and screw the screw back into place ...

Or get a small tub/tube of wood filler.

prowla

I think that solder would be a great way to do the job badly.

Cocktail sticks (harder) or matchsticks (softer) are the easy way to plug stripped wood.

ICBM

If that’s not an April 1st recommendation…

Completely stupid. The best way is wood glue and a similar type of wood - matchsticks for softer woods, toothpicks for harder ones, or small splinters of the exact wood type if you have it.

Also, the best way is to put the screw back in with the glue still wet, as that compresses the wood fibres and glue to make a very strong thread when it sets. You can still get the screw out because wood glue doesn’t bond to metal.

Roland

I’ve heard of “repairing” stripped threads on pickup lugs with solder, but I wouldn’t use it on wood. As @TTony says, there are better ways.

mrkb

I think you posted this a few hours too early

Funkfingers

TTony said:

Solder isn't the first material I'd think of using.

How about vinegar and brown paper?



Posted after midday.

Dave_Mc

Sorry guys, I meant to check in yesterday but I had a bad migraine and wasn't fit

That sounds pretty unanimous, thanks everyone- wisdoms and LOLs all round as appropriate

Not an April Fool- I didn't even think of the date when I posted it, and the date on the article is October so I'm guessing it wasn't one either. Is it just me or is it a bit "off" that a "proper" guitar magazine can post an article with such dodgy advice? That's what made me wonder if it was legit- the fact it was on a "proper" guitar magazine website. (Well, that and that it seemed very easy- I thought it might be too good to be true!)

ICBM said:

If that’s not an April 1st recommendation…

Completely stupid. The best way is wood glue and a similar type of wood - matchsticks for softer woods, toothpicks for harder ones, or small splinters of the exact wood type if you have it.

Also, the best way is to put the screw back in with the glue still wet, as that compresses the wood fibres and glue to make a very strong thread when it sets. You can still get the screw out because wood glue doesn’t bond to metal.

It's specced as "meranti", which I'm guessing is relatively soft- at least judging by how easily I stripped the screws! (I only removed them and refitted them to fit a shim for the P90!) Also the wood database seems to suggest it's relatively soft too. I'm guessing it's a cheaper substitute for mahogany.

I don't have any wood glue so I'll have to buy some- is there any recommended type or brand? I'm guessing wood glue and matchsticks/cocktail sticks are handier than wood filler?

ICBM

Dave_Mc said:

I don't have any wood glue so I'll have to buy some- is there any recommended type or brand? I'm guessing wood glue and matchsticks/cocktail sticks are handier than wood filler?

Standard white PVA (Evostik Resin W or similar) is fine for anything other than neck screw holes, and probably even then. I tend to use Titebond but just because I have it to hand.

It's not just the easiest and handiest method, it's the best - much stronger than filler, and actually stronger than the 'proper' method of dowelling, unless you use side-cut hardwood plugs. The key is to pack the hole, then put the screw back with the glue wet and not wait for it to dry, so the wood fibres are compressed around the remains of the damaged thread and glued into place.

Funkfingers

Given the unceasing comments linking PRS Guitars with dentistry, it must be worth asking whether anyone has tried plugging stripped screw holes in wood using amalgam. 

Dave_Mc

ICBM said:

Dave_Mc said:

I don't have any wood glue so I'll have to buy some- is there any recommended type or brand? I'm guessing wood glue and matchsticks/cocktail sticks are handier than wood filler?

Standard white PVA (Evostik Resin W or similar) is fine for anything other than neck screw holes, and probably even then. I tend to use Titebond but just because I have it to hand.

It's not just the easiest and handiest method, it's the best - much stronger than filler, and actually stronger than the 'proper' method of dowelling, unless you use side-cut hardwood plugs. The key is to pack the hole, then put the screw back with the glue wet and not wait for it to dry, so the wood fibres are compressed around the remains of the damaged thread and glued into place.

Brilliant, thanks John, that's good news that it's actually the best way to do it!

Just to check, this is the right stuff here? EVO-STIK Exterior Wood Glue - D3, Weatherproof, Extra Strong, Fast Setting, Suitable For All Wood Types, Dries Clear, 250ml : Amazon.co.uk: DIY & Tools

EDIT: Or do I need the interior stuff? EVO-STIK Wood Glue - Interior, Extra Strong, Fast Setting, Suitable for All Wood Types, Dries Clear, 500ml : Amazon.co.uk: DIY & Tools

Kurtis

Personally I'd let the glue harden before re-drilling. 

Dave_Mc

Kurtis said:

Personally I'd let the glue harden before re-drilling. 

I wasn't planning on doing any drilling- I don't even have a drill! I was under the impression that you could just screw the screw back in again, but maybe I was wrong about that?

ICBM

Dave_Mc said:

EDIT: Or do I need the interior stuff? EVO-STIK Wood Glue - Interior, Extra Strong, Fast Setting, Suitable for All Wood Types, Dries Clear, 500ml : Amazon.co.uk: DIY & Tools

Interior is fine unless you plan on using the guitar under water .

Kurtis said:

Personally I'd let the glue harden before re-drilling. 

Don't do either. The best way is to pack the hole tightly with wood (matchstick, toothpick, other) and glue, break off any excess wood and clean up the glue, then put the screw straight in with the glue wet and no drilling. This is important - the idea is to compress the new wood fibres against the remains of the old thread, just as if you were clamping a glued joint, then when the glue sets you will have made a very strong new thread in the wood.

I've repaired literally hundreds of stripped holes like this, from pickguard screws right up to Fender neck screws, and it's actually the strongest method (other than gluing in a side-cut hardwood plug which is effectively new wood). I tested the different dowelling and/or drilling methods to destruction using a scrap neck once, and the wet-glue/no-drill method was stronger than any of them. Very nicely, it's also the quickest and easiest.

steamabacus

Dave_Mc said:

Kurtis said:

Personally I'd let the glue harden before re-drilling. 

I wasn't planning on doing any drilling- I don't even have a drill! I was under the impression that you could just screw the screw back in again, but maybe I was wrong about that?

No, that's right. Just cut the toothpicks flush and screw back in.

Kurtis

ICBM said:

Dave_Mc said:

EDIT: Or do I need the interior stuff? EVO-STIK Wood Glue - Interior, Extra Strong, Fast Setting, Suitable for All Wood Types, Dries Clear, 500ml : Amazon.co.uk: DIY & Tools

Interior is fine unless you plan on using the guitar under water .

Kurtis said:

Personally I'd let the glue harden before re-drilling. 

Don't do either. The best way is to pack the hole tightly with wood (matchstick, toothpick, other) and glue, break off any excess wood and clean up the glue, then put the screw straight in with the glue wet and no drilling. This is important - the idea is to compress the new wood fibres against the remains of the old thread, just as if you were clamping a glued joint, then when the glue sets you will have made a very strong new thread in the wood.

I've repaired literally hundreds of stripped holes like this, from pickguard screws right up to Fender neck screws, and it's actually the strongest method (other than gluing in a side-cut hardwood plug which is effectively new wood). I tested the different dowelling and/or drilling methods to destruction using a scrap neck once, and the wet-glue/no-drill method was stronger than any of them. Very nicely, it's also the quickest and easiest.

Fair enough, never seen it done that way, but normally the glue will soak into the wood fibre and be stronger than wood.. Then when you put the screw into the new hole it will tighten further. It would rip the wood around it before anything else. 
Pretty standard stuff. 

Strumit

A mixture of PVA and fine sawdust can repair/fix/fill most hole damage in wood.  It can be mixed to a paste at whatever consistency you need.  Allow to fully dry/cure and the job is good.  In glue and dust, we place our trust!  Wipe clean with a damp cloth!

Dave_Mc

ICBM said:

Dave_Mc said:

EDIT: Or do I need the interior stuff? EVO-STIK Wood Glue - Interior, Extra Strong, Fast Setting, Suitable for All Wood Types, Dries Clear, 500ml : Amazon.co.uk: DIY & Tools

Interior is fine unless you plan on using the guitar under water .

LOL I am in Northern Ireland... 

ICBM said:

Kurtis said:

Personally I'd let the glue harden before re-drilling. 

Don't do either. The best way is to pack the hole tightly with wood (matchstick, toothpick, other) and glue, break off any excess wood and clean up the glue, then put the screw straight in with the glue wet and no drilling. This is important - the idea is to compress the new wood fibres against the remains of the old thread, just as if you were clamping a glued joint, then when the glue sets you will have made a very strong new thread in the wood.

I've repaired literally hundreds of stripped holes like this, from pickguard screws right up to Fender neck screws, and it's actually the strongest method (other than gluing in a side-cut hardwood plug which is effectively new wood). I tested the different dowelling and/or drilling methods to destruction using a scrap neck once, and the wet-glue/no-drill method was stronger than any of them. Very nicely, it's also the quickest and easiest.

Thanks for the detailed description of how to do it

And yeah the best way which is also the quickest and easiest is obviously sort of the holy grail...

I've ordered the glue, I guess it'll be a few days until it gets here.

(Also thanks to everyone else for the input, wisdoms and wows all round again )

WezV

Meranti varies a lot.   Dark Red Meranti is pretty nice for guitars.  Some of the others do get a bit too soft.   None of it holds a screw brilliantly 

Dave_Mc

WezV said:

Meranti varies a lot.   Dark Red Meranti is pretty nice for guitars.  Some of the others do get a bit too soft.   None of it holds a screw brilliantly 

Thanks Wez I was thinking it seemed a bit soft- I can't rule out having done something silly (most likely explanation being that the existing screws were a bit short, especially with the shim I was adding, and that impeded my ability to put them back exactly in the existing holes!), but it did seem like they stripped really, really easily, even for someone as DIY-challenged as I am!

I'm actually not 100% convinced it wasn't- at least a bit- like that before I messed with it. I think I mentioned before elsewhere when I got it, but the pickup was a little microphonic at high gain- which (I think!) might possibly be caused by its not being held in place securely enough if the screws were already not holding terribly well. (Of course the microphonics could well have other explanations, too. Even just that I was too close and/or using too much gain!)

EDIT: It definitely sounds fine- the wood I mean. There's nothing wrong with it in that respect, and it's a really nice weight too- though I seem to recall someone else also getting an SG Jr around the time I got mine in that big Harley Benton sale getting one that was fairly heavy!

EDIT #2: I just noticed your thread about your metal top guitar build (it goes without saying, but it looks awesome!), and I noticed you mentioned DRM and its being a bit "zingy" with the aluminium bridge- I changed the bridge an (I think!) alumium Wilkinson wraparound on my Harley Benton, largely because the stock bridge was a bit sharp on the wrist, and while I thought there was a pretty decent improvement in tone, it's definitely a bit zingier-sounding, as you said, in the top end!