Bridge pickup grounding on Tele style guitar

Yorkie

Hi folks, 

I have taken my tele style build apart so I can address a number of shortcomings that have become apparent during my last recording session. 

I have introduced copper foil shielding and now all three cavities are connected and grounded. The one thing that I haven’t decided on yet is what to do about the bridge pickup’s black ground cable. The pickup has a bottom plate and is already grounded via stable contact between bridge plate and cavity shielding. 

I guess my options are 

a) solder that ground cable to a pot case or even the copper foil — but would that create a ground loop? 

b) duct-tape the cable and leave it there in case one day I change the bridge pickup. 

c) snip snip and get rid of the black cable. 

Opinions?

Cheers, 
Jon

Corvus

I like to add a bridge earth, solder it to a pot and you've got a good solid connection. Ground loops aren't a thing in passive guitars far as I can see. Despite a certain article that seems to have made talk of it a thing.

ICBM

Connect it to the volume pot casing.

You can’t create a ground loop in a guitar, that’s not how they occur.

If you are still concerned about it, disconnect the pickup baseplate from the coil. You always want the coil ground connected to the volume pot casing by the shortest path and the fewest potential failure points, as it’s the critical one for the signal. The rest is all just for shielding.

Funkfingers

What selector switch will you be using? CRL 3-way, Schaller Megaswitch 5-way or Freeway 3B3 6-way?

For the Schaller Megaswitch M, circuit diagram SS3, it is necessary to separate the bridge pickup's black output conductor from the copper plate ground. (Snip and bend the jumper connection at the plate end.) 

OilCityPickups

You may Find ... as with my Tele pickups and all Fender vintage ones - that the black hookup cable continues through the eyelet and is soldered to the baseplate thus connecting it to the ground side of the circuit ... no need for any other connection in that case. 
And as @ICBM says ... ground loops in guitars are a phallus see?   

Yorkie

Corvus said:

I like to add a bridge earth, solder it to a pot and you've got a good solid connection. Ground loops aren't a thing in passive guitars far as I can see. Despite a certain article that seems to have made talk of it a thing.

Thanks. I've got a very basic understanding of electronics; the suggestion that a ground loop may be created by joining the backs of two pots in a tele seemed off, hence my question. 

Yorkie

ICBM said:

You always want the coil ground connected to the volume pot casing by the shortest path and the fewest potential failure points, as it’s the critical one for the signal.

This makes the most sense to me, otherwise I might start worrying about the impact on tone of the different copper foils!  

Yorkie

Funkfingers said:

For the Schaller Megaswitch M, circuit diagram SS3, it is necessary to separate the bridge pickup's black output conductor from the copper plate ground. (Snip and bend the jumper connection at the plate end.) 

A 5-way oak grisby I think. The typical one you find in strats. 

But I think I'll snip the jumper to let the pickup ground get to ground faster. Then the shielding can all go together at their own pace. 

ICBM

Yorkie said:

I've got a very basic understanding of electronics; the suggestion that a ground loop may be created by joining the backs of two pots in a tele seemed off, hence my question. 

A ground loop is created when there are two ground paths of differing lengths and resistances from the input of an amplifier to earth, ie what often happens when you connect two amps in a stereo rig, or a mains-powered effect unit to an amp (if it’s not correctly designed) - this allows a “signal” voltage to be developed from the difference between the two picking up mains hum, which is then amplified.

There is only one ground connection from the guitar to the amp input so a ground loop cannot occur, no matter how many different ground points there are in the guitar.

Yorkie

OilCityPickups said:

And as @ICBM says ... ground loops in guitars are a phallus see?   

The internet is full of phalluses. That's why ChatGPT tells porkies sometimes. 

OilCityPickups

Yorkie said:

OilCityPickups said:

And as @ICBM says ... ground loops in guitars are a phallus see?   

The internet is full of phalluses. That's why ChatGPT tells porkies sometimes. 

Many YouTube 'experts' are in fact giant phalluses :-)

Yorkie

Ok, jumpers gone on both pickups, all shielded, black cables going to a single connection to the back of a pot, a push-pull inverting neck phase, polished frets… sounds and plays killer now. 

Thank you, everyone. 

Dave_Mc

^ That looks awesome! It even matches the seat!

ICBM

You probably didn’t need to take the jumper off the neck pickup, but the side effect is that it might sound better - the cover dulls the tone slightly if electrically connected.

Yorkie

ICBM said:

You probably didn’t need to take the jumper off the neck pickup, but the side effect is that it might sound better - the cover dulls the tone slightly if electrically connected.

I think I did, as I wanted to be able to invert the phase, so I ‘sent’ the cover to ground. It does sound incredible now. 

Yorkie

Dave_Mc said:

^ That looks awesome! It even matches the seat!

Haha, that’s my wife’s doing. Old trousers getting a second life. 

OilCityPickups

Yorkie said:

Dave_Mc said:

^ That looks awesome! It even matches the seat!

Haha, that’s my wife’s doing. Old trousers getting a second life. 

What a brilliant idea! 

Yorkie

Oh, by the way, the slug repellent copper tape I got from The Range works great! No issues with continuity.

ICBM

Yorkie said:

Oh, by the way, the slug repellent copper tape I got from The Range works great! No issues with continuity.

Did you spot-solder across the joins?

Yorkie

No, I tested for continuity and it behaved exactly like my Axetec-bought tape. 

ICBM

Yorkie said:

No, I tested for continuity and it behaved exactly like my Axetec-bought tape. 

You might find that over time as the surfaces corrode slightly that it stops working as well - I've come across that quite often in old shielded guitars. It's not a very big job just to spot-solder it later if it ever becomes an issue though.