Doing a music degree in retirement

Axe_meister

What are your thoughts on doing a music degree after retiring.
Am planning to retire in 8 years time at 62 years old. Now the kids are no longer with us we are looking to move out of the big smoke with Brighton area being a potential area on interest. Quite artsie (wife is an artist) good live music scene.
I then realised there is a BIMM school in Brighton. So a light bulb went off. Why not do a music degree at BIMM?
Would I feel out of place being an old fuck?
Could it lead to a nice part time job, teaching and/or local gigs for a bit of additional income?

Lestratcaster

I'm not retired but I went ACM in 2007-2011 which is the sister school of BIMM and came out with a degree in music performance. I'm a private tutor now and some of the stuff I learnt it key to where I am now, but I will say I grew in the years after cos I was applying the knowledge I gained on the course. Not many if any learners give a shit that I have the degree, as the first thing they'll always want to know is how much I charge instead of teaching background, qualifications and experience.

 It wasn't til 4-5 years later where I really started to improve, my accuracy in transcribing and stuff etc. I was a little bit older than the age group of around 18-21 years old, there were a couple of people the same age as me so it wasn't too bad. If its what you want to do just go for it, I wouldn't let something like feeling out of place stop you.

ToneControl

I wanted to do it, then realised how expensive it would be, and how far I'd need to travel

theatreanchor

Just do it. 

Grampa

Would love to do something like that but have never been so busy in my life since retiring last year. Either spending 8hrs a day working on the house or garden come rain or shine, or away doing all the things we never managed to do when work/kids were our main priorities. Too bloody knackered for anything more than a bit of guitar practice in the evening.

tony99

It may well be your field of interest, it may well be your passion, for all I know music may have been your job for most of your career. Either way, a degree is a degree and shouldn't be undertaken lightly; it will be a lot of hard work.

That said, it'd definitely be very rewarding I'm sure. Nothing wrong with study at a later age. I was a mature student and had a great time, all of my cohort were sound too.

Dominic

What about Orchid keeping 

Kittyfrisk

If you want to do it, then do it sooner rather than later while the newer universities are still with us... 

octatonic

Axe_meister said:

What are your thoughts on doing a music degree after retiring.
Am planning to retire in 8 years time at 62 years old. Now the kids are no longer with us we are looking to move out of the big smoke with Brighton area being a potential area on interest. Quite artsie (wife is an artist) good live music scene.
I then realised there is a BIMM school in Brighton. So a light bulb went off. Why not do a music degree at BIMM?
Would I feel out of place being an old fuck?
Could it lead to a nice part time job, teaching and/or local gigs for a bit of additional income?

Hard to say if you will feel out of place.

You will be studying with 18-25 year olds and a few older people.
When I did my M.Mus. in Composition I was the oldest (48) in my year by over a decade and that was post-grad.

BIMM and similar are good courses, I know many of the people teaching them but private tuition is generally better in terms of overhauling your playing. In a B.Mus. you will do a lot of things like songwriting, history of music, music tech, reading music. They are 'generalist' by design.

When I did a B.Mus. at 36 I already had 18 years or so of professional playing experience and I could have taught half the classes, esp music tech where I had more experience than the person teaching me, which was weird. It was definitely noticeable that I was different to the other students but that can be an advantage. I didn't have to study for half the classes and could spend time working on things that mattered to me. I'm friends with most of the lecturers from those days and did some work after the degree with a few.

In terms of getting you teaching work, teaching music is not great pay and whilst enjoyable it can be a pain in the ass. 
Musicians Union minimum rate for 2024 is £40.50 an hour but some places don't even pay that.
Because of my review work I am able to charge £60 an hour but I teach way less than I used to (which suits me just fine).

In terms of gigs as income, it won't help at all.
Go and learn a shitload of songs to a high level, put together a band or a duo and get gigging.
Weddings pay the most.
Or corporate functions.
Music school won't help there.

I'm not down on education- I've done 3 degrees now and researching my Ph.D. at the moment.
They are great but be realistic about what you will get out of it.

Axe_meister

I'm already taking guitar and singing lessons so by then I hope to be of a good standard )have been playing since 1987.
My retirement income should pretty good anyway. So it would be more about achievement and potentially just pocket money income. Would I be shunned by younger students? Or end up playing with the teachers bands.
Just something to do to keep my mind active in early retirement.

swiller

sure you can get to standard without having to spend on a certificate, esp in todays online world. The certificate wont mean jack shit in comparison to reputation if trying to tutor or gigs as a part time income. You will still have to build a rep even with certificate if £ is the objective. I would start with learning some grade 5-8 classical guitar pieces. lobos is a good start. You may be there already, in which case why bother with an expensive  certificate? There will be things in music degree that may not suit your objectives

TTony

theatreanchor said:

Just do it. 

JFDI

If it’s something you want to do, something you think you’d enjoy, JFDI.  Doesn’t matter how old (young) other students are, any more than it matters what sex they are, what colour their hair is, or whether they prefer coffee or orange juice in the morning.

And I’m slightly envious that you have created that opportunity for yourself!

p90fool

I wouldn't worry about being shunned by younger students as long as you don't try and pretend to be young (which I'm sure you wouldn't). In fact I relish being the old fart in the room, it keeps things honest. 

I'm 59 and work a lot with students and they're great, really good for keeping you in touch and alert. 
Some have become genuine friends who always visit me at home when they're back from uni, and I'm even going in holiday with the parents of two of them in July. 

So yeah, I think it's a great idea, whatever you intend to do with the course itself. 

DavidR

Go for it.

Music was one of the things that kept me sane(ish) throughout my working life. When I retired I bought a good classical, taught myself to read standard notation, took lessons for the first time and joined a local classical ensemble. As a self-taught acoustic player since my youth, I really enjoyed the new direction. I never did quite manage to master the classical (you need to start young I think) but it was all very good fun and helped me to adjust to not working.

I also started to record stuff and post it on the web. Now my music can be listened to by anyone! (although, sensibly, not many people do!)

So proceed. No question. We had a spectrum of ranges in our ensemble, including teenagers. Everyone got on very well. Musicians are a nice bunch as a rule.

Maybe don't think of it too much with your work brain in. Have Fun.

:-)

guitars4you

Go for it - good on yeah

Teyeplayer

I did an OU degree in my early 30s, which despite being open to all ages instantly placed me in a slightly older section of the class. One of the ladies on my course was in retirement and in her words ‘collected degrees’ in retirement -she was on her fourth one iirc. It kept her alert and mentally active, she was awesome and we all adored her. I can’t think of a better way to spend retirement and stave of the cognitive slow down I am currently witnessing in my parents which seemed to happen very quickly once mum retired. I guess what I am saying in a very round about way is: do it. Don’t question fitting in and expectations -if you want that qualification and mental challenge, go and get it!  

Edit: I presume you know the area well, but I’d be looking at Lewes if I was in a position to move back down that way.  

AntonHunter

Go to an open day, get a feel for the place.

BIMM also run masters courses* and if you've got a decent undergraduate degree, regardless of specialism, and can put a portfolio together that shows a good level of playing that might be an option?

*declaration of interest: I run the MA at BIMM in Manchester. Ask me things if you like!

Jason

If you want to chat about a BA at BIMM let me know. I was a Course Leader until last academic year. Still lecture for BIMM Brum.

I’m sure Anton or I can help. 

Greatape

Stretch that grey matter, definitely. Whichever way you jump. 

YOLO, right? 

octatonic

Axe_meister said:

Would I be shunned by younger students? Or end up playing with the teachers bands.

You probably won't be shunned for simply being older.
We had one guy on the BMus who was slightly older than me who *was* shunned but that was because he was a dick.

One trick with an institution like BIMM- don't hang around with the other guitarists.
Speak to singers, drummers, bassists.

Also, you will have to be ok with the notion that many of the younger ones will progress faster than you.
In some areas you will probably have to work harder to achieve the same result, that is simply down to how brains age.
Most likely you will want to though, at least I did.

I found the sight reading the most difficult- there just wasn't enough thinking time for me to get it and if I'd spent all my time on sight reading then I didn't have time for anything else.
A degree like this is more about time management than anything else.
Anything you do is at the cost of something else.

If BIMM is anything like ICMP then you'll have to learn a couple of pieces a week to perform in front of the class in groups and you won't have a chance to practice as a group before hand.
You'll also have to learn a load of drop chords and get them smooth, plus loads of scales, played in 3rds, 4ths, etc.
You'll have to learn a couple of difficult pieces- in my first year we had the head to Donna Lee, at 200bpm at a minimum.
Second year was 'Flight of the Bumblebee'.
3rd year is mostly working on your major project- a lot of written work and working on your performance pieces.
They structured things by weeks, starting at the blues and going through different styles, reggae, funk, country, rock, metal etc.

There isn't enough time to dedicate to nail every style and most students who go to music school end up playing back in their *home genres* within a couple of years of finishing the degree. It is pretty rare to start as a metal player and end up as a jazzer.

There is also a lot of 'university requirement' stuff that some students do somewhat begrudgingly.
Keeping journals, assessing your playing, essays and other submissions.
This is a university degree and these requirements are just necessary to certify the degree.
I found it an easy way to get my overall mark a lot higher than it would just by playing.

This is why I say that targeted private lessons are more effective if you have the work ethic.
Most people don't though so a great aspect of the B.Mus, is the need to complete loads of things to a deadline, otherwise you fail. When taking private lessons there are no deadlines unless you set them yourself and those end up being a lot more elastic.

My take aways from it was getting my sight reading to a decent level, some technique things and ear training/transcription skills.
But a lot of the work that came from that actually came from the time I spent working on them after the degree.

So definitely do the degree if you want to but it is how you apply it in the successive years after you complete your degree that will have the most impact on your playing.

Roland

When I retired I considered doing a music degree. The main thing which put me off was that I wasn’t prepared to put in the time and effort which a degree needed. Having worked flat out for decades I wanted to spend more time on music, but also in the workshop, travelling, gardening, and being with my family. When it came to allocating time I decided that music would get three things: learning and arranging new material and techniques needed for my band, learning solo acoustic guitar pieces, and participating in this forum. Honestly, I often struggle to achieve those three.