Blackstar enters the trough of disillusionment

Dave_Mc

jpfamps said:

I had a look at the Rivera web site and phrases such as "all tube" and "pure tube" are absent from the blurb for the Pubster.

http://www.rivera.com/index.php/products/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=206

Regardless just because other companies use "questionable" advertising does not justify you doing it.

Agreed. And you could (at least arguably) make a case that Blackstar took it one step further, with those "pure tube" etc. claims you mentioned. Probably not much to pick between BS and H&K, though.

Reverend

I've used a couple of BS heads at a rehearsal room and find that the 100w head is far too quite to use in a band situation. It's as bad as a modern Marshall or Orange.
I think I've been spoilt with 10 years of Marshall JMP 2203 

ICBM

Reverend said:

I've used a couple of BS heads at a rehearsal room and find that the 100w head is far too quite to use in a band situation. It's as bad as a modern Marshall or Orange.
I think I've been spoilt with 10 years of Marshall JMP 2203 

I think it's quite likely you're partly deaf if you've been standing in front of a 2203 turned up full for ten years .

Was that a Blackstar Series One 100? If so, did you make sure the power control was up full? It's a genuine 'power scaling' type control. I wouldn't say it's a particularly quiet amp - not as frighteningly loud as a 2203 on full... but very little is!

Reverend

ICBM said:

Reverend said:

I've used a couple of BS heads at a rehearsal room and find that the 100w head is far too quite to use in a band situation. It's as bad as a modern Marshall or Orange.
I think I've been spoilt with 10 years of Marshall JMP 2203 

I think it's quite likely you're partly deaf if you've been standing in front of a 2203 turned up full for ten years .

Was that a Blackstar Series One 100? If so, did you make sure the power control was up full? It's a genuine 'power scaling' type control. I wouldn't say it's a particularly quiet amp - not as frighteningly loud as a 2203 on full... but very little is!

I generally find I don;t get to turn the 2203 up much beyond 3 - not that that means anything in particular but I never really have to crank it.

I do wear ear plugs as well, but I found the 100 ( and yes I think it was the series one) had to be turned up pretty high to cope with a drummer and ampeg stack.

ICBM

I think part of the problem is that the Marshall reaches full power much earlier on the controls - certainly no later than 6 on the MV once the preamp is into distortion, and possibly below halfway - whereas the Blackstar is more 'linear' (ie in some ways more "properly designed") so you have to turn the controls up further to reach the same proportion of full power. I found it a quite refined-sounding and un-dynamic amp even accounting for that - but it seemed loud enough when turned up.

I've never tried one with a loud band so it wouldn't surprise me if that tends to make it get lost in the mix though - I know exactly what you mean about a lot of modern Oranges doing that too, they're too thick and muddy. (Honourable exception to the Rocker 30, but it's just not *that* loud an amp anyway.) Modern Marshalls are almost the opposite - they just tend to sound thin and lack guts.

I still think the 2203 is the greatest amp Marshall ever made - even more than the Plexi. The single best one I ever heard was a '76 with the original small-logo styling. To me they are the absolute definition of the sound of rock.

Reverend

ICBM said:

I think part of the problem is that the Marshall reaches full power much earlier on the controls - certainly no later than 6 on the MV once the preamp is into distortion, and possibly below halfway - whereas the Blackstar is more 'linear' (ie in some ways more "properly designed") so you have to turn the controls up further to reach the same proportion of full power. I found it a quite refined-sounding and un-dynamic amp even accounting for that - but it seemed loud enough when turned up.

I've never tried one with a loud band so it wouldn't surprise me if that tends to make it get lost in the mix though - I know exactly what you mean about a lot of modern Oranges doing that too, they're too thick and muddy. (Honourable exception to the Rocker 30, but it's just not *that* loud an amp anyway.) Modern Marshalls are almost the opposite - they just tend to sound thin and lack guts.

I still think the 2203 is the greatest amp Marshall ever made - even more than the Plexi. The single best one I ever heard was a '76 with the original small-logo styling. To me they are the absolute definition of the sound of rock.

I have a '77 and a '78, as well as a '78 Superbass.

I had always thought Marshall amps were fizzy until I saw Master of Reality. Chris Goss got a fantastic sound with his, and then I went out on tour crewing for Bill Steer and the sound he got out of a JTM 45 convinced me to give them another go. Once I got a 2203 I sold my 5150 as he felt quieter and much less defined in comparison.

The Blackstars I have tried very much remind me of using DSL and JCM900 Marshalls - sort of sound right but just not quite cutting the mustard.