20w 6505+ finally!

ICBM

ThePrettyDamned said:

I've no idea what it is, but even on low power, big valve amps, you can hear they're not 6v6 or el84. The orange rocker 30 was the odd one - I didn't understand how an el84 amp could sound so great, until I realised it was el34.

The Jim root terror is the best I've heard so far, but even that didn't hold a candle to a rockerverb, despite having a very similar preamp.

It's more down to the way the circuit is conventionally designed for the valve type than the valve type itself, if that makes sense! And that big-valve amps are generally bigger in other ways too, ie transformers.

My Trem-o-verb is currently fitted with 6V6s, and although it does sound more compressed when it's turned up a bit, it doesn't sound any more like (say) a Tweed Deluxe than it did with 6L6s really.

The Rockerverb Mk1 is also a 4x6V6 amp, strangely. But I think the reason it sounds so different from the Rocker 30 is more to do with the biasing and the preamp design than the power valves - the Mk2 is 2xEL34 and still sounds like a Rockerverb, not like a Rocker.

ThePrettyDamned

ICBM;488216" said:

ThePrettyDamned said:

I've no idea what it is, but even on low power, big valve amps, you can hear they're not 6v6 or el84. The orange rocker 30 was the odd one - I didn't understand how an el84 amp could sound so great, until I realised it was el34.



The Jim root terror is the best I've heard so far, but even that didn't hold a candle to a rockerverb, despite having a very similar preamp.





It's more down to the way the circuit is conventionally designed for the valve type than the valve type itself, if that makes sense! And that big-valve amps are generally bigger in other ways too, ie transformers.

My Trem-o-verb is currently fitted with 6V6s, and although it does sound more compressed when it's turned up a bit, it doesn't sound any more like (say) a Tweed Deluxe than it did with 6L6s really.

The Rockerverb Mk1 is also a 4x6V6 amp, strangely. But I think the reason it sounds so different from the Rocker 30 is more to do with the biasing and the preamp design than the power valves - the Mk2 is 2xEL34 and still sounds like a Rockerverb, not like a Rocker.

Yeah, I can easily believe all that.

It just makes me think this would have been better as a 30 watt, 2x6l6 or el34 head. Regardless of what causes the difference (I switched from el34 to 6l6 and back in my old Laney and it sounded near enough identical, it didn't suddenly sound more American, despite having a fender voiced clean channel!) it would be a more useful amp anyway - good for home practice, rehearsal and gigging, possibly.

ICBM

ThePrettyDamned said:

It just makes me think this would have been better as a 30 watt, 2x6l6 or el34 head. Regardless of what causes the difference (I switched from el34 to 6l6 and back in my old Laney and it sounded near enough identical, it didn't suddenly sound more American, despite having a fender voiced clean channel!) it would be a more useful amp anyway - good for home practice, rehearsal and gigging, possibly.

They won't want to use the big valves if they're not needed for the target power output because they, the sockets, and the transformers (they draw more filament current, so the transformer has to be slightly bigger) are all more expensive. It is very fine margins but every bit counts when you're designing a mid-priced amp like this.

I'm pretty sure 4xEL84 is marginally cheaper to implement than 2xEL34/6L6 in the 30-40W region as well, even though there are twice as many valves - which is why it's standard and EL34s or 6L6s are rare below 50W. Even the Peavey Classic 50 is 4xEL84.

With something as small as a Mini Rectifier they probably couldn't get Octal valves in physically anyway - not sure about the Peaveys.