Jazz Stuff (the thread formerly known as "Just ordered some jazz guitar books...")

Megii

Love that "the lick" video - quite funny when Guthrie pops up towards the end. Also the classical example - anyone know what piece that's from btw?

Been thinking about the learning style question @Branshen , and I think for me it's always a case of the notes under my fingers first, and also the sound of them into my head, at least to some extent, before then learning ways to use them - which is where some kind of theory might come in I guess. I have sometimes caught myself doing something interesting from a theory point of view, without actually knowing what that thing is - that might be using a lick transposed up or down over a certain chord, for example. I think if you hear something strongly, you can usually play it, even if it's not part of your normal bag of tricks, and... if you can't hear it, then you can't play it.

Blueingreen

Somewhat agree about the Green techniques book.  I have an idea if you put in the time it'd make you a better player, but given the time input it's a bit of a leap of faith.  

I suspect his comping book OTOH is probably a very good advanced book, but there are better comping books for beginning to intermediate jazzers.  I plan to turn my attention to the comping book once I feel I have the material in the DeLillo/Galbraith books properly under my fingers.

Branshen

Do you guys use extended arpeggios? I've just started the groundwork, and look forward to practising it soon.

http://mattwarnockguitar.com/how-to-learn-extended-arpeggios-for-jazz-guitar

Megii

Branshen said:

Do you guys use extended arpeggios? I've just started the groundwork, and look forward to practising it soon.

http://mattwarnockguitar.com/how-to-learn-extended-arpeggios-for-jazz-guitar

I guess I do, when I think about it. Major 9th arps for one thing, and if playing over a minor chord you can go all the way up to a minor 13th arpeggio. It's really just adding a few extra notes to a one octave 7th arp shape, so if you know your 7th arpeggios, it's not really a lot extra to learn. When using the melodic minor (aka jazz minor) scale, and it modes, I like to use a minor 9th with major 7th arpeggio (not sure what the correct term for that is) but it's a 9th arp based on the root of the scale. That yields good sounds, pretty much whichever mode or chord type one is using the melodic minor for - probably not explaining that very well, sorry. Emily Remler talks about it a bit in her videos re dominant 7th chords, and it also works in other situations too.

Branshen

Thanks for the reply @Megii. I'll widdle about on my guitar when I have time and report back.

Megii

Blueingreen said:

Somewhat agree about the Green techniques book.  I have an idea if you put in the time it'd make you a better player, but given the time input it's a bit of a leap of faith.  

I suspect his comping book OTOH is probably a very good advanced book, but there are better comping books for beginning to intermediate jazzers.  I plan to turn my attention to the comping book once I feel I have the material in the DeLillo/Galbraith books properly under my fingers.

I think you might get something from the Green comping book actually, but I'll have to check out the DeLillo and Galbraith ones myself. I do think with any series of books, one has to kind of "buy into" the thinking and approach of the author - and I guess I'm not sure Andrew Green's way of doing things really suits me. But even if it's not for me, I hope I can at least still find useful things in the books.

Megii

Branshen said:

Thanks for the reply @Megii. I'll widdle about on my guitar when I have time and report back.

I'm sure Matt Warnock explains things better than I could, and is more qualified to do so, so ignore me and do what he says I reckon! But also check out the Emily Remler videos re the melodic minor 9th arpeggio thing - I think thats in this one IIRC:

hobbio

@Megii That book didn't show up mate, they've refunded me today. It was worth a try though! Obviously this means I won't be able to send it on to you, sorry

Megii

hobbio said:

@Megii That book didn't show up mate, they've refunded me today. It was worth a try though! Obviously this means I won't be able to send it on to you, sorry

No worries! I can still bung some photocopies of the Dave Cliff notes in the post if you like?

Jalapeno

Branshen said:

Do you guys use extended arpeggios? I've just started the groundwork, and look forward to practising it soon.

To the 9th, yes, regularly - but they need work to worm into your muscle memory & ear.  Practice starting on the 1/3/5/7/9 respectively.

Up the Arpeggio & Down the Scale and vice versa are very common devices you hear a lot.

Blueingreen

Megii said:

Blueingreen said:

Somewhat agree about the Green techniques book.  I have an idea if you put in the time it'd make you a better player, but given the time input it's a bit of a leap of faith.  

I suspect his comping book OTOH is probably a very good advanced book, but there are better comping books for beginning to intermediate jazzers.  I plan to turn my attention to the comping book once I feel I have the material in the DeLillo/Galbraith books properly under my fingers.

I think you might get something from the Green comping book actually, but I'll have to check out the DeLillo and Galbraith ones myself. I do think with any series of books, one has to kind of "buy into" the thinking and approach of the author - and I guess I'm not sure Andrew Green's way of doing things really suits me. But even if it's not for me, I hope I can at least still find useful things in the books.

I'd get the DeLillo first.  The Galbraith voicings are more musically interesting and a tad more advanced, but the DeLillo ones are easier to grab and IMO more useful in a real-life situation. especially if playing with a band (concentrates on top 4 strings).

Megii

Blueingreen said:

Megii said:

Blueingreen said:

Somewhat agree about the Green techniques book.  I have an idea if you put in the time it'd make you a better player, but given the time input it's a bit of a leap of faith.  

I suspect his comping book OTOH is probably a very good advanced book, but there are better comping books for beginning to intermediate jazzers.  I plan to turn my attention to the comping book once I feel I have the material in the DeLillo/Galbraith books properly under my fingers.

I think you might get something from the Green comping book actually, but I'll have to check out the DeLillo and Galbraith ones myself. I do think with any series of books, one has to kind of "buy into" the thinking and approach of the author - and I guess I'm not sure Andrew Green's way of doing things really suits me. But even if it's not for me, I hope I can at least still find useful things in the books.

I'd get the DeLillo first.  The Galbraith voicings are more musically interesting and a tad more advanced, but the DeLillo ones are easier to grab and IMO more useful in a real-life situation. especially if playing with a band (concentrates on top 4 strings).

Appreciate your thoughts on this, cheers - although knowing me, I'll probably end up with copies of both...

GuyBoden

I find transcribing complex chords from Jazz records a difficult, but worthwhile challenge. Major, Minor and Dom are easy enough, but hearing the correct extensions and different voicings is difficult for my ears.

Ears are everything.

GuyBoden

Megii said:

Branshen said:

Thanks for the reply @Megii. I'll widdle about on my guitar when I have time and report back.

I'm sure Matt Warnock explains things better than I could, and is more qualified to do so, so ignore me and do what he says I reckon! But also check out the Emily Remler videos re the melodic minor 9th arpeggio thing - I think thats in this one IIRC:

That takes me back, I had that Emily Remler Hot Licks video back in the 1990's, it had the classic play the Melodic minor from the 9th over altered doms licks. I loved the "Together" album she did with Larry Coryell in the 1980's, the How Insensitive track was superb. I think she was Larry Coryell's girlfriend.
Nice 

Megii

GuyBoden said:

Megii said:

Branshen said:

Thanks for the reply @Megii. I'll widdle about on my guitar when I have time and report back.

I'm sure Matt Warnock explains things better than I could, and is more qualified to do so, so ignore me and do what he says I reckon! But also check out the Emily Remler videos re the melodic minor 9th arpeggio thing - I think thats in this one IIRC:

That takes me back, I had that Emily Remler Hot Licks video back in the 1990's, it had the classic play the Melodic minor from the 9th over altered doms licks. I loved the "Together" album she did with Larry Coryell in the 1980's, the How Insensitive track was superb. I think she was Larry Coryell's girlfriend.
Nice 

Cheers for that @Guyboden - I also had (still have actually) both the ER videos - which I guess I would have got them in the early 90s - 1991 or 92 ish. I bought quite a few of her albums around that time as well - but sadly not the "Together" one. More recently I set about filling the blanks in my Remler album collection - Together was about the hardest one to come by, and people trying to sell copies for silly money online. However, a kind person on the jazzguitar.be forum copied his vinyl copy onto a CD and sent that to me (a few years ago) so I have been able to enjoy the music - it is a fantastic album I must say. As you say, they were in a relationship for a while, and shared a flat in New York I think.

Have you come across the www.allthingsemily.com website btw? I guess you may have already, but there's some brilliant stuff on there including recordings/notes of a whole series of lessons a chap took with her during the 90s. Also the "Unpublished" section has loads of live recordings of her to listen to - valuable stuff, since she sadly did not live long enough to record all that much.

Megii

GuyBoden said:

I find transcribing complex chords from Jazz records a difficult, but worthwhile challenge. Major, Minor and Dom are easy enough, but hearing the correct extensions and different voicings is difficult for my ears.

Ears are everything.

I suspect you're being modest re your own hearing ability, and must agree it's not at all easy to get chord stuff from records. I sometimes find it's a process of elimination for me - i.e. I just keep trying different possibilities, until I find one that sounds right - I can hear the upper note and the bass probably, and then it's a case of filling in the blanks. But indeed having a good ear matters, but I also firmly believe it's possible to make big improvements to hearing ability with practice and time.

Jalapeno

Here's an excellent interview with Johnny Smith

knuckleberryfinn

I like this Jimmy Rainey version of Billie's Bounce - very Charlie Parker-like.  The sound quality's not great, but worth a look for the close-up filming of his left hand.

Megii

That's a bloody great clip of JR in action, I love that - nice one @knuckleberryfinn

Branshen

Nice one jalapeño. JS has alot of knowledge. The tape warble threw me off abit until I realised it's a really old recording.