Jazz Stuff (the thread formerly known as "Just ordered some jazz guitar books...")

GuyBoden

Megii said:

GuyBoden said:

Roy Castle was right "Dedication’s what you need"

He so was! @GuyBoden - actually, I guess I am more dedicated in recent years than I was in my youth, wish I'd been a bit more focused then. But that's hindsight of course, ah well. Btw, you never followed up on the responses to that Led Bib track you posted - I'm just interested regarding your take on that stuff.

Yes, I like it, I agree the saxes can be a bit too much at times, I like hearing musicians doing their own thing. I've spent years playing Jazz standards, but recently I'm more into contemporary Jazz (whatever that is).

I do like this:

Megii

GuyBoden said:

Megii said:

GuyBoden said:

Roy Castle was right "Dedication’s what you need"

He so was! @GuyBoden - actually, I guess I am more dedicated in recent years than I was in my youth, wish I'd been a bit more focused then. But that's hindsight of course, ah well. Btw, you never followed up on the responses to that Led Bib track you posted - I'm just interested regarding your take on that stuff.

Yes, I like it, I agree the saxes can be a bit too much at times, I like hearing musicians doing their own thing. I've spent years playing Jazz standards, but recently I'm more into contemporary Jazz (whatever that is).

I do like this:

Yes - that's nice as well I agree, I can certainly listen to that as music - kind of ECM-ish, I've listened to other things in that vein quite a bit. Again, I doubt it would have all that much influence on my own playing, but there would have to be some. I've spent a few years concentrated on jazz standards myself, and I'm "reasonably competent"  with that stuff now, but still there is work to be done - you're maybe a bit ahead of me there. But I do love the whole thing with jazz standards anyway, so I intend to keep focused on that area for a while yet.

Jalapeno

Like the Wallenda's Last Stand vid =D>

I'd be happy being confident to solo over all standards, long way to go.

Megii

Jalapeno said:

Like the Wallenda's Last Stand vid =D>

I'd be happy being confident to solo over all standards, long way to go.

It's always a work in progress isn't it?

Roland

Jalapeno said:

Actually, probably buy any decent one, stick to it for 2 years and you probably would be pretty handy !  

 An American tourist asked how an Oxford college got a lawn to look so fine. "It's easy sir. Level the ground, sow the seed, then you cut and roll it for five or six hundred years"

Branshen

Jalapeno said:

Great discussion you've got going on here guys! Jazz has always been my first musical love. While people seem to think that I sound very "jazzy", I'm not anywhere near a level of proficiency I would be happy with. I'll keep up with the thread and contribute when I can.

Great "cheat sheet" Jalapeno! I understand it's meant to be humourous, but until I can do everything on it effortlessly, I can't laugh at it. Gotta work on my Chops and Coltrane Changes!

Megii

The cheat sheet is funny, and that has to at least partly be because there is an element of truth in it. I can relate to the bit re throwing in some bluesy stuff at the end - been there, done that... Also starting out with some (hopefully) tasteful melodic stuff... I too need to work on the double time chops and Coltrane changes @Branshen...

Branshen

Any of you guys are on the FB group "Jam of the week"? I'm working up the courage to post a vid this week's standard "Girl from Ipanema".

https://www.facebook.com/groups/jamoftheweekgroup/?fref=nf

Megii

Afraid I'm not on FB @Branshen. Girl from Ip is quite a good one to work on - I've heard people say it's a bit overdone and corny, but it still has an interesting chord sequence that moves around a fair bit, especially in that middle 8. Not one to underestimate!

Jalapeno

Branshen said:

Any of you guys are on the FB group "Jam of the week"? I'm working up the courage to post a vid this week's standard "Girl from Ipanema".

https://www.facebook.com/groups/jamoftheweekgroup/?fref=nf

Busy bee at the moment, hard to find any practice time.  Soon I hope.

Branshen

This week's tune is a standard standard, but there are lotsa other non standard standards. I remember they had "in walked bud" a fee weeks ago.

Megii I don't think you have to be on fb to watch the vids. It might even encourage you to join just for this. It's great inspiration!

GuyBoden

Some people make a big deal of Jazz, but learning a Jazz Standard is no different than learning other styles of songs.

1.) Listen to the song repeatedly. (It's good to sing along, to get it into your ears.)
2.) Learn the chords. (It's good to sing along, to get it into your ears.)
3.) Learn the melody. (It's good to sing along, to get it into your ears.)
4.) Learn the improvised solo. (It's good to sing along, to get it into your ears.)
5.) Play along with the record. Repeatedly with chords, melody and improv solo.

After doing all that you'll be able to play the chords, melody and play a similar improvised solo.

You could, if you're inclined, apply a bit of theory, analyse the chord progression's functionality, the note choices in the Melody and improvised solo, so you can apply these findings to other Jazz Standards.

This takes time, but it's not difficult.

Megii

@GuyBoden - so, re learning of an improvised solo, I guess you'd just pick one you liked, and learn that? No question that 1, 2 and 3 are very necessary, but I'm liking that you put 4 & 5 in there as well. Have to admit I haven't often learn't someone else's full improved solo, and maybe I sometimes jump into analysing the chord progression and stuff like that a bit too soon - that can be useful, but it's not everything. Nice post anyhow!

Jalapeno

I transcribed first 64 bars of Miles Davis' So What solo from Kind of Blue for the last face-to-face teacher I had (think he got bored of it before I did)

Still got the Sibelius sheets somewhere

GuyBoden

Megii said:

@GuyBoden - so, re learning of an improvised solo, I guess you'd just pick one you liked, and learn that? No question that 1, 2 and 3 are very necessary, but I'm liking that you put 4 & 5 in there as well. Have to admit I haven't often learn't someone else's full improved solo, and maybe I sometimes jump into analysing the chord progression and stuff like that a bit too soon - that can be useful, but it's not everything. Nice post anyhow!

By learning improv solos from the records you get the actual Jazz language, it's similar to learning Blues solos from BB King records to get that Blues feel/language.

Once you have learned the basic minor and Major functional harmony, applying music theory to analyse Jazz Standards is easy enough, but copying Jazz improv solos from the records note for note takes a lot of time and patience.

Megii

GuyBoden said:

Megii said:

@GuyBoden - so, re learning of an improvised solo, I guess you'd just pick one you liked, and learn that? No question that 1, 2 and 3 are very necessary, but I'm liking that you put 4 & 5 in there as well. Have to admit I haven't often learn't someone else's full improved solo, and maybe I sometimes jump into analysing the chord progression and stuff like that a bit too soon - that can be useful, but it's not everything. Nice post anyhow!

By learning improv solos from the records you get the actual Jazz language, it's similar to learning Blues solos from BB King records to get that Blues feel/language.

Once you have learned the basic minor and Major functional harmony, applying music theory to analyse Jazz Standards is easy enough, but copying Jazz improv solos from the records note for note takes a lot of time and patience.

100 wisdoms for you @GuyBoden!

GuyBoden

Jalapeno said:

I transcribed first 64 bars of Miles Davis' So What solo from Kind of Blue for the last face-to-face teacher I had (think he got bored of it before I did)

Still got the Sibelius sheets somewhere

I don't want to sound negative, but the process of copying the solos yourself from recordings is the key to success, you won't get it from reading a transcription sheet by someone else. IMHO, this is why transcription books fail.

Branshen

Thanks guyboden. Great advice.

knuckleberryfinn

GuyBoden said:

Jalapeno said:

I transcribed first 64 bars of Miles Davis' So What solo from Kind of Blue for the last face-to-face teacher I had (think he got bored of it before I did)

Still got the Sibelius sheets somewhere

I don't want to sound negative, but the process of copying the solos yourself from recordings is the key to success, you won't get it from reading a transcription sheet by someone else. IMHO, this is why transcription books fail.

I agree with this completely.  I think it's especially useful to transcribe non-guitar solos (sax, trumpet, etc) - you never worry about whether you are in the right position on the fretboard because there's no such thing.  I've been transcribing the main melody to Miles Davis' Move, and also working (very slowly) from the stave notation to Body and Soul trying to work out a half-decent chord melody.  Yes, it's very time consuming, but you really get to know how the song works harmonically.  

viz

I must say I love a bit of jazz. Spent some time this morning playing around with the coltrane matrix and various similar substitutions. Very nice.