North Korea's nuclear weapons programme

Emp_Fab

Just saw that they've tested another.  You know, it's only a matter of time before they get it right and manage to make an ICMB that is a real threat.  The laughing at the little fat man will no longer be funny.  
 
It's also a possibility, though unlikely, that shredded-wheat-maniac might get into the Oval Office.
Now that's a terrifying combination - two men with tiny brains, huge egos and nuclear weapons.

Sporky

Also they both have weird hair.

Maybe they'll end up BFFs.

Drew_TNBD

<misogynist mode>

Statistically throughout European history, queens waged more wars than kings.

</misogynist mode>

lloyd

I think we (the West) will go in and destroy the country before they ever get to that kind of capability to be honest.

It needs to happen now really, it's disgusting the way their people are living their lives.

RocknRollDave

lloyd said:

I think we (the West) will go in and destroy the country before they ever get to that kind of capability to be honest.

It needs to happen now really, it's disgusting the way their people are living their lives.

Well, it is a policy that has worked so well in the Middle East, why not, eh...?

lloyd

RocknRollDave said:

lloyd said:

I think we (the West) will go in and destroy the country before they ever get to that kind of capability to be honest.

It needs to happen now really, it's disgusting the way their people are living their lives.

Well, it is a policy that has worked so well in the Middle East, why not, eh...?

I think the opportunity to rebuild, even from a desperately low base is something that I'd want as a North Korean citizen for myself, or if I died, my family.

How they're living now is fucking horrendous and not comparable to how things have been in various countries in the middle east, they also don't have a system of religion that intertwines with daily life, it's more comparable to Cambodia under the Khmer Rouge rather than the Middle East.

xSkarloey

Little Kimmy boy is a fan of Eric Clapton and Phil Collins apparently. 

I honestly think we should send them over to play a peace and goodwill concert (and make sure the roadcrew consists of Mi6 spies to have a good shufti round...)

Sporky

Skarloey said:

Little Kimmy boy is a fan of Eric Clapton and Phil Collins apparently. 

I honestly think we should send them over [snip]

...in the hope that he keeps them?

axisus

China are their big protectors. They have expressed displeasure over this, but you never quite know if they mean it. The West certainly can't go in and stomp on NK though.

ICBM

lloyd said:

I think the Chinese will go in and take over the country before they ever get to that kind of capability to be honest.

It needs to happen now really, it's disgusting the way their people are living their lives.

Corrected.

China won't tolerate any real threat of war - it would be right on their doorstep and it would severely disrupt their economy and plans for regional control.

China uses North Korea like an aggressive pitbull - they like it barking at the West (and especially Japan) and making everyone nervous, but the minute it actually tries to bite someone in a way that could come back on them it will get a beating.

They won't do anything unless they have to though. They don't want the North Koreans as economic refugees in China.

lloyd

axisus said:

China are their big protectors. They have expressed displeasure over this, but you never quite know if they mean it. The West certainly can't go in and stomp on NK though.

I doubt that, China rely on exporting to us nearly as much as we rely on the goods, if it comes down to a choice between keeping the trade relations with the West sweet and nuking KJU then there's only one winner.

I reckon ICBM probably has it closer to my post, but whatever happens, no one wants or will tolerate NK getting too big for their boots on an international scale, they're too small to be a real threat militarily but they could have huge consequences financially to many big players. 

Anyone in Britain or anywhere else apart from virtually next door to NK actually concerned about what they might do militarily is way off point, there's too much money at stake.

Mkjackary

Only way that would happen is if the west made an agreement with Russia and China. Otherwise we would be attacking and invading their allies and could start a new cold war.

And chances of that happening right now are nil, we can't be vitching to Russia one minute in regards to Ukraine and the annexation of Crimea, then going to war together the next minute.

hugbot

lloyd said:

I think we (the West) will go in and destroy the country before they ever get to that kind of capability to be honest.

It needs to happen now really, it's disgusting the way their people are living their lives.

As soon as war started NK would bomb Seoul to rubble. NK also have a massive army, which although other powers would beat it in terms of firepower and ability it would be a massive bloodbath as the reigime would have no problem conscripting more civilians to just throw into the grinder - the last korean war killed 3 million people. 

Then when you actually beat down NK to the point they decide they've got nothing left to lose...well, they've got nukes.

CHRISB50

hugbot said:

lloyd said:

I think we (the West) will go in and destroy the country before they ever get to that kind of capability to be honest.

It needs to happen now really, it's disgusting the way their people are living their lives.

As soon as war started NK would bomb Seoul to rubble. NK also have a massive army, which although other powers would beat it in terms of firepower and ability it would be a massive bloodbath as the reigime would have no problem conscripting more civilians to just throw into the grinder - the last korean war killed 3 million people. 

Then when you actually beat down NK to the point they decide they've got nothing left to lose...well, they've got nukes.

I was in Seoul 3 years ago and it's weird seeing nuclear shelter signs all over the place, pointing down into the subways. 

It's a bit bizarre that the DMZ is a tourist attraction in the South. I didn't bother going but you can go and see the tunnels, look through telescopes at the North, and listen to the HUGE loudspeakers they have set up. Pumping out propaganda. 

lloyd

hugbot said:

lloyd said:

I think we (the West) will go in and destroy the country before they ever get to that kind of capability to be honest.

It needs to happen now really, it's disgusting the way their people are living their lives.

As soon as war started NK would bomb Seoul to rubble. NK also have a massive army, which although other powers would beat it in terms of firepower and ability it would be a massive bloodbath as the reigime would have no problem conscripting more civilians to just throw into the grinder - the last korean war killed 3 million people. 

Then when you actually beat down NK to the point they decide they've got nothing left to lose...well, they've got nukes.

Oh I'm not saying it would be pretty or without massive loss of life, but personally I think it should happen, why? Because if I'd been born there I'd want it to happen, not just for myself, but for everyone living there and those in the surrounding areas, it's a disgrace that it's continuing, but I understand why nobodies doing anything about it.

The point I'm trying to make is that if NK get close to having an ICBM nuclear warhead, then long before they were in a position to point it at the West, then the West (with China's blessing in this scenario) would go in guns blazing and take the fuckers out.

it's probably the only hope of any regime change in the next few years, eventually it will fall in on itself due to infighting/civilian unrest (unlikely)/general with power and a conscience/KJU upsetting the Chinese etc. But that could be a very long way off.

I'd rather risk death than live under them conditions and would welcome any Western invasion/strike.

I can only imagine the horrendous shit has been inflicted on those poor bastards, I think if it ever comes out it could well be more shocking than the Khmer Rouge accounts and Gulags.

Mkjackary

If there was ever a country that would actually use nukes it would be a country on the brink of defeat in a war with nothing to lose.

lloyd

Mkjackary said:

If there was ever a country that would actually use nukes it would be a country on the brink of defeat in a war with nothing to lose.

Or the USA in a war against a country refusing to accept defeat.

ICBM

lloyd said:

Or the USA in a war against a country refusing to accept defeat.

Debatable if the main reason was even that - the Japanese were within a few months of being starved into surrender anyway, and the US knew it. It was a warning to Stalin that the US had and would use nuclear weapons - they just didn't expect the Russians to get them so quickly afterwards.

Whatever happens with North Korea the Chinese *will* deal with it - they're setting themselves up as the new superpower for the 21st century, and they will not allow a tinpot dictator to disrupt that. The West threatening to intervene won't help and could easily be very dangerous - I'm sure Obama is well aware of that, and Clinton too. The danger is that Trump might not.

lloyd

ICBM said:

lloyd said:

Or the USA in a war against a country refusing to accept defeat.

Debatable if the main reason was even that - the Japanese were within a few months of being starved into surrender anyway, and the US knew it. It was a warning to Stalin that the US had and would use nuclear weapons - they just didn't expect the Russians to get them so quickly afterwards.

Whatever happens with North Korea the Chinese *will* deal with it - they're setting themselves up as the new superpower for the 21st century, and they will not allow a tinpot dictator to disrupt that. The West threatening to intervene won't help and could easily be very dangerous - I'm sure Obama is well aware of that, and Clinton too. The danger is that Trump might not.

The reasons are probably too numerous to mention, but drop it they (and I'm sure with our blessing) did. It certainly ended the conflict quicker and with much less loss of (Allied) life, the point was that they've been dropped in the past, and by "us".

I'm not sure Trump is as much of a clown as he is but yeah, again the point I'm trying to make is that there's nothing that the West really need to fear from NK, if they stick their head above the parapet too much and bark too loud then someone (Us or China) easily has the capability to shut them down way before any Western people are in a ny kind of danger.

sinbaadi

I think a civil uprising/revolution in N.Korea is more and more likely. 
It would be interesting to see what China and the West did in that scenario.

HAL9000

'What do you do with a problem like Korea?' - Julie Andrews