Thought process when soloing?

viz

^ I didn't actually! Must check him out more. 

sweepy

Fascinating thread, just one little fundamental technique that I find useful is to turn the guitar down and select a note without a conscious decision, in other words almost a meditative approach and then bring the volume up. This will make you realise just how much the alphabet of the fretboard really is under your fingers and how your thought processes can get in the way. Another classic mistake that guitarists make, they forget to breathe, forget listening to other guitarists, take time to understand a singers approach to a melody. I know it's not to everyone's taste but check out Jennifer Hollidays rendition of "I'm Telling You" from the Tony awards, imagine that that is one long solo, check out the dynamics, note choice  and space, this is what makes music imho.

Niallseroreilly

sweepy said:

Fascinating thread, just one little fundamental technique that I find useful is to turn the guitar down and select a note without a conscious decision, in other words almost a meditative approach and then bring the volume up. This will make you realise just how much the alphabet of the fretboard really is under your fingers and how your thought processes can get in the way. Another classic mistake that guitarists make, they forget to breathe, forget listening to other guitarists, take time to understand a singers approach to a melody. I know it's not to everyone's taste but check out Jennifer Hollidays rendition of "I'm Telling You" from the Tony awards, imagine that that is one long solo, check out the dynamics, note choice  and space, this is what makes music imho.

This sounds great. I really want to just forget about a thought process and play what my mind is playing.

Only problem is does anyone know any good practice drills to really develop this and does practicing scales and arpeggios actually hamper this development?

Barney

Niallseroreilly said:

sweepy said:

Fascinating thread, just one little fundamental technique that I find useful is to turn the guitar down and select a note without a conscious decision, in other words almost a meditative approach and then bring the volume up. This will make you realise just how much the alphabet of the fretboard really is under your fingers and how your thought processes can get in the way. Another classic mistake that guitarists make, they forget to breathe, forget listening to other guitarists, take time to understand a singers approach to a melody. I know it's not to everyone's taste but check out Jennifer Hollidays rendition of "I'm Telling You" from the Tony awards, imagine that that is one long solo, check out the dynamics, note choice  and space, this is what makes music imho.

This sounds great. I really want to just forget about a thought process and play what my mind is playing.

Only problem is does anyone know any good practice drills to really develop this and does practicing scales and arpeggios actually hamper this development?

I would practise a lot on one octave scales and see the arpeggios within the scales ...trying doing small melodies ..think about the music as you would talk using space ...thinking of the music as sentances alltering timings ect ..after a while you will know what each note sounds like under your fingers...
See what notes change for example from a maj7 to a Dom 7...i think the idea is to take small ideas and develop them .... 

viz

Niallseroreilly said:

sweepy said:

Fascinating thread, just one little fundamental technique that I find useful is to turn the guitar down and select a note without a conscious decision, in other words almost a meditative approach and then bring the volume up. This will make you realise just how much the alphabet of the fretboard really is under your fingers and how your thought processes can get in the way. Another classic mistake that guitarists make, they forget to breathe, forget listening to other guitarists, take time to understand a singers approach to a melody. I know it's not to everyone's taste but check out Jennifer Hollidays rendition of "I'm Telling You" from the Tony awards, imagine that that is one long solo, check out the dynamics, note choice  and space, this is what makes music imho.

This sounds great. I really want to just forget about a thought process and play what my mind is playing.

Only problem is does anyone know any good practice drills to really develop this and does practicing scales and arpeggios actually hamper this development?

It doesn't hamper your development - it increases your vocabulary and enables you to bring your creativity to life. But alone it's self-limiting. Creativity and technical knowledge / ability are a bit like ying and yang. You have to have something to say, and to be able to say it. Each feeds the other one. Creativity gives technique its soul; technique gives creativity its muscle. Nobody is born with both (or either); you have to exercise them both, and then you will find your artistry start to accelerate. So practice the arpeggios - they will do no harm - but don't forget also to be an artist - go for walks, put yourself in intense situations, experience pleasure, and suffer hardship, and try to bring those experiences to life in the tunes you hum to yourself. Then when you put the guitar round your neck you'll find your vocabulary helps you articulate your emotions. 

I know that all sounds pretentious, and I'm certainly not one to talk - I'm like zero on the scale and I'm jolly glad the facepalm button has gone - but it's true!

octatonic

Niallseroreilly said:

sweepy said:

Fascinating thread, just one little fundamental technique that I find useful is to turn the guitar down and select a note without a conscious decision, in other words almost a meditative approach and then bring the volume up. This will make you realise just how much the alphabet of the fretboard really is under your fingers and how your thought processes can get in the way. Another classic mistake that guitarists make, they forget to breathe, forget listening to other guitarists, take time to understand a singers approach to a melody. I know it's not to everyone's taste but check out Jennifer Hollidays rendition of "I'm Telling You" from the Tony awards, imagine that that is one long solo, check out the dynamics, note choice  and space, this is what makes music imho.

This sounds great. I really want to just forget about a thought process and play what my mind is playing.

Only problem is does anyone know any good practice drills to really develop this and does practicing scales and arpeggios actually hamper this development?

Right- let me categorically state that in the long term that knowing more musical vocabulary does not retard your ability to play fluently.
But the key here is 'in the long term'.

Imagine you learn a new word- on dictionary.com the word of the day is 'katzenjammer', so let's use that.
(It means distress or anguish).
Musicians who learn new musical phrases like to use them, often a lot more than is musically necessary.
So whilst you need to know the word, you also need to know when it is applicable in conversation, which admittedly is probably not going to be very often in the case of 'katzenjammer' unless you happen to be going to a 'Black Books' themed party.

It is normal and natural to go through a period where you are trying to jam all of your new found vocabulary into music all over the place.
It doesn't happen to everyone, but many people- and certainly it did with me.
Hopefully you calm down with it (I like to think that I did) and find a way to use it more skilfully.

But if you never learn it in the first place then you can't go through that stage, you'll stay a musician with a relatively limited vocabulary.
This might not be a problem, certainly there are loads of musicians who seem to make do with knowing a relatively small amount, but it greatly depends on genre.

If you want to be the next Bruce Springsteen/Kurt Cobain then perhaps you don't need to know it.
If you want to be the next Robben Ford/John Petrucci then you have to get your shit together and start taking it seriously.
If you want to play jazz/fusion and some styles of metal then you can't get away not knowing it- I've never seen anyone fake it convincingly.

It comes back to 'what sort of musician do you want to be'?
It does take years and years- but those years are going to pass anyway- I decided some time ago that I was going to spend it trying to really understand music.

Niallseroreilly

octatonic said:

Niallseroreilly said:

sweepy said:

Fascinating thread, just one little fundamental technique that I find useful is to turn the guitar down and select a note without a conscious decision, in other words almost a meditative approach and then bring the volume up. This will make you realise just how much the alphabet of the fretboard really is under your fingers and how your thought processes can get in the way. Another classic mistake that guitarists make, they forget to breathe, forget listening to other guitarists, take time to understand a singers approach to a melody. I know it's not to everyone's taste but check out Jennifer Hollidays rendition of "I'm Telling You" from the Tony awards, imagine that that is one long solo, check out the dynamics, note choice  and space, this is what makes music imho.

This sounds great. I really want to just forget about a thought process and play what my mind is playing.

Only problem is does anyone know any good practice drills to really develop this and does practicing scales and arpeggios actually hamper this development?

Right- let me categorically state that in the long term that knowing more musical vocabulary does not retard your ability to play fluently.
But the key here is 'in the long term'.

Imagine you learn a new word- on dictionary.com the word of the day is 'katzenjammer', so let's use that.
(It means distress or anguish).
Musicians who learn new musical phrases like to use them, often a lot more than is musically necessary.
So whilst you need to know the word, you also need to know when it is applicable in conversation, which admittedly is probably not going to be very often in the case of 'katzenjammer' unless you happen to be going to a 'Black Books' themed party.

It is normal and natural to go through a period where you are trying to jam all of your new found vocabulary into music all over the place.
It doesn't happen to everyone, but many people- and certainly it did with me.
Hopefully you calm down with it (I like to think that I did) and find a way to use it more skilfully.

But if you never learn it in the first place then you can't go through that stage, you'll stay a musician with a relatively limited vocabulary.
This might not be a problem, certainly there are loads of musicians who seem to make do with knowing a relatively small amount, but it greatly depends on genre.

If you want to be the next Bruce Springsteen/Kurt Cobain then perhaps you don't need to know it.
If you want to be the next Robben Ford/John Petrucci then you have to get your shit together and start taking it seriously.
If you want to play jazz/fusion and some styles of metal then you can't get away not knowing it- I've never seen anyone fake it convincingly.

It comes back to 'what sort of musician do you want to be'?
It does take years and years- but those years are going to pass anyway- I decided some time ago that I was going to spend it trying to really understand music.

This resonates a lot, very insightful thank you.

PolarityMan

Basically i play nonsesnse that has different dramatic rhythm changes then loads of massive bends and hope for the best.